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Opinions? Would legalizing meth / cocaine / heroin / etc have a net positive effect on society?
My opinion is no, it won't have a net positive effect on society. I'm totally ignorant to Portugal's drug policies, but I really do enjoy 20 year old Tawny Port. But I believe The States would heavily tax the products therefore creating a black market to compete against The Legal drugs. This is happening right now with legal prescription drugs, alcohol, cigarettes. When getting high is expensive, people will look for cheaper solutions or start committing illegal acts to get legal drugs.
So my opinion is totally opposite of that of Lars. Maybe it's just the die hard conservative in me but anyone who needs a high greater than what alcohol can give is likely not going to have the self control to deal with **** like meth and coke.
"(CNN)The number of homicides in Baltimore this year is soaring -- reaching 100 before the end of April for the first time in nearly two decades -- and the mayor is asking the FBI for more help.
"Murder is out of control," said Mayor Catherine Pugh, at her weekly news briefing Wednesday. "There are too many guns on the streets. We're looking for all the help we can get."
The mayor met recently with the special agent in charge of the FBI's Baltimore office and asked for additional agents to help local police battle violent crime in the city, according to the mayor's spokesman, Anthony McCarthy. He said that could either mean bringing in more FBI agents from other field offices across the country or reassigning agents already in Baltimore to work with local police investigating violent crime.
Three people were killed in the city Monday -- raising the number of homicides this year to 101, according to police. And with the warmer months approaching, it's only expected to get worse."
My opinion is no, it won't have a net positive effect on society. I'm totally ignorant to Portugal's drug policies, but I really do enjoy 20 year old Tawny Port. But I believe The States would heavily tax the products therefore creating a black market to compete against The Legal drugs. This is happening right now with legal prescription drugs, alcohol, cigarettes. When getting high is expensive, people will look for cheaper solutions or start committing illegal acts to get legal drugs.
So my opinion is totally opposite of that of Lars. Maybe it's just the die hard conservative in me but anyone who needs a high greater than what alcohol can give is likely not going to have the self control to deal with **** like meth and coke.
Why not do a tiny bit of research then? Here I'll even start you off.
But I believe The States would heavily tax the products therefore creating a black market to compete against The Legal drugs. This is happening right now with legal prescription drugs, alcohol, cigarettes.
Yes, we must do something about the savage violence perpetrated by the massive alcohol and cigarette cartels, and clean our streets of these black market alcohol and cigarette dealers.
I think I saw that before and I skimmed through it the last time. Is there any other data that shows how society profited from the legalization other than fewer deaths from overdosing? I'm not trying to argue with you here but fewer deaths from overdosing because legalization doesn't quite add up. People overdose on legal prescribed drugs all the time. Also the article doesn't give data to before legalization. And also noted is that possession of small quantities is legal but who is selling it? I truly am ignorant on the subject, and again, not trying to argue with you or break your *****.
As an example to my ignorance, I have no idea what type of health risks all these drugs come with but I'd be willing to bet that they'd be like alcohol only exponentially more dangerous. I don't see that as a positive.
Likely, I also see these drugs exponentially more addictive than alcohol or cigarettes and everyone hates Big Tobacco for their evil ploy to keep people coming back for their next hit. So I find it hypocritical to want to get rid of Big Tobacco yet legalize hard drugs.
Yes, we must do something about the savage violence perpetrated by the massive alcohol and cigarette cartels, and clean our streets of these black market alcohol and cigarette dealers.
Then I guess we don't need the AT in the ATF. Which if drugs were legalized would be the agency in charge of controlling illegal trafficking.
And you avoided putting in the legal prescription drug market which I've heard in the news of late.
I really don't wish to argue with either of you two gentlemen on the matter. The question was posed and there were several opinions for the pro so I thought why not throw in an opinion for the con. If hard drugs are your thing or you want them made legal, have at it. I don't tell anyone what to do with their lives. Except for my 6 year old son. At least for another 12 years. Maybe.
So it turns out that Rachael Leigh Cook, the insanely hot "this is your brain on drugs" girl from the 90s, is still insanely hot. But she's preaching a slightly different sermon:
If you could just buy prescription drugs without a prescription then there would be no black market for them either. I'd like to be able to get cough syrup that works without wasting 1/2 to 3/4 a day trying to get to see a doc and waiting for a script to be filled. The damn things all have instructions and interaction precautions. I've got a closet and garage full of chemicals that could kill me or cause organ failure. Limiting codeine but not muriatic acid is somewhat nonsensical, IMO.
"(CNN)The number of homicides in Baltimore this year is soaring -- reaching 100 before the end of April for the first time in nearly two decades -- and the mayor is asking the FBI for more help.
