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Old 05-17-2009, 05:07 PM   #21
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im going to have to go buy a pressure tester. the smoke come out of the pipe and sits in the air no more than 5 seconds
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Old 05-17-2009, 05:16 PM   #22
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I'm going to say rings not head gasket. If its not doing it all the time, and doing it at redlights (not under load like it would be in gear) then its likely the rings. Search for some of my rebuild threads and see if your symptoms sound like mine. I was being a fool and blaming the head gasket and/or block and head surface, when all along it was the rings and I didn't want to admit it. Mine would smoke more under light loads (revving at idle) but would mostly go away when driving. 5 head gaskets later I broke down and did a rebuild. Now I have a fresh rebuild, no oil or coolant consumption and certainly no smoke. Feels great.
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Old 05-17-2009, 05:19 PM   #23
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thanks NA6C, if im doing the rings ill have to tear everything apart should i get a metal head gasket to insure i dont have to replace it later?
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Old 05-17-2009, 05:33 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi Im Simon View Post
if your going to take off the head, get it resurfaced.

i have a brand new HKS 2mm head gasket if you want to buy it.

brings your compression down to 9.0:1
umm...isn't the 1.6 compression lower than 9.0:1?

If i'm right it would be raising it to 9.0:1.....or are you saying its going to drop it lower than what the stock compression is?
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Old 05-17-2009, 05:55 PM   #25
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Compression on the 1.6 is 9.4:1 on the manual cars, 9.0:1 with the auto.

And yeah, this is sounding like rings. Wanna be sure? Take it to a mechanic and have them pressure-test the cooling system. An adapter is installed in place of the radiator cap, and air is used to pressurize the system. You should be able to apply 15 PSI to the system and have it hold with zero leakdown. If the pressure drops (and you find coolant in one or more of the cylinders afterward) then it's the head gasket. If the system holds pressure, then the gasket it not a likely candidate.
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Old 05-17-2009, 06:04 PM   #26
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Im in my first year at st paul college for auto mechanics, ive watched all the second year kids do these things because the second year is all engines. Im sure i can find the procedure in one of my books, but id rather not drive the car anywhere. im wondering if it is rings should i worry about it effecting anything else? and what are a good replacement ring brand I should look for with a turbo?

Thanks Brian

Last edited by E=MC^2; 05-17-2009 at 06:18 PM. Reason: i cant spell
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Old 05-17-2009, 07:45 PM   #27
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Shouldn't cause any other problems outside of fuel mixing with oil and creating more bearing wear, but if you are rebuilding, I would surely hope you will be using new bearings anyway. I don't know about the 1.6, but the 1.8 already has an all metal head gasket. Perhaps the 1.6 came with a non MLS gasket, I don't know. For the 1.8, the OEM and many of the parts store brands I looked at were about the same price. Also, while the block is out, it gave me an extra bit of assurance to have my block deck machined flat, though it was probably not needed. But at $30, having both the head and block machined flat made me feel good. If you have the money, might as well go all out and make this a rebuild, not just a fixing rings deal. Won't cost you much more to go ahead and do everything you can (hot tank the block and head, inspect the head, install new valve seals, clean HLA's, timing belt kit, oil pump inspection and replacement if needed, all new gaskets and o-rings, ect.). Of course this is only if your doing it yourself. If a shop is doing it, the labor costs would go up a LOT! Excluding my ignorance and mistakes, it should have only cost me about an extra $300-$500 to do everything I did to my engine. It made it worth it, me knowing that I pretty much have a brand new OEM spec engine (with slightly higher compression ratio).
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Old 05-17-2009, 08:13 PM   #28
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Im BROKE haha but i dont think its my rings i dont have any oil consumption and the smoke cloud is white not blue.

The 1.6 head gaskets are graphite, if i do my head ill replace it with metal.
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Old 05-17-2009, 08:18 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E=MC^2 View Post
Im BROKE haha but i dont think its my rings i dont have any oil consumption and the smoke cloud is white not blue.

The 1.6 head gaskets are graphite, if i do my head ill replace it with metal.
OK, but I said the same thing 5 times (5 new head gaskets and 5 head removals) before I took other peoples advice and went with new rings. Of course it wont hurt anything to try a new head gasket first, except a $60-$80 loss. That might fix it, but from the symptoms you've listed it sounds like rings. My smoke color tricked me.
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Old 05-17-2009, 08:21 PM   #30
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ill forsure do the leak testing first so i dont waste my time and money.
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Old 05-17-2009, 09:57 PM   #31
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So is it really a good idea to go with head studs and MLS gaskets?

I ask this question because right now I'm changing the HG on my friends Greddyed 1992 for the 2nd time this year. He had a turbo and no supporting mods (no intercooler, timing retard, no nothing). I think in his case and some others that are not going to do it "right" the HG is a cheep fix. If it had a MLS gasket and head studs you would prob find the next weakest link in the motor, who knows....piston, rod, both much more of a PITA to replace than a HG.
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Old 05-17-2009, 10:22 PM   #32
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Depends on power goals. I wouldn't call it a bad idea in any case, but probably not needed in most cases. I went with them for piece of mind, and they weren't all that expensive.
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Old 05-19-2009, 05:48 PM   #33
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I wasnt getting more than 3 psi so i hadnt hooked up an intercooler could that have caused my head gasket to blow?
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Old 05-19-2009, 06:33 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E=MC^2 View Post
BenR, why do you think my rings are bad? and if im in there replacing the head gasket should i replace the rings as well?

Thanks -Brian


I think it's your rings because the stated symptoms match.

"no over heating no milky oil no roungh running no loss of power just once in awhile there is a huge cloud of smoke when im at a stop light its forsure coming out of the tail pipe and is white i thought it could be trans fluid but how could i burn tran fluid with a manual?"



Of course with out some solid diagnostic work, it's just an internet guess. Get a leakdown test, and a full compression test and get back to us.

The headgasket on the 1.6 though not MLS is ALOT stronger than you think it is. It can handle alot of excessive heat, and pressure. In most cases it takes a colossal fuckup to blow one.

You're going to need to replace your head gasket when you replace your rings.
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Old 05-19-2009, 07:14 PM   #35
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I just took a look at your car...your HG is fine, your rings are gone.
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Old 05-19-2009, 08:38 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E=MC^2 View Post
I wasnt getting more than 3 psi so i hadnt hooked up an intercooler could that have caused my head gasket to blow?
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Old 05-19-2009, 09:49 PM   #37
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Icantdo55 said he has replaced his friends HG multiple times because he wasnt running it "right" could i have done the same thing? its probly 5 psi max but i never hit that.
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Old 05-19-2009, 09:53 PM   #38
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here's what i found:

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Old 05-19-2009, 10:01 PM   #39
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why would i burn coolant with bad piston rings?
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Old 05-20-2009, 01:14 AM   #40
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I drove her the other day and everytime i hit a stop light i held the throttle a little. i kept it at 1k and i didnt have any smoke come out! what the heck. could i be leaking coolant in my TB?
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