LSx coil thread
 

OK ladies,

It's time for a thread consolidating all this stuff.

There are a few variants of LSx coils, bbundy has posted pics and part numbers here.

GM#12573190 ACDelco D514A LS2/LS7 Corvette:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

GM#10457730 ACDelco D585 LS2 Truck:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

GM#12611424 ACDelco D510C LS?:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

GM#12558948 ACDelco D580 LS1/LS6:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

The general consensus says the LSx truck coil (D585) is the best, followed by the non-truck LS2/LS3 coil (D510C, D514A), then the LS1 coil (D580). I'm sure this isn't an exhaustive list of all LSx coils but these are the common ones people are running.

If you want to use the FM bracket, you'll probably want the D510C.

They are all much beefier than our OE coils or the Toyota coils.

Mounting

You can buy the D510C LS2 mounting bracket from Flyin' Miata for $44.95, part # 26-04320. The part # for the Magnecor 5mm leads is 26-04075. These parts suit 1994-2000 cars (non-VVT). You can buy additional parts from Flyin' Miata to replace the VVT hard line to let you run this bracket on a VVT engine.

The instructions for their full kit can be found here:
http://www.flyinmiata.com/support/in...ra%20coils.pdf

Keep in mind that the FM mounting bracket won't work with the EGR pipe in place, and may get in the way of coolant reroutes.

Wiring

If you are retaining all the factory wiring you will need to wire these as wasted spark:

A - grounded on engine

B - existing ground wire on coil connector loom
C - existing trigger wire on coil connector loom (trigger wire on coil connector 1 goes to both 1/4 GM coils, trigger wire on coil connector 2 goes to both 2/3 GM coils)
D - existing +12v wire on coil connector loom

These coils don't provide a tach output.

Here is a wiring diagram from swimming108:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

Here is a schematic from Megasquirt Sequencer Coils:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421734334

Dwell settings and optional capacitors

Taken from Megasquirt Sequencer Coils:

Disclaimer

None of this is my work, I've just brought together useful things found on this site. I haven't tested anything above first hand but have tried to verify everything from at least two sources.

Please post the type of coil you are running and how you have things mounted and wired!

Cheers

A+ post especially since I was just looking into LS coils more in depth for my build as it comes closer to putting things together. Props given

Here is my wiring for the D514A
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421735191

Thanks for gathering this information into one thread.

Something to amend is that the FM bracket does not work with all the different coils shapes. They designed their bracket for the thin rectangular coil (looks to be the LS7 version). I had my suspicions and Curly now has his bracket for sale in the classifieds because his round truck coils don't fit.

Great info. Another tidbit to add would be how to get the tachometer back since the coils don't have a tach output.

Yup, FM's bracket only works with the D510C coils. Seen here:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421790537

The issue with the D514A coils and FM's bracket can be seen here:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421790537

There's a chance it could fit with some longer spacers, and some clever custom work. I might dick around with the MSM engine sitting in my garage, but it's definitely not going to work off the (FM's) shelf.

I bought 8 D514A coils and 8 wiring pigtails all off ebay for a total of $136.93, or $68.47 per 4 cylinder engine. Previously on Blaen99's engine, I made temporary mounts seen here:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1417391883

This was using the popular $75 NGK spark plug wire kit for 90-97 miatas, not FMs. I'm mocking up the same setup on my own car with the bigger red Magnacores. I'll let you know how that works soon.

For brackets, I'll be using a custom Singular Motorsports bracket, kindly designed to my specifications by ThePass. I'll have a few sets soon, one for myself, one for Blaen99, and another for the other 4 coils/pigtails I have. They'll be for sale soon. And I think he plans on selling them through Goodwin after I get a few prototype sets. But the should be compatible with 1.6, NA1.8, NB1, NB2, and MSM valve covers.

What boost level are these necessary over Toyotas if at all? Curly did you have issues with the Toyota COPS you had or are you switching for the bling factor.

I can only assume that all the coils share the same connector?
Home » Shop » Connectors / Harnesses » Delphi / Packard » Pigtails » GM Delphi / Packard - 4 way GT 150 3.5mm Centerline male connector Pigtail for some GM truck ignition coils (index keyway)

http://www.bmotorsports.com/shop/pro...&wx=640&hx=480

I think the LS1 coil gets plugged in upside down compared the other coils, no difference in wiring just spin the plug 180 degrees.

Can anyone confirm?

I believe they are all the same, yes. Same as the ones that fit my coils pictured above.

