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Old 07-20-2014, 07:53 PM   #41
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This is what happens when you give million dollar military weapons to a bunch of farmers and truck drivers with no guidance or real leadership. They just shoot everything that pops up because they have a new toy.
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Old 07-20-2014, 08:37 PM   #42
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As for "shooting down Putin," yeah right.

Aircraft was cruising in the 30s. All you see is a spec and, perhaps, a contrail. The SAM was radar guided, not IR or visual. Utterly stupid assertion. Advanced, optical VID ("Visual ID") devices (like they have on some of the MIGs) are not part of this SAM system.

What sixshooter said.
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Old 07-21-2014, 09:11 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Aircraft was cruising in the 30s. All you see is a spec and, perhaps, a contrail. The SAM was radar guided, not IR or visual. Utterly stupid assertion. Advanced, optical VID ("Visual ID") devices (like they have on some of the MIGs) are not part of this SAM system.
yeah, that's like saying all Lerner's emails are gone because the HD on her computer crashed.
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Old 07-21-2014, 01:35 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by triple88a View Post
A lot of news cast believe that it was an attempt to assassinate Putin whos plane was half an hour behind the Malaysia flight.



http://rt.com/news/173672-malaysia-plane-crash-putin/
Did you just quote MF'in RUSSIA TODAY for information about RUSSIAN SEPARATISTS? Of course they say that it was Ukraine trying to kill Putin. You might as well watch Fox News for information about the US, BBC for information about the UK, Al Jazeera for middle eastern news, etc.
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Old 07-21-2014, 01:55 PM   #45
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are you suggesting the US government feeds fox news its stories?
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Old 07-21-2014, 02:26 PM   #46
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You got that backwards.
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Old 07-21-2014, 02:30 PM   #47
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You got that backwards.
true story: White House says Obama only learned of VA wait-list scandal on TV (just like the IRS, Fast and Furious and reporter snooping scandals) | Mail Online

Quote:
A CNN reporter asked Carney on Monday when the president was 'first made aware ... of these fraudulent lists that were being kept to hide the wait times' at VA medical centers.

'You mean the specific allegations,' Carney asked, 'that I think were reported first by your news network out of Phoenix, I believe?'

'We learned about them through the reports. I will double check if that is not the case. But that is when we learned about them and that is when I understand Secretary Shinseki learned about them, and he immediately took the action that he has taken.'

After the Operation Fast and Furious scandal broke, Obama responded to national outrage in an interview broadcast by CNN's John King on October 12, 2011, similarly saying he was out of the loop until he turned on his television.
I made sure to use a UK site for my source on US news.
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Old 07-21-2014, 02:35 PM   #48
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More that they just spread misinformation.
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Old 07-21-2014, 02:39 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
More that they just spread misinformation.
you're comparing a credible news source highly critical of the party in power, that dominates viewership to the point of beating out all its competition--combined--to a state controlled propaganda machine that's a megaphone for Putin.

I bet you can't even source a bit of misinformation.

Remember that time when Fox News ran a story based on fake documents where Dan Rathers reported Bush deliberately went AWOL to avoid going to war? Fox News thinks they can get away with everything. Your turn.

Last edited by Braineack; 07-21-2014 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 07-21-2014, 03:06 PM   #50
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I was going with the University of Maryland's study that found that Fox News viewers are the most misinformed news viewers, which could probably be explained away via confirmation bias, but I digress. None of the American major media "news" companies are really in the business of news, and to wholeheartedly trust any of them with such is foolish.

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Originally Posted by Network (1976)
I watched your 6 o'clock news today; it's straight tabloid. You had a minute and a half of that lady riding a bike naked in Central Park; on the other hand, you had less than a minute of hard national and international news. It was all sex, scandal, brutal crime, sports, children with incurable diseases, and lost puppies. So, I don't think I'll listen to any protestations of high standards of journalism when you're right down on the streets soliciting audiences like the rest of us. Look, all I'm saying is if you're going to hustle, at least do it right.
The beauty of the internet is I am not limited to Fox, CNN, or MSNBC, et. al. I can read articles from different journalists (even some REAL journalists) from all over the world on the same topic, including first-hand accounts or blogs from involved locals. Now if we could get everyone to start cross-checking their news....
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Old 07-21-2014, 03:10 PM   #51
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Really? Compared to, like, MSNBC viewers?

Not that I rely on any of them, but what the heck kind of "study" is that?

BTW, I have an MSAE from U of MD. Guarantee you the engineering department wasn't doing BS "studies" like this.
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Old 07-21-2014, 03:27 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
None of the American major media "news" companies are really in the business of news, and to wholeheartedly trust any of them with such is foolish.
well yeah, cause the liberal media is only really concerned with pushing their progressive goals; not spreading the news.

We know this because it's obvious they aren't actually concerned about the news (source: all MSNBC and CNN broadcasts) and if they were actually concerned with ratings and profit, then they'd lean conservative and try to actually compete with Fox News, because like I pointed out, Fox News dominates the ratings and as a reward, they make more profit than MSNBC and CNN combined.

Instead, they get together, come up with stories, catch phrases, and battle plans to spin negative press against the Messiah all while being rewarded with dwindling viewership (CNN is at a 20-year low as of 2013).

and remember, new outlets make about 70% of their profits from advertising. And advertisers dont like it when you don't have an audience for them to sell to.

tl;dr Fox Lies.
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Old 07-21-2014, 06:21 PM   #53
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It was conservative movie star Ronald "Ronnie" Reagan that vetoed Congress's attempts at codifying The Fairness Doctrine into law after the FCC struck it down on first amendment grounds, even though SCOTUS found no first amendment issue. And then George H. "Not Dubya" W. Bush threatened a veto, which killed it again in 91. These decisions have helped lead to our current state of yellow journalism and corporate sponsored political echo-chambers which do no favors to our electorate nor their understanding of the issues.