"Murder is out of control," said Mayor Catherine Pugh, at her weekly news briefing Wednesday. "There are too many guns on the streets. We're looking for all the help we can get."
The mayor met recently with the special agent in charge of the FBI's Baltimore office and asked for additional agents to help local police battle violent crime in the city, according to the mayor's spokesman, Anthony McCarthy. He said that could either mean bringing in more FBI agents from other field offices across the country or reassigning agents already in Baltimore to work with local police investigating violent crime.
Three people were killed in the city Monday -- raising the number of homicides this year to 101, according to police. And with the warmer months approaching, it's only expected to get worse."
Ahahahahahahaha
I thought handguns were highly restricted in that state?
If you could just buy prescription drugs without a prescription then there would be no black market for them either. I'd like to be able to get cough syrup that works without wasting 1/2 to 3/4 a day trying to get to see a doc and waiting for a script to be filled. The damn things all have instructions and interaction precautions. I've got a closet and garage full of chemicals that could kill me or cause organ failure. Limiting codeine but not muriatic acid is somewhat nonsensical, IMO.
In the end it boils down to this: Does our government believe that consumers are capable of making educated choices for themselves. Liberals in general seem to go the route of "Absolutely not, ever". Republicans seem to go in the direction of "Not when it's about sex or drugs or anything else that may be fun".
I'm a cynic and have been for a while now. From my observations of humanity I tend to agree with the liberal opinion that most people can't make educated decisions for themselves. My conclusion is different however: Let them kill themselves if they want to. Everybody has the right to do to themselves whatever they want to. The law is only supposed to protect people from each other- not from themselves.
In the end it boils down to this: Does our government believe that consumers are capable of making educated choices for themselves... From my observations of humanity I tend to agree with the liberal opinion that most people can't make educated decisions for themselves.
I agree. The founding fathers knew the average American was an idiot. That is why they put the Electoral College in place.
The thing is, the election of the president impacts the whole country, while Billy-Bob overdosing on meth impacts Billy-Bob.
I agree. The founding fathers knew the average American was an idiot. That is why they put the Electoral College in place.
The thing is, the election of the president impacts the whole country, while Billy-Bob overdosing on meth impacts Billy-Bob.
Agreed on the implications of the Electoral College. As much as I find it distasteful, it is a safeguard.
Billy-Bob's meth habit does, however, have implications for the rest of society. First, it creates a direct economic burden (paying for his medicare / ER visits / welfare, etc).
Second, even if it were legal, it's unlikely that Philip-Morris or Johnson & Johnson would be providing it, so the same underground network would still be in place to manufacture and distribute it. And even without the threat of law enforcement, the same rivalries would exist between various cartels for territory, with the attendant crime.
Third, there'd probably still be administrative laws in place which make it harder for me to buy Claratin-D for when I visit the home of someone armed with a cat or a dog.
And fourth, when was the last time you read an article about a pothead committing a violent crime against an innocent* person while stoned? Compared to the number of stories concerning people stung out on meth.
I've brought enough people back to life (sometimes more than once in a day) to know that opioid addicts are not content to just "stick with clean heroin".
They will keep using more and more and harder and harder depressants until it kills them.
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Billy-Bob's meth habit does, however, have implications for the rest of society. First, it creates a direct economic burden (paying for his medicare / ER visits / welfare, etc).
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That's where the part of the 'It the laws job to prevent people from harming others' comes into play. If you want to legalize all drugs, you have to change society and laws to quite a serious degree, assuring that the self-destruction of individuals does not harm others. For example we'd need to get rid of the Hippocratic Oath, since it forces doctors to treat anybody. As well as its' extension that ERs have to treat everybody with a severe problem. It's not a nice system, but it would be a workable system. A majority of the country would just have to finally admit that we're not nice people and don't really care about others and don't mind much if they die in the gutter.
A majority of the country would just have to finally admit that we're not nice people and don't really care about others and don't mind much if they die in the gutter.
Being 100% serious here:
If you have completely failed at life, and elect to take up a meth / heroin / etc., habit, and contribute absolutely nothing to society as a whole, then I really don't care if you die in a gutter. Our civilization would be better served to just have you die quietly, than to continuously expend resources (healthcare, police / courts / jails, etc) to prolong your suffering.
I thought handguns were highly restricted in that state?
Yes. After the firearm safety act of 2013 (fsa2013), handgun sales require a lot more $. You are now required to get a handgun qualification license before purchase. That may or may not require classroom training. So Maryland hates the poor.
The year after that passed, Baltimore had a record year of homicides by gun. According to Owe' Malley and his cronies, that piece of legislation was going to reduce handgun violence and we would become a utopia like California. Well, one could argue fsa2013 has made the homicide rate worse.
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