Exocet EFR
 

Finally got my frame bolted to the miata chassis today.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458618834

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458618834

The original plan began with an Artech manifold and downpipe for the EFR, but it doesn't fit the Exocet (not Abe's fault).

Only about 1/4" clearance here (less if i clock the housing in either direction), and the wastegate interferes with the "hood"

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458618834

But atleast the downpipe fits I guess

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458618834

So now I have to scrounge up a few posts to offer up the combo to another loving home.

I sent an email to Abe to see if he thinks just the straight log manifold would work, I have a good bit of room to work with just not where this manifold ended up putting the turbo.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458618834

TSE manifold might fit it. This way you could keep your turbo.

I have a SR20 T25 I'll trade you straight up ;)

Looks like you just need a different manifold design to have the WG Actuator clocked 90*. Is that Rhino liner on your floor pans? Looks nice! I am just using some skateboard grip tape on mine for cost & time savings.

Is the front on stands? It looks like it's sitting really high.

IMO, why not try and see if the TSE unit is any better :dunno:

Though I do <3 Abe's work :)

I may look into just doing a pie cut on the manifold and rotate the flange a bit, which would move the wastegate and bring the turbo closer to the block. Then I'd have to modify the downpipe also. Seems better just to start from scratch.

The floors and front bulkheads are rhino liner, I was going to have them powder coated and use the grip tape but the guy did it for the cost of material only. came to $100 and it was done in a few hours.

I don't have coilovers yet so I have 2x4s supporting everything, it does sit a little high like that.

Thought about it, but it looks like it puts the turbo in about the same spot vertically.

Negative,

Moves it forward and up away from that strut area :dealwithit:

Not sure with the exo though, you seem to be the first as far as I know :likecat:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1444197497

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1444197497

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1456287463

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1456706463

Thanks for the pictures, but looks like the wastegate will still be an issue. Gives me some ideas tho.

missed your post earlier, I'm determined to use this turbo...will figure something out

Can you put a level on the WG can and the VVT actuator or otherwise measure which side is higher/ by how much? I have an n/a VVT engine in my Exocet I am building, but am researching future turbo upgrades. I already have to raise the hood to clear the VVT solenoid, but curious about the actuator clearance w/ the TS manifold. Thanks!

My chassis might be a bit different than yours (EU lightweight Exocet vs US Exocet) but I'll try to remember to measure from the flange to the shock tower and the offset this evening (as I have the TSE manifold in mine).

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1458749753

I just checked mine again, and the problem is where the wastegate sits in relation to the "cowl" on the exocet's hood. I think your VVT actuator will sit inside the raised area and will minimize the amount you'd have to raise it.

I placed a 2" roll of painters tape on top of the valve cover and that gave me about a 1/4" of clearance with the wastegate, but way too much gap on the sides.

But after looking at it, it seems like if i just go with a log manifold and put the turbo flange between the front two runners it will fit nicely. Just need to see how it looks with the steering in place.

Do you have the US bonnet or the UK bonnet? The US version has a bigger (taller and wider, IIRC) cowl, but I am not sure it extends over to where the actuator is.

US. I'll try to take more pictures tonight.

ok so now that i'm posting in the correct thread...

It's been a few months, got the new log setup from Abe. Oil and water lines are done, as well as the fuel lines. Replaced the stock pump with a DW200, ID1000 injectors, and a new fuel rail.

Next week I should be able to get the radiator and intercooler mounted and piping done. *ignore the stuff holding the turbo on, just temporary

Pics

-4 oil, -6 water
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...77abda7733.jpgOil and water feed, brake/clutch lines also
-8 drain
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...191abc80ba.jpgDrain line

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...8a0e0c98cf.jpgFuel rail to regulator on the firewall

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...cce223668d.jpgDW200 to -6 feed/return

What's the deal with that valve cover? I've never seen one squared off like that.

It's from a protege

Intercooler and radiator mocked up with zip ties, might make a few adjustments to the piping but you get the idea.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...ea20d2eb9a.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...d5fb7d97e9.jpg

Surprised you're doing all of this in the space of a apartment garage :likecat:

Starting to come together too, the new manifold looks nice.

At one point I was spread between three separate garages, I'm down to two now. Definitely have to get creative at times, but the space has gotten me through 3 bike builds and now the car.

fancy wastegate with a 5psi spring. will run no boost control on just the spring until I get the other block built up and swapped in.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...ac81509f9e.jpg

Wow, certainly makes things easy to route an IC when you don't have to worry about there being, well, a car in the way.