But that plays right along with the real goal. "Liberal" and "conservative" is a false dichotomy. The "conservatives" have moved far right, and the "liberals" are just slightly to the left of it. The only real difference between the parties are a few select social wedge issues to keep up appearances of "us or them." After all, "Devide et impera." Why do you care which horse wins the race when they all belong to you?



Hmm. Big wonder Obama isn't doing anything to help with the overwhelming student loan problem, and is trying to ram-rod through legislation to allow more H1-B visas for STEM companies...

TL;DR: Yes, I did compare the corporate controlled propaganda machine that's a megaphone designed to spread disinformation and malice to benefit the members of our oligarchy to a state controlled propaganda machine that's a megaphone for Putin. Remember, the NDAA that liberal-hero Obama signed into law made propaganda legal in the United States, along with a score of other evils.

</offtopic>

So is it possible for the Russian Separatists to have tampered with the recovered flight recorders?
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Old 07-21-2014, 06:47 PM   #54
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Not really. It wouldn't really matter though as the recorders aren't really equipped to detect surface to air missiles and the crew probably wouldn't have had any clue something was wrong until the airframe started disintegrating.
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Old 07-22-2014, 08:18 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
It was conservative movie star Ronald "Ronnie" Reagan that vetoed Congress's attempts at codifying The Fairness Doctrine into law after the FCC struck it down on first amendment grounds, even though SCOTUS found no first amendment issue. And then George H. "Not Dubya" W. Bush threatened a veto, which killed it again in 91. These decisions have helped lead to our current state of yellow journalism and corporate sponsored political echo-chambers which do no favors to our electorate nor their understanding of the issues.
If you honestly believe a fairness doctrine is what you need to get honest journalism in america, you're out of you mind.

Any attempts to pass this law today is an effort by the left to use the gov't monopoly, and legal use of force, to help their buddies into Fox News's and other conservative news radio's market share.

Quote:
But that plays right along with the real goal. "Liberal" and "conservative" is a false dichotomy. The "conservatives" have moved far right, and the "liberals" are just slightly to the left of it. The only real difference between the parties are a few select social wedge issues to keep up appearances of "us or them." After all, "Devide et impera." Why do you care which horse wins the race when they all belong to you?
both have moved left. Conservatives only appear to have moved far right because liberal have moved so far left. Sorry, that's completely false in every stretch of the imagination.

Quote:
I'm willing to argue there's a 78% difference or $2,793,457 difference and even a complete fundamental difference, despite these donors.

Quote:
Hmm. Big wonder Obama isn't doing anything to help with the overwhelming student loan problem, and is trying to ram-rod through legislation to allow more H1-B visas for STEM companies...
because he's a horrible president that can't do anything right and has absolutely no interest in solving the student loan issue, all while campaigning on it?

His "plan" is to "forgive" loans--and what this really just means to subsidize them further; that the american taxpayer will pay the debts of individuals.

This incentivizes universities to INCREASE their rates, because students can just secure bigger loans and still have them paid for.

So long as we subsidize schooling, the cost will only go up, it's economics 101; something our president has little understanding of. Or he has complete understanding and he actually has alternative motives than what he preaches because he wants to fundamentally change america, and that requires destroying it to fit into his warped sense of fairness.

remember when he also promised to fix our gas price issue when he first got into office? I just filled up at $4.13 a gallon. or remember when he promised to close gitmo as his first act?

or any of these 6-pages worth of promises: The Obameter: Campaign Promises that are Promise Broken | PolitiFact

I dont know what's the point of issuing H1-B visas (or legislation), they can all just cross our open borders and enter our socialist system without all the paperwork.

Quote:
TL;DR
FTFY

What a great argument.

In 1798 John Adams passed the Alien and Sedition Act in order to deport press/news that were saying negative things about him and the Federalist. So that pretty much proves that Fox News is in no way similar to RT. We must resist much.
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Old 07-22-2014, 11:37 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
both have moved left
It's no longer worth arguing if you can't be honest.



So, missing bodies from the train? Flight recorders? Saw cuts in the plane hull? Anything other than Brain flipping out about my slight on the perfectly flawless visage of Faux News?
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Old 07-23-2014, 09:31 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by TheScaryOne View Post
It's no longer worth arguing if you can't be honest.
on a scale of left to right: are you up or down?
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Old 07-23-2014, 09:41 AM   #58
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So are there no right-leaning libertarians?
Back on topic, it appears as if a lot of evidence was either destroyed or tampered with (saw cuts, missing bodies, etc.).
It doesn't really make any difference though when there are intercepted phone calls and tweets that paint a pretty good picture of what happened.
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:05 AM   #59
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So are there no right-leaning libertarians?
I believe the two are mutually incompatible as a leader. I'm sure there are plenty of right-leaning libertarian followers.
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Old 07-23-2014, 10:26 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monk View Post
So are there no right-leaning libertarians?
Back on topic, it appears as if a lot of evidence was either destroyed or tampered with (saw cuts, missing bodies, etc.).
It doesn't really make any difference though when there are intercepted phone calls and tweets that paint a pretty good picture of what happened.
President Shuiend will be a full on libertarian. 2024 A vote for Shuiend is a Vote for FREEDOM!

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