Curly,

Would you mind sharing your design idea?

I'm working with VVT and have no plans to castrate the oil lines. I'm currently eyeing the driver side of the back of the head.

Just buy some threaded rod that fits through the holes and a length of aluminium tubing that slides over it and can be cut to the required spacing lengths. You'll probably have to re-make one of the L-brackets too to allow the base to bolt into place (or both if you're A N A L like me and want it centred properly).

Tried that today. You can't run them with the wire plug and harness plug on the inside, they'd have to be waaaay over towards the intake side. In order for it to work, it'll look like this:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421811274

And sticks this far out from the head:

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/e...psl62vjxzw.jpg

Don't think we have that kinda room before the firewall.

Is there enough room to mount them on top of the rocker cover, using the manifold bolts to mount the brackets to?

Man, why didn't I think of that?!?

https://www.miataturbo.net/diy-turbo...ing-vvt-82085/

It might be the basis of the Singular Motorsport kit.

Why not just mount them on top of the valve cover using the same four holes that the stock cops use for 01+? I have seen this done before and it is super simple. No special bracket required. You just need a bolt and some nuts.

WooHoo - confirmation that I'm not so old that I've lost my visual-spatial ability!

Is that compatible with 90-05 and does it work with common NA NGK wires?

Here's how I mounted mine. Nothing fancy.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421829841

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421829841

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421829841

This is mine before re-doing the plug wires:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1416405705

Bracket courtesy of HHammerly. Coils are the Delco units from the "flex fuel" trucks. Mitsubishi coils were much easier to find but don't supposedly make as much power and bolt up differently.

Here is how I mounted mine. D585 LS2 truck coils wired in sequential and being run by a DIYPnP. The wires are from a 2004 corvette and work great. I designed the bracket in SketchUp and cut it out on a laser cutter at work out of stainless steel. I may redo it in the future but for now it works great. It is held on by the 3 middle bolts of the valve cover.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421866075

http://i462.photobucket.com/albums/q...FFF8EF6F17.jpg

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421866075

Looks like you could make the wire holes and the PCV cutout much smaller. Nice looking bracket though.

The design of these brackets in post #18. 19, and 20 are definitely much different than the 3 coil variations that allow you to mount the coils with two pieces of all-thread/long bolts.

I've seen somewhere on MT where someone bolted the coils to each other and then directly to the valve cover I think without any bracket, forget where I saw that though.

Also, is every one running the 4.5ms dwell as suggested in the first post of this thread? I wired up my coils yesterday and I think I blew one, I'm wondering if it was a bad coil or dwell related. I haven't revved past ~3,000 and only in my garage so far, seems weird.

Also this:

Is wired like this:

A - existing ground wire on coil connector loom
B - lol wat? I'm just sitting here doing nothing...

Should I fix this asap?

One thing I want to add is that Magnacore will make you custom spark plug wires to the lengths you need for about $100, and they include a life time warranty.

This kit of ends to match the coils cost ~$15 and has the ability to work with your existing stock plug wires and has enough (8) to do two sets if you ever buy more wires later. Trim your existing wires to fit (or any others you may like).

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421869195

There's nothing keeping you from removing the LS2 coils from their metal cages and welding the things together.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421875394

I bolted mine together with allthread, welded them all together, then cut off the ears with holes so I could fit them behind the head and firewall. Then welded a straight piece of 1" flat stock as a mounting point, pretty easy. The way it's set up I can tighten the coils up in the metal cage so they don't rattle, yet sill bend it back to easily remove them. I put them on an angle so there's slightly more room on the back of my head for reroute stuff. I can fit my hand back there if need be, under the coils.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421875394

The coils are easy to reinstall, and can easily be switched out if any go bad. Putting them in the stock location meant I could reuse my stock plug wires without even cutting them or having them look unnecessarily long. The contact point of the LS2 coil is quite a bit smaller than the miata, probably half as large. If you are careful, you can separate the coil side of the plug boots from the wire, then you can rework the contact so it fits the LS2 tightly. The contact point needs to be more exposed from the boot than factory. To get it perfect, I just install the metal contact, then slip the boot down over the coil. Screw $100 plug wires :fawk:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421875394

And that's how I did LS2 coils for ~$75 in coils and harness. I already had the coils from my LSx truck days, so free coils! :giggle:

Update on my dead coil:

Seems to be a wiring pigtail issue. If I pushed down on the pigtail, #3 cylinder would fire up. I dismantled the pigtail, and the clips used in these:

New GM Ignition Coil Connectors Wiring Pigtail LS2 LS7 D581 D585 Truck RX8 | eBay

do NOT fit snuggly on the pins of the coil, therefore you're relying on the tip of the pin to transfer the ground, power, and signal. I don't think my #3 coil was doing so, but by pushing down on the pigtail, the sides were finally touching and I had a 4 cylinder again.

