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Get rid of the BCs, asap. You're doing some great suspension tuning with them, but your minds going to be blown when you put a set of proper shocks on. I wouldn't be surprised if in the last few track days your dampening has changed drastically as the BCs go from new to blown.
Bronco Sport*! Three whole cylinders (base model) of fury and they’ve sold like f*cking hotcakes down here despite being a dressed up AWD Ford Escape lol.
In all seriousness, yeah, Xidas are on the list sometime early to mid next year. I know the spring rates and other adjustments I’m making aren’t compensating for the fact that the car should be on something better. That being said, it’s still cool seeing firsthand the improvements made by optimizing the components I currently have.
My semi-hashed out idea is to keep the car on these sh*t coilovers and do a track day at each of our local courses to see what times I can pull as is. Then pull the trigger on a set of Xidas and have my mind blown in late Spring/early Summer.
I'm all about working with what you got. We all have 100 things we want to do to our cars at any given time, and sometimes you just gotta pick the most pressing things first.
That said, I'm on DIY billies with 800/450 springs. It rides OK, definitely some room for improvement. No adjustment whatsoever, but I haven't had any major handling issues and I've able to drive it 10/10th at the track, eating up curbs and all.
I rode in a buddies cars on BC's, and holy **** that was rough. He'd go over a bump and the whole car would crash. My dirt road made it feel like the car was falling apart. Not sure what BC setup he had, or what settings the car was on, but it made me appreciate my billies
I rode in a buddies cars on BC's, and holy **** that was rough. He'd go over a bump and the whole car would crash. My dirt road made it feel like the car was falling apart. Not sure what BC setup he had, or what settings the car was on, but it made me appreciate my billies
Hmm.. I pulled one of my BC rear coilovers off and it looks like it has bumpstops and nothing looks out of the ordinary. The ride is VERY rough over big bumps as you said.. I wonder if it's these specific coilovers or what. Interesting to hear another person say that. I didn't drive it too much but on the drive home picking up the car when I hit bumps in the road (like say where a bridge starts/ends and the surface isn't flat) the word "crash" is the only thing that comes to mind..
All of your responses are making me grateful for my current blissful ignorance haha. I was almost nervous that I might buy a $2k+ set of coilovers and notice only minor benefit. Sounds like I should feel like Superman on track once I swap my current coils out.
Related-but-unelated pic of the car and the mobile hotel room loaded up tonight. It rains here sometimes.
It rained all the way up to Buttonwillow Thursday night. My buddy said the ground was too soft to camp on and that we’d have to set up on the pavement. No big deal. My weather app said the rain should subside by midnight. I set my alarm for 6:30 went to bed.
When I woke up, I still heard rain. Weird. It must be super early in the morning or something. Then I heard trucks coming down the road. Then my alarm went off. I rolled over and checked the weather again. Rain in the forecast until 11am.
I can’t explain how freaking excited I got. If it was gonna be wet for the whole first half of the day, I wasn’t even concerned about lap times anymore. We were gonna be sliding around finding the limits of traction in the wet. Something I’ve only had the pleasure of doing once at a track day before.
Apologies for the lack of track photos. I basically only took photos of the aftermath.
I managed to get on track early and be fourth or fifth out of the hot pits. It’s been 11 months since I last drove at the track in the rain but I got familiar with the amount of traction available pretty quick. I went to work seeing what kind of times I could pull in the wet but eventually just started working on seeing how smoothly I could hold a slide through corners once traffic got a little thicker.
The event was pretty dialed. My buddy Ricky rented the track out for his birthday and opened up 55 spots for purchase. It was open lapping all day, no classes. The only issue with this is that there were plenty of beginners and people who obviously weren’t yet competent driving in the rain (remember, this is SoCal ). People were spinning and going off track left and right. The ground was so soft that 95% of the cars that went off needed to get towed back onto the track, leaving trails of mud on the pavement as well.
This being said, it was still an absolute riot. Plenty of people got frustrated with the wet conditions and stayed in the pits until the afternoon, leaving the track mostly open for me and my buddies with their lower horsepower cars to mess around on.
Lunch. *Something something, “your mom”*
The rain cleared and by 1:30pm the track was completely dry, albeit dirty as heck and harboring a couple patches of mud. I started hot lapping after lunch break and was pleased to find that the car was much more mild mannered with the suspension adjustments I’d made. Oversteer was less pronounced, through still able to be produced, and the car didn’t seem so stiff that it was deflecting off of the bumps. I was still sliding through Sunset, Cotton Corners, Bus Stop, and Phil Hill every lap, but in such a way that required only the mildest amount of counter steer to correct. The car is still fun and a little tail happy, but much more composed. Yes, I still plan on upgrading the coilovers next year.
I was able to pull a 1:59.21 on my best lap. Not awful considering the road surface was suboptimal. I’m still gunning for that 1:57 but it’ll have to wait for another weekend.
