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Old 08-18-2007, 09:22 PM   #1
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Default Engine control choices/confusion. I'm lost

So I was happy with the setup I had ordered, but then as usual I had second thoughts...

I had a voodooII turbo kit coming from FM, then I read/heard about the benefits and features of the new aem f/ic and thought I'd get that. Then I downloaded the software and realized that I didn't have the slightest clue on how to tune something like that (I did look at the instruction manual), and that it may be far over my head and end up costing lots in dyno time and professional tuners. I also realized that the f/ic with a boomslang will be damn close to $600.

So now I am thinking that I already bought a bipes anticipating the voodoo setup and I should just get a used voodoo box and use the 305cc injectors I bought with the kit.

...But then I thought about the e-manage, which seems to be a bit better than a voodoo/bipes, but can't shorten injector pulses as the f/ic can (to my knowledge) so I couldn't eventually get 460cc's and would be limited to a certain amount of power. A also don't know much about the tuning for the e-manage other than there are some little ***** on the back of the unit.

So now I am completely lost as far as engine management goes. I kind of want to just go with the simple voodoo/bipes and 305's, but I also want something that I won't have to upgrade when I want a bit more power.

I am lost and need some guidance from the turbo gods.
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Old 08-18-2007, 10:17 PM   #2
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the F/IC software is a bit confusing because it's new and yeah it's expensive for a piggyback but after you read it a few times it starts to make sense.
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Old 08-18-2007, 11:47 PM   #3
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After living with the MS PNP, I cannot imagine dicking around with a piggyback. It will be the last ECU you ever buy for your car.
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Old 08-19-2007, 12:03 AM   #4
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But there is no ms pnp available for 96-97 correct?
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Old 08-19-2007, 12:05 AM   #5
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Not right now, no. I know Jerry's about to start development, but I won't pretend to know when he'll have that out. He has said that the wiring is very different from the 94-95 so it could be a while. I'd shoot him an email.
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Old 08-19-2007, 12:17 AM   #6
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The wiring at the ecu is different, but the actual engine differences between 94/95 and 96/97 are minimal. A 94/95 ECU can run a 96/97 car with a patch harness between the ecu and car. That's how FM runs their Link.

In theory, you could use the existing Boomslang patch harness and run the 94-95PNP on your 97 right now. Not been tried, to my knowledge, but it should work.

That being said, I'd expect the 96/97 development to occur quickly. Barring anything unforseen.
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Old 08-19-2007, 11:28 AM   #7
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Uh you can run 400's with a emb look at jahunis. Or even Ben
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Old 08-19-2007, 12:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedf50 View Post
But there is no ms pnp available for 96-97 correct?
search for my parallel install thread. you can do it yourself in a weekend. You have to tap into 3-4 wires and cut 6. It's very easy. I'm uploading new pics to my VB garage in a few minutes that will should you how everything is mounted.
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Old 08-19-2007, 03:36 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
Uh you can run 400's with a emb look at jahunis. Or even Ben
But how simple is the emb to tune? Is it something that could be easily picked up and tuned without the help of a professional?

And I really like the idea of the MS, and I'll look into the parallel thingy, but that is just so much more $$ than the voodoo/bipes or e-manage. I know it is also that much better, but as it is now I just don't think I can come up with enough money to get one, although I really want one. And is the software on the MS understandable? I'll see how much $$ I can scrounge together. If I can get a MS then I almost definitely will.

Any other advice?
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Old 08-19-2007, 09:44 PM   #10
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ms is only $330. i thnk thats cheaper than everything but an EMB. The software is very easy to use.
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Old 08-19-2007, 10:42 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedf50 View Post
But how simple is the emb to tune? Is it something that could be easily picked up and tuned without the help of a professional?

And I really like the idea of the MS, and I'll look into the parallel thingy, but that is just so much more $$ than the voodoo/bipes or e-manage. I know it is also that much better, but as it is now I just don't think I can come up with enough money to get one, although I really want one. And is the software on the MS understandable? I'll see how much $$ I can scrounge together. If I can get a MS then I almost definitely will.

Any other advice?

The plug and plays run for 700 cause your paying for the fact that you have to do...basicly no work. You just unhook your ECU and hook up the MS. Maps are already load and you can load a map by someone else and then just need to fine tune to your car.

You can buy a prebuilt MS for 300-400ish and then just have to deal with the wiring issue. Which is something I believe you have to deal with even with the EMB or EMU.

I would vote for the MS over a piggy back cause in the end a piggy back is still limited, were the MS is only limited by your ability to tune.

This is what I say you do, either a keep the voodoo box and bipes and run the car like that for a while. Given that you already have the bipes and Voodoo box. Then at a latter date, either build a MS or buy MSPnP and swap. If you don't already have the voodoo but the bipes, sell the bipes to someone with a greddy and get a MS.
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Old 08-20-2007, 01:08 AM   #12
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If I can use the Megasquirt software, anyone can. It takes a little time to pick up initially, but once you get a couple of things down it's super easy to use.

The biggest thing with the MS is the ability to datalog, as well as view an accurate gauge of EVERY last function the ECU controls, all the way down to injector duty cycles, throttle position, and battery voltage. It's pretty crazy how much information is available.
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Old 08-20-2007, 01:19 AM   #13
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For the cost of those piggy's MS can and will run the show for you it is very user freindly, and esp if you do a WB install as well. And makes tunning easierm and alot more power on tap. trust me if i can use MS so can you. +1 on the datalog being awesome
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:21 AM   #14
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Where can you get the assembled MS? Is it still miata specific? And is there any way of downloading and trying out the software without the unit? Is the wiring for the ms something that is doable, but time consuming?

I have the bipes and a set of 305cc injectors so far plus an aem wideband kit, and I de-voodoo'd the FM kit. I'm starting to like the sound of the ms, if I can get it for <$500.
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Old 08-20-2007, 04:38 AM   #15
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The Plug-n-Play (PNP) is Miata-specific. The 90-93 has been out awhile and the 94-95 just came out a few weeks ago. I'd expect the next thing they're working on is the 96-97 version.

For the software, go to the MS subforum here and follow the instructions, download Megatune and whatnot and just play around with it. I had a nerd-gasm looking at all the different features you can control on the MS just by playing with the software. I can't wait to get my PNP and see what this Greddy can do.
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Old 08-20-2007, 05:01 AM   #16
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so no pnp ms for my 00?
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Old 08-20-2007, 05:07 AM   #17
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im just going to snwer my ? and say no. Where should I go buy a prebuilt ms and just figure the wiring myself. I dont want to solder anything lol.
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Old 08-20-2007, 05:07 AM   #18
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Then what would be needed to get the non-pnp MS working?
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Old 08-20-2007, 05:10 AM   #19
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I know spectre performance has pre-built universal ms. You have to figure out the wiring.
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Old 08-20-2007, 09:11 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
Uh you can run 400's with a emb look at jahunis. Or even Ben

he admitted himeself he could idle them yet hardly control them....which is pretty important ya know...
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