What IC core is that? Build looks amazing, also loving the brake lines and routing!

Thanks, really trying to keep it clean and organized.

Intercooler is from CX Racing, Cxracing Intercooler Turbo 15 25x13x3 Inlets on One Side | eBay
A little smaller core than I wanted but it fits the exocet perfectly.

What sort of fittings did you use for the stainless lines to connect to the master cyls?

Installed the breather catch can.


https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...0fecd191c.jpeg

And it's about time to start wiring, will be doing it from scratch.


https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...8c28f7bcd.jpeg



10mm x 1 to -3 AN adapters

I bought a kit from Exomotive that includes all the lines and fittings.

http://exomotive.com/store/exocet-stainless-steel-braided-clutch-brake-line-set/

Looks good so far. You'll want a bigger catch can if you plan to track it. I know you bought a fancy gate, but if you want the hood to go on unmolested just weld the gate shut and use an external one. I really really want to build a second exocet and try to keep it as light as possible.

Street only build.
Hood fits with the new gate, part of the reason I had the second manifold made.


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...8328afead.jpeg


I'd like to build another one with the paco suspension kit and a v8 :)

Cool, great fit then. I'll keep watching for updates.

wat is so good about that wastegate?

.

Exomotive - US Manufacturer of Exocars & Kit Cars | Exocet Stainless Steel Braided Clutch & Brake Line Set

Theoretically this should fit a non exocet just fine right?

I don't see why not. You'd just have to find a way to mount them to the chassis so that they don't droop/ rub on anything. Won't work with aftermarket calipers though, which is a deal breaker for me.

Mainly just concerned that a non exocet car not being a skeleton would prevent any path of least resistance routing that the exocet has, not having to worry about panels that may be in the way. In regards to mounting, I would personally mount them exactly as he has, shouldnt be to difficult.
In regards to aftermarket calipers. If you ended these lines exactly where the stock hardlines terminate that would allow for any aftermarket caliper adaptability you could possibly desire.

Why wouldn't it? Mine bolts to my wilwoods just fine

I stand corrected. I just assumed based on the product description and pictures that each line was just a straight shot from the master cylinder to banjo fitting. I guess there's a fitting in between?

the ends are -3 fittings that attach to banjo adapters, so you could use whatever fitting you need to adapt to -3. Also the MC to rear and the passenger side front lines come unassembled so you can cut to length.

not sure I would put these on a miata though since you can just replace the rubber with stainless and have essentially the same thing. I only used the kit because I didn't want to bend/flare new hard lines.

I personally no longer have hardlines after my rebuild. I ended up cutting a lot of them out and just removing them entirely, so this may be a sound solution for my particular needs. :)

Should this be moved to the build section? Mods feel free...

So my good friend flew out from FL for a few days and we put in a bunch of hours on the car. Long story short, it runs and drives. Tune is nowhere near perfect but its good enough to drive around the apartments, and I'm a bit confused as to why I'm at 6 ReqFuel with the ID1000s. The calculator gives me a 3 but without super high numbers on the VE table it won't run. With a 6 reqfuel the VE table is more reasonable. Running sequential fuel, I've tried 1 squirt simultaneous and 2 squirt alternating... Still wants the higher reqfuel #, seeing 48s around idle on the VE table @ 14.7 idle when warmed up. 70psi fuel pressure at idle, since some searches came up saying thats where the IDs were happiest.

Can't get the stage 8 stuff to fit, so I'm going to replace those with some copper locking nuts.

Also made an adapter plate for the skunk2 throttle body to use an NB idle valve, I bought one for the NA but decided later on to use the NB valve. Rather than buy another, I drew up a design and 3d printed a test piece and some drilling templates. Seems to work great. We forgot to take pictures of the piece we made out of 1/4" aluminum, but i'll post a screenshot of the CAD design.

Big thanks to everyone here for all the information available...from making the MTX and MS match, setting the right base pressure for the IDs, or closed loop idle info (going to mess with that tomorrow). It's nice to be able to have a place to search for info and find it right away.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...7d501033eb.jpg

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...4af007e915.jpg

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...63819329c9.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...896a914f7b.jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...29adff6741.png

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...4ac62fc691.png

Holy shit, is that the integrated BOV? It's that loud?

yup. Intgegrated EFR recirc/bov. Only 5psi.

Love the build!

Interested to see if these EFR turbos don't have boost creep issues like the garret turbos. The internal waste gate design looks to be much better at bypassing flow.