Whether or not my cheap ebay coils or my cheap ebay pigtails are to blame is still up for debate. I'd love for one of you fellas to get a good, in-depth shot of the coil pins, so I can compare size.

In the mean time I'll be hunting for higher quality pigtails to see if there's a difference.

I currently run 4.2ms of dwell. I was running 3.5ms before but was having intermittent misfires at higher boost and rpm. I turned it up to 4.2ms just to try it and it got a little better. What fixed it was switching from stock miata plug wires to the Corvette wires. The miata wires I had to make the coil end connector much smaller and it still wasn't getting a very good connection so I guess at higher rpms it started arcing instead of going down the plug wire. These new wires fit nice and tight on the LS coils and click into place. The spark plug ends are very small but using a screwdriver to push down on them and they click into place on the spark plug and are nice and tight. Now I have no more high boost/rpm misfires.

A- grounds directly to the block.
B- is the signal ground which is suppose to go back to the signal ground on the Megasquirt. However myself and others run A and B together and ground directly to the block and it works just fine. I've been running them like this since last June and no problems. I am about to redo the wiring harness for the coils so I'm going to run B back to the sensor ground on the DIYPnP like your suppose to. Right now I have all 8 grounds from the coils soldered together and then soldered into a 2 gauge ring terminal that I have bolted to the back of the head.

This work? These should be OEM.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421879690

Here's mine.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1408857850

Thank you. If anything, it appears as though the clips they used don't have a tongue inside that extends down to drag on the coil's pins. That last sentence was very sexual btw. Mine are very much a hot dog in a hallway.

Aren't they going to vibrate like mad?

If only one long edge of the bracket is mounted, the vibrations from the mounted edge get magnified through to the other long edge.

Here's my setup D514A with FM mount. Had to do a little massaging on the mount but it fits. No problems whatsoever.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1421882277

I picked up these pigtails :

New GM Ignition Coil Connectors Wiring Pigtail LS2 LS7 D581 D585 Truck RX8

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...121_172902.jpg

Picture-ception :rofl:


They fit VERY snugly on the pins of my Junkyard LS2 Truck coils...

Now if only I would install these coils.... :loser:

The plugs themselves are SUPER tight on the coils.

It's the metal pins themselves, once removed from the plug, that I feel should be snug on the metal pin of the coil. That's my issue.

I pulled mine apart and checked. All seem pretty snug. No wiggle or theatrics involved. Maybe I got a decent set? :dunno:

No way of testing them to see if wiggling causes misfires though. These aren't installed.

I need to just sack up and buy an OEM harness off Ebay.

4X LS1 LS6 GM Ignition Coil Pack Connector Plug Set D580


Pigtails of above connector

These look to be the OEM-style pin connectors, as opposed to the white type we have. Couldn't find them in pig-tails though.

Edit : found pigtails.

Bought. If this doesn't test my crimping skills I don't know what will.

At the very least it'll be a quick test with the pins already out of the connector.

I assume you're using a nice racheting crimper? Otherwise go get one too :)

I'd trust these guys to crimp them properly, and this is $32 for the set:
Home » Shop » Connectors / Harnesses » Delphi / Packard » Pigtails » GM Delphi / Packard - 4 way GT 150 3.5mm Centerline male connector Pigtail for some GM truck ignition coils (index keyway)

You can custom order with longer wire on the pigtail if required.

I've bought stuff from them in the past (ironically for my Toyota COP conversion) and their work was top notch.

Cheers

I do have a nice crimper, I'll let you know how this goes. For the record, the old ones clipped onto the coil great, and the crimps inside the one I took apart were gorgeous. The metal pins themselves were just huge in comparison to the pin of the coil.

Just got my new DIY-clips in yesterday. New one on top, old one on bottom.

Attachment 184445

Excuse my dirty, cut up hands.

You can see the tongue I'm talking about that's missing from the lower pin. It's not that folded piece, cause that's completely flat on all 16 pins, and about half the length as the tongue on the other pins. These were also for a D580 coil, so they won't fit my D514a coils, I'll just have to reuse the clip bodies with the new metal pins. They're very firm on the coil's pin when pushed on.