On my final session out, I came in super hot into Bus Stop and instantly knew I wasn’t going to make the corner. I didn’t even try to turn in and shot off the track going straight at 90ish mph. I knew I was mostly alone on track at this point so I checked over my shoulders and in my mirrors to make sure I was clear and steered the car toward the straightaway after the exit of Riverside. I somehow carried enough speed to blast a few hundred feet through the mud and gingerly get back on track (off the racing line) without getting stuck. I think I might’ve been the only person to go off track and not need a tow. My car’s currently covered in more dried mud than most Jeeps will ever see.
Friday night, I camped out in Hungry Valley on the way home from the track. It was sub-30 degrees and the exterior of the car completely froze over. A first haha.
I then stopped in the mountains north of Glendale to go for a few-hour bike ride before getting home and returning the trailer. Weather and conditions were perfect out. What a weekend!
My girlfriend got me the GM flex fuel sensor I wanted for Christmas, and my FMS 1000cc injectors just arrived in the mail today. Just waiting on the DW300 fuel pump I ordered to show up this week and then the E85 conversion can begin!
The e85 readiness project begins. Installed and set up the FMS 1050cc injectors last night and got about 20 minutes of auto tuning done before my laptop died. Did another hour or so of tuning today and got the VE table to a point where it’s not completely using EGO as a crutch to hit target AFRs. Strangely enough, there’s still not a ton of resolution in my VE table. I’m in the high 70s at idle and low loads increasing up to 110 max at full boost. Also, VE numbers don’t seem to scale up much once they’re in boost. My VE numbers around peak torque at 10psi look almost identical to the numbers at 17psi. It’s hitting target AFRs in boost as it should though. I’ll post a pic of my VE table this week. Not too worried about it, it just seems mine looks to have less resolution than others I’ve seen.
Anyone need a set of FF640s?
Worked on splicing in the FlexFuel sensor wiring today. Snipped the old EGR position sensor connector that was hanging out by the back of the intake manifold and used it to run the signal wire inside to the ecu. Clipped the signal wire at the OEM harness and spliced it into the clutch switch wire as I thought that’s how the FlexFuel signal was run to my MS3x. I confirmed there’s continuity on the signal wire from the sensor connector to the ecu but I don’t don’t see any option for using the clutch switch wire as an input for FlexFuel in Tunerstudio. Made a separate thread for that earlier. I’ll figure it out.
Keep in mind you have a boost referenced FPR, so you should have 7 psi more fuel pressure at 17psi of boost vs. 10psi. This is why I always wire a fuel pressure sensor to my builds, so I can make sure my fuel pressure trace looks like my MAP trace.
Because of this, your VE numbers will go up slightly with boost, but usually due to your target AFR also dropping slightly. At 10psi I'd expect you're around 11.8-11.9, at 17psi I hope you're around 11.5. But if your target stays the same, you may not see a large increase in VE until fuel pressure is dropping.
As for the high VE at idle, just make sure your dead time is set correctly, the injectors should have come with ECU specific data.
My VE table is almost completely flat, but I use incorporate AFR targets, which as I understand from my Tuner makes it flaaaaaaaat. The plus being that if I want to lean the car out in cruise, for example, or add some more fuel in boost, I can just adjust my AFR targets table without having to retune the entire VE.
Keep in mind you have a boost referenced FPR, so you should have 7 psi more fuel pressure at 17psi of boost vs. 10psi. This is why I always wire a fuel pressure sensor to my builds, so I can make sure my fuel pressure trace looks like my MAP trace.
Because of this, your VE numbers will go up slightly with boost, but usually due to your target AFR also dropping slightly. At 10psi I'd expect you're around 11.8-11.9, at 17psi I hope you're around 11.5. But if your target stays the same, you may not see a large increase in VE until fuel pressure is dropping.
As for the high VE at idle, just make sure your dead time is set correctly, the injectors should have come with ECU specific data.
Ok, yeah. I figured the boost referenced FPR was the reason for this, just didn't know how MUCH the additional fuel pressure counteracted the VE numbers. I'll look into adding a fuel pressure sensor once I figure out my current input wiring debacle with the flexfuel sensor My AFR targets are 11.5 across the board as soon as the car's in boost. Maybe I don't need this margin of safety but it makes me feel better when I'm on track. Guess this will further flatten the VE curve as boost increases. I think a couple of my VE numbers at 10psi are actually higher than they are at 17psi lol.
Dead times should be set correctly. The injectors came with dead times listed in actual times across the voltage range. Rocky @ FMS told me the dead times were virtually identical to ID1050s, so to use their dead time % range as it's easier to drop those settings into TS. I'll double check the dead time values I put in tonight.