Its because he has little or no intake tract.
It recirculates inside the valve but the air coming in is no match for the speed of sound coming out and there is little restriction to the sound through the small intake path/unrestricted filter.

Dann

i ran the wastegate source to a point after the intercooler to avoid boost sag...can see/hear the wastegate opening while driving so it seems to be working well. Of course this is only with a 5lb spring, but I'll keep the same spring when I start tuning boost control so i think it should be just fine

Me too :bang:

You just need to sand the tabs down a little sometimes, its all good.

Dann

Every time req fuel has been off for my friends and I, it has been a mater of inccorect dead time settings.

Unfortunately the EFR's wastegate discharge does not allow much more than a small nut and washer below it as it interferes with the stud.

I ended up using Stage 8 on three of the four studs and just used a OEM nut from Nissan on that one stud. Held up well.

Great build!

added a flex fuel sensor, headed to the dyno tomorrow. still only on 5lb spring pressure.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b6cbba1c9b.jpg

Did you ever solve the reqFuel issue? I just bought ID1000s yesterday and am going to be installing them soon. What MS settings are you running for them?

i put reqfuel back down to 3, but had to double
my fuel table. Should figure it out today.

You need specific EFR studs.

@Savington at TSE makes some.

No, even with my TSE studs the stage 8 hardware didnt want to go on. It would fit over the stud just fine, but there wasnt enough clearance for the big teardrop peice to fit next to the turbo. I had to cut some material off.

Oh yeah, I ground the shit out of my stage 8 downpipe bolts.

I have the tse stud/stage 8 kit. I'll just file down the locks a bit to fit.

Yah ur gonna have to do that. After my track day I noticed that they fell off somehow. :dunno:

See above. Still won't fit.

Nissan's studs are Inconel and are ~$4-5 vs a full TSE stud kit. It's worked just fine for me with standard hardware. I also ended up using Norlock washers and after 8-9 trackdays (one with 100+ degree outside temps for the entire day), no issues with backing out. I also made sure to hang the downpipe correctly and that alleviated a majority of my problems. I was also only 3-320 WHP on my 240, so also not full 400WHP heat issues.

Backing out isn't the issue we use inconel studs to solve. The issue that miata's have with studs is them stretching. It is also people who are a good bit faster then spec miata times that have the issues.

Not sure what I'm seeing. The TSE EFR studs take that into account. IIRC one is shorter than the rest.

aidandj, The issue is not with stud length, but with the locking hardware. The Stage 8 stuff is a fair bit taller (considering the locking shank or whatever it is called) is itself 1-2 mms thick. Anything apart from a standard nut, regardless of stud length, suffer from a severe lack of room. The wastegate discharge runs right over one of the studs in most cases.

Here is an example. A shorter stud does help, but not with Stage 8 or any other hardware that adds height. It seems the TSE kit uses the standard locking hardware as well. I am not seeing where they include a shorter stud?? According to their directions

But I could also be very wrong. I am sure Savington will tell me if I am incorrect. But from my experience, using the Stage 8 hardware was a no-go on the side with the wastegate discharge. I also had my housing ceramic coated, so I wasn;t doing myself any favors either.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...6c8dcc4d79.jpg



The stretching is a precursor to them stretching and unwinding the nuts and then the studs themselves backing out entirely from the flange.

The SR20DET (what I used for track days and such) guys have suffered this just as long, if not longer, than Miata guys. I am on the throttle at Summit main a fair bit with just 200 TW tires for it to be problem for me initially.

You have it right. We actually verified nominal dimensions with both Borg Warner and Stage 8 before releasing our final EFR kit. The tightest allowable specification in that location (under the WG discharge, or what I usually refer to as "rear lower") is 8mm, the same as what Stage 8 nuts are supposed to be. On the tightest housings, you will see a machining pass there that's exactly 8mm. Many of the newer shell-mold turbine housings I've seen have a lot more room than that. Yours actually has plenty of room there - at least 10mm if those are 1.25mm threads. IOW, you could have used Stage 8's nut there. I put a little Resbond on that nut and it's fine, but you can use a Nissan copper locker as well. The Stage 8 locking tabs fit everywhere else with just a little trimming to clear your particular turbine housing as necessary.

Thanks savington. I had had several housings with the varying molds and I have had the pleasure (or displeasure.......) of experiencing all of them :D. That directly affected the effective volume one had available in that specific area.

The picture above is not mine directly, but was one of the newer housing molds for reference. The older molds made it impossible in that area.