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Old 12-23-2008, 04:29 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sv650_ck View Post
Got mine installed today. Only thing I might do different is move the rail forward ~1/4" or so. Had to leave the top washers off the back bolts because the bolts were right against the tub.
I did the same and forgot to mention that. IF, and I say IF, I make another run, I plan on moving the rear holes forward 1/2".
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Old 12-23-2008, 07:13 PM   #22
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I second that. I installed my passenger side first and couldn't get one of the bolts tightened at all. So when I put the drivers side on, I just slid the whole thing forward about 1/2". Much better.

I also completely agree with the impact. The car just feels solid now. Big bumps that used to make the car bounce all over the road now barely affect it. It feels a lot more confident going into corners too. Overall great buy!!
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Old 12-23-2008, 07:32 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saml01 View Post
What happens when water, and dirt gets trapped between the cars frame rail and the "frame rail" you put on?
Go to a bodyshop supply and purchase "metal bonding adhesive". Use the adhesive in addition to the bolts and you are home free!

This is used in the industry for joining unibody vehicle panels. The adhesive will give you additional strength and moisture protection.

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Old 12-23-2008, 10:05 PM   #24
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And you will tear the metal surrounding the rails before you break the bond in the adhesive.

This is not a good idea if you ever want to take the rails back off.
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Old 12-24-2008, 03:25 AM   #25
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I thought the new rail design was the one with triangle holes like the one I have. Saves weight and gives PLENTY of room for drainage.

My install was a fair bit more bullshitty. Had to crush my "frame rails" back into shape with a 50lb bench vice, laying on my back in the dirt. They were all flattened out and had a slight curve to them. Looks nice now though. I bought a flawed set of braces for a discount, they only had some long marks on them from what I guess is laser etching done on the FM logo. Looks like the laser went crazy and left a few long lines down them. They are under the car, so who cares. I also had to use short pieces of hose and zip ties to secure my hard lines. Just split the hose and zip tied them to the lines where they got close to bolts. I think FM also decided to go with shorter bolts on the newest models, since the ones they supplied for me were like 1'' too long.

Here are a few of my pictures if you guys dont mind. Might help someone. I moved my rearmost bolt a bit forward like sugested above ^







Fit was a bit tight. First bolt came through right at the... thing, cant think of what its called right now.



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Old 01-05-2009, 12:16 PM   #26
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Any thoughts on welding these on? My driver's side rail is pretty much destroyed, disfigured to the point that I'll be cutting some of it out to get the stiffener on.
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Old 01-05-2009, 12:43 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m2cupcar View Post
Any thoughts on welding these on? My driver's side rail is pretty much destroyed, disfigured to the point that I'll be cutting some of it out to get the stiffener on.




I've been thinking about doing the same, I might spot weld it then run beads backwards. I haven't had any "miata time" lately and haven't gotten a chance to do any work on anything. If anyone ends up doing this please share your welder settings and what wire you're using.
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Old 01-05-2009, 12:49 PM   #28
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And ideas for approaching it. I was thinking of leaving the ends open, but if you've got to grind off undercoating to weld it up, there wouldn't be any way to seal up the inner "seam" that runs next to the OE frame rail. That'd be major rust opportunity.

Maybe run the autobody adhesive/sealer on the inner bend since the weld bead will be on the outer edge. But will the sealer be up to resisting the weld heat? The flange area is fairly broad so it might stand a chance. Thoughts?
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Old 01-05-2009, 12:50 PM   #29
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Only thing I can see wrong with that is what happens if in the future, these get messed up? Youd pretty much have to cut them off with a torch. I cant see welding them on being much more effective than just bolting them. I guess it would be ok though.
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Old 01-05-2009, 12:58 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m2cupcar View Post
Any thoughts on welding these on? My driver's side rail is pretty much destroyed, disfigured to the point that I'll be cutting some of it out to get the stiffener on.
Maybe you can get away with further rail dismembering (squeezing, bending, cutting, whatever) to make the new rail reinforcements fit, and follow it up with stitch-welding the sills. It's hard to imagine anything you do will be worse than what you have now
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Old 01-05-2009, 12:58 PM   #31
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installed mine last week... man they are GREAT! Car REALLY does feel like new! Seems to be sharper turn in, much more confident in cornering (flatter?) and lots of rattles have disappeared!
Picasa Web Albums - Stevo11 - Frame rails

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Old 01-05-2009, 01:01 PM   #32
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Well what in the hell did I get!? Every picture Ive seen of recent installs show solid rails, I thought they went to the triangle cut out version like mine a few posts up, several months ago? Wasnt the solid version an older piece?
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:04 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NA6C-Guy View Post
Well what in the hell did I get!? Every picture Ive seen of recent installs show solid rails, I thought they went to the triangle cut out version like mine a few posts up, several months ago? Wasnt the solid version an older piece?




This thread may save some confusion.


http://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t28768/
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:04 PM   #34
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Was this like a group sale I missed or something? Its nice to know that Im not the only one with damaged rails.


Edit: ^^one post up and I missed it, damn me.
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:05 PM   #35
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Ooooh. I remember seeing that but didnt know it happened. I see now.
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:31 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NA6C-Guy View Post
...I cant see welding them on being much more effective than just bolting them.
Race car fabrication would say you're wrong. But it will be more work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanta93LE View Post
...and follow it up with stitch-welding the sills.
I may do that. Bolt it up and then use a stiff wire wheel to remove the undercoating with the stiffener bolted up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlanta93LE View Post
It's hard to imagine anything you do will be worse than what you have now
The rail could be totally missing... oh wait, that'd make the job easier. The area behind the tear is offset about 3" towards the drive shaft. Poor car.
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:59 PM   #37
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I meant not enough of a difference to warrent all of the welding. Though I guess it wouldnt be that much harder to weld, than to remove part of the interior and drill how ever many holes. The change using the rails bolted up was minimal, I cant imagine being able to tell the difference between bolted and welded.
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Old 01-05-2009, 02:35 PM   #38
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this may seem stupid, but would there be a way to add bracing to adjacent screws or is the muffler, ect, in the way? Its hard to tell from the pics

Edit: before I get flamed and linked to the fm butterfly. I mean like a flat piece with a bead. Not something intricate like the FM butterfly.
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Old 01-05-2009, 03:20 PM   #39
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I think the welding would be in the spirit of adding this stiffeners - IOW the Miata is OK w/o them, but they do make a difference. In my case, welding was in the interest for obvious reconstructive reasons.

No- not straight across, the ppf is in the way too. You can see that exhaust hanger in my photo clears the ppf by about 1/4" and it's hanging with stock hanger in the stock location. That said, you could definitely build some that stepped up enough to clear the ppf. The bigger hurdle is exhaust for those that have gone big or have some kind of resonator in the way.
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Old 01-06-2009, 01:55 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m2cupcar View Post
No- not straight across, the ppf is in the way too. You can see that exhaust hanger in my photo clears the ppf by about 1/4" and it's hanging with stock hanger in the stock location. That said, you could definitely build some that stepped up enough to clear the ppf. The bigger hurdle is exhaust for those that have gone big or have some kind of resonator in the way.
I doubt anyone would be willing to put the work in to make a cheaper version of the butterfly, but it seems likely that someone could make something decent on the cheap without too much work?
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