Sweet. Thanks for trying them out Curly! +1.

I'll have to order up a set of pigtails for my coil-setup for peace of mind.

Just make sure to get the right clips, these only work for me because I have the bodies of the old clips.

So now we know the D580 LS1/LS6 coil uses a different plug, I wonder if all the others are the same? I'll be able to see if a 585 plug fits on the 510 when my stuff arrives.

Received my D585 pigtails today, now just waiting for the coils:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1423481975

So I received my used wiring harness from ebay a few days ago, and finally got a chance to wire them up.

First off, it appears GM uses sequential ignition from the factory, as all 8 signal wires have a different color.

Secondly, they use hockey tape to wrap their harness and that is incredibly frustrating.

However, they slid in very smoothly and clipped in confidently. They also fired my plugs in test mode from 800-14000 rpms. With the ebay pigtails, I could wiggle the plugs and they'd intermittently shut off. These ones didn't do this once. I'm incredibly happy.

If anyone's interested in the D580 wiring kit I purchased, let me know.

I can now confirm the D585 plug fits the D510C coil fine.

Th weird thing is I bought 4 new coils from a US supplier and they were advertised as genuine ACDelco. It looks like they have scratched the ACDelco branding off:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1423732377

Can you think of why they would do this? Seems dodgy!

Has anyone seen this before?

Cheers

I took some more pics in better light:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1423784607

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1423784607

The quality of the plastics seem decent, the molding of the electrical connector is high quality and the resin on the back looks normal.

It's a bit hard to tell from the first picture alone but it definitely used to say ACDelco on there.

The second pic shows it seems to have the correct code (H6T55272ZC) to be a Mitsubishi made ACDelco unit?

It just seems so bizarre!

Cheers

I'm going to go ahead and use these coils. I've bought some "OE equivalent" BMW parts before (thermostats, control arms etc) and they look exactly like the original part but have the BMW logo ground off, it may be a similar deal.

I just did a test fit of my D510C coils on the FM bracket:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1424133740

I'll be working on the harness next.

Cheers

The original LS1 diagram posted in this thread should have been followed by a LS2 diagram - this is important since the tab is on the opposite side (ie. the pins are reversed between the LS1 and LS2).
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1424172796

Here's the Wasted Spark MSM wiring diagram I whipped up last night (does not include the 1.0uF capacitors) since I'm hoping to install my D514As on the weekend:
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1424171967
- hope it helps but PLEASE let me know if I've F U C K E D it up.

Looks good to me.

I can't edit the first post but I agree that the LS2 schematic should be added.

Cheers

Since I'm going all out with coils I figured I may as well give them decent power, so I went with JasonC's capacitor recommendation. They fit nicely into the nooks between the coils at the bottom of the FM bracket:

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1425045711

I used two 25v 4700uF 105c capacitors.

Could you do a consolidated writeup on your coil setup, so that all the information that is relevant to it is in one single post :D :D :D

Are the capacitors really necessary?

I am running without them and don't seem to have any problems.

Seems like that mounting spot was made for the capacitors.

Suggested improvement: You've clad them in black heatshrink to pad them a bit from the zip-ties - this will make it harder to determine when they're dying (ie. you wont be able to see them blistering). Clear heatshrink!

Oh lala.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1425081920

Finally pics of the elusive Singular mount! It looks very similar to what I'm planning on putting together. Congrats!

Curly does that clear the hood?

I have mine in front of the head and the wires barely clear the hood... So I am having a hard time imagining that clearing...

If it does. Sweet!

I originally had the D585 coils and needed to mount them "curly-style" due to my 3-point strut brace being "in the way". The mountings tabs on the D585s make them taller than the D514As and they were too close for comfort in touching the hood/bonnet so I bought the D514As which will provide more clearance.

The hood/bonnet curves downwards too so there's more clearance at the rear than the front.

It should clear the hood, yes. I have three sets, one for me, one for Ed's VVT, and one for Blaen99's VVT. I'm not sure if Singular is planning on making more or not, it's a bit of a niche market for these.

They'll also fit 1.6, NA 1.8, 99-00, VVT, and MSM valve covers. Who knows about any ford/capri covers.

I'll have more clear pictures and of more valve covers soon, I'm on 12 hour shift 3 of 3 since I've gotten them, barely had time to throw them on Ed's new head before bringing it to the machine shop.