Originally Posted by Fireindc
My VE table is almost completely flat, but I use incorporate AFR targets, which as I understand from my Tuner makes it flaaaaaaaat. The plus being that if I want to lean the car out in cruise, for example, or add some more fuel in boost, I can just adjust my AFR targets table without having to retune the entire VE.
Hmm, gotta see if I have incorporate AFR targets active on my tune. That's actually a pretty neat feature. Never knew that's what it allowed you to do.
Ok, yeah. I figured the boost referenced FPR was the reason for this, just didn't know how MUCH the additional fuel pressure counteracted the VE numbers. I'll look into adding a fuel pressure sensor once I figure out my current input wiring debacle with the flexfuel sensor My AFR targets are 11.5 across the board as soon as the car's in boost. Maybe I don't need this margin of safety but it makes me feel better when I'm on track. Guess this will further flatten the VE curve as boost increases. I think a couple of my VE numbers at 10psi are actually higher than they are at 17psi lol.
Dead times should be set correctly. The injectors came with dead times listed in actual times across the voltage range. Rocky @ FMS told me the dead times were virtually identical to ID1050s, so to use their dead time % range as it's easier to drop those settings into TS. I'll double check the dead time values I put in tonight.
Hmm, gotta see if I have incorporate AFR targets active on my tune. That's actually a pretty neat feature. Never knew that's what it allowed you to do.
Keep in mind that if it's not enabled yet, and you want to enable it, you will have to re-tune your entire VE after doing so.
Ok, yeah, my tune has Incorporate AFR Target enabled. Did not know that had an effect on the VE table flatness, thanks for the heads up!
Got the FlexFuel sensor wiring figured out. My flex input was wired to pin 1R via an unlabeled Orange wire. Another look at the wiring diagram shows that 1R on the Miata adapter harness goes to pin 5 in the MS3x, which is where basically every DIY autotune wiring diagram I致e seen shows the MS3x flex input is. Maybe I should致e started there first. Anyways, it works now and ethanol content and fuel temp are both reading in TS.
Screenshot from a video I took, if anyone is wondering why the quality sucks
Finally, I got my DW300 in the mail and dropped it in yesterday. Found that Zak from the Past had rounded off the Phillips head bolt that holds the bottom retainer for the fuel pump. Ended up having to get the cutoff wheel out to notch the bolt so it could be removed with a flathead. Otherwise, the install went smoothly.
Set fuel pressure again and did a little more autotuning and playing with idle settings on the way home. My car was surging at idle between 1000-1400rpms and running the gauntlet between 13.5-16 AFR after coming all the way up to temp. I finally figured out this was due to EGO being active at idle. My EGO settings were set to activate above 1200rpm, just above where the car idles. Below 1200, I was running at about 13.5:1 AFR. If the needle hit 1200, EGO would activate and try to pull that down to 14.7:1, overcompensate, go into the high 15s where it would lose power and rpms would droop, try to save itself, rev a little over 1200, and the cycle would continue. Setting minimum EGO correction to 1400 stopped the issue.
Wasn稚 expecting to be ready this soon the car痴 ready to get dyno壇 on e85 now. I値l probably bring it to the tuner sometime in the next couple weeks!
EGO should work fine above 500rpm, to keep idle at 14.7ish, so you probably have some other settings that are causing the surging. Can you post your tune here?
Curly was first.
EGO is excellent for stabilzing afrs at idle. Can also do wonders after heat soaked startups.
Autotune is what doesn't work very good at idle, maybe you are just confused
I知 generally pretty easily confused, and am usually confused about most things on here before I have a chance to tinker with them firsthand. And even then, I知 usually still a little confused
Ok, given what Curly said, the issue still makes sense to me. With EGO off, my idle VEs we池e producing ~13.5 AFRs with the car fully warmed up. My AFR targets at idle were all 14.7-14.8. I値l turn EGO back on, set the idle targets to 13.5 and retest it when I drive the car tomorrow or Monday. And I値l post my tune when I知 home and have my laptop handy.
For sure. Honestly, I haven't checked my CL idle settings in over a year. I ran OL before my tuner changed me over to CL on my first visit. Not sure if he changed the settings at all when he tuned my current motor. I've never played with the CL idle settings myself.
I set the target AFRs in my tune to 13.5 for the idle cells but haven't had a chance to drive it yet. Still gotta enable EGO below 1400rpm and see what it does after that.
Tune attached here, Curly. VE table still needs more tuning. I've only driven the car a couple days since dropping the new injectors in and also haven't gone through the low load cells by hand yet.
Try this. Are you actually idling at ~35%dc and 1000rpm? That's what it's set at, and also your minimum too. I don't really like that, because if it ever decides to idle a bit high in some conditions, it won't have any way to lower it.
I also changed up your EGO settings, and disabled idle VE, you were probably popping in and out of that as well, which is why I don't like using idle VE. Any time you were leaving idle VE, you were adding 2-5% fuel, and vise versa.
12-20-2023, 09:03 PM
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