Project long overdue( DIY KIT ADVICE NEEDED)
11-03-2006, 10:11 AM
#22
How long did it take for yours to come apart?
Mine (just like the XS above) was $60 never used from the first owner who feared using it. Both flanges were perfectly flat per a machinists edge. I've got almost 800 miles on mine and its sees max boost every time I go out (because I'm DLing for tuning). I wonder if track duty is what killed yours. A buddy of mine had racing mazda modify their tubular header with gussets and it still came apart after 3 20 minute sessions at a track event. I think the abuse a turbo setup sees at a track event is about 20 times what it gets on the street or at the strip. IMO that's where manufacturers need to test their parts if they want to know just how good they are. - rob
Mine (just like the XS above) was $60 never used from the first owner who feared using it. Both flanges were perfectly flat per a machinists edge. I've got almost 800 miles on mine and its sees max boost every time I go out (because I'm DLing for tuning). I wonder if track duty is what killed yours. A buddy of mine had racing mazda modify their tubular header with gussets and it still came apart after 3 20 minute sessions at a track event. I think the abuse a turbo setup sees at a track event is about 20 times what it gets on the street or at the strip. IMO that's where manufacturers need to test their parts if they want to know just how good they are. - rob
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 11:18 AM
#23
Boost Czar
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 79,501
Total Cats: 4,080
yes, the track killed my car twice. actually ripped a hole in my DP and completely warped and craked my manifold. Mild steel JGS log type.
I'm just saying the XS-power stuff is known to be thin and weak.
I'm just saying the XS-power stuff is known to be thin and weak.
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 01:03 PM
#24
What's odd is the only Miata specific problems I've found with those manifolds are the flanges not being flat. Once fixed, they seem to work fine. Mine didn't need anything, except work to fit the FE3 (port widening, drill and elongate some bolt holes). I think Mark was going to or did run one. - rob
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 04:42 PM
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,380
Total Cats: 2
While it's true that the wastegate port is in a sucky location, the bottom line is that it will work, although I had to relocate mine to fit the 38mm Tial wastegate I have. The stainless steel is thick enough but the manifold is still suspect in my mind as mine showed up with warped flanges.
In reality, I think it's a better manifold than many give it credit for being. My car just started up yesterday but a new flange is getting welded on for the new turbo to the downpipe. It should be interesting to see how the Ghettocharger does. After all the turbo kit itself is extremely low buck.
I have a $200 Turbo, $250 Manifold (although I got mine for $0.) and a $200 intercooler with $75 in piping. Of course it's surrounded by a $2000 TEC-IIIR with 880cc/min injectors and a built 1.8 motor and head.
All total spent so far:
AEM WB $240
Tial Wastegate $200
Piping $75
Engine $1800
Intercooler $200
Turbo $200
Manifold $250
Engine Management $2000
Total $4965
Not exactly ghetto anymore. Removing the engine management and built engine, would reduce the costs to $1165 for the turbo kit so far.
Mark
PS - Damn, I could have purchased an FM kit.
In reality, I think it's a better manifold than many give it credit for being. My car just started up yesterday but a new flange is getting welded on for the new turbo to the downpipe. It should be interesting to see how the Ghettocharger does. After all the turbo kit itself is extremely low buck.
I have a $200 Turbo, $250 Manifold (although I got mine for $0.) and a $200 intercooler with $75 in piping. Of course it's surrounded by a $2000 TEC-IIIR with 880cc/min injectors and a built 1.8 motor and head.
All total spent so far:
AEM WB $240
Tial Wastegate $200
Piping $75
Engine $1800
Intercooler $200
Turbo $200
Manifold $250
Engine Management $2000
Total $4965
Not exactly ghetto anymore. Removing the engine management and built engine, would reduce the costs to $1165 for the turbo kit so far.
Mark
PS - Damn, I could have purchased an FM kit.
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 05:13 PM
#29
I don't think they're welding the tubes on with the flange bolted down, OR if they are they're unbolting it before it cools. These guys are probably being paid by how many headers the make a day.
It's crazy that your Chinese turbo is cheaper than my used turbonetics t3/t4 (or buying and rebuilding). I'm curious to see how it goes. I had a rebuilt t3/t4 that lasted about 30 seconds under boost. It used a Chinese center section with "supposed" Garrett internals. I took it apart and the internals were ground to crap. It looked like a tolerance issue to me (oiling setup is the same now w/o issue). Whether it was the rebuild or the casting, I don't know.
btw- as a bonus- if your Miata is ever stolen and thieves grind off your VINs, you've always got a serial number on your turbo for identification. I wonder if they ask for the number if you have a need for warranty servicing? - rob
It's crazy that your Chinese turbo is cheaper than my used turbonetics t3/t4 (or buying and rebuilding). I'm curious to see how it goes. I had a rebuilt t3/t4 that lasted about 30 seconds under boost. It used a Chinese center section with "supposed" Garrett internals. I took it apart and the internals were ground to crap. It looked like a tolerance issue to me (oiling setup is the same now w/o issue). Whether it was the rebuild or the casting, I don't know.
btw- as a bonus- if your Miata is ever stolen and thieves grind off your VINs, you've always got a serial number on your turbo for identification.
I wonder if they ask for the number if you have a need for warranty servicing? - rob
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 07:45 PM
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,380
Total Cats: 2
I don't think they're welding the tubes on with the flange bolted down, OR if they are they're unbolting it before it cools. These guys are probably being paid by how many headers the make a day.
It's crazy that your Chinese turbo is cheaper than my used turbonetics t3/t4 (or buying and rebuilding). I'm curious to see how it goes. I had a rebuilt t3/t4 that lasted about 30 seconds under boost. It used a Chinese center section with "supposed" Garrett internals. I took it apart and the internals were ground to crap. It looked like a tolerance issue to me (oiling setup is the same now w/o issue). Whether it was the rebuild or the casting, I don't know.
btw- as a bonus- if your Miata is ever stolen and thieves grind off your VINs, you've always got a serial number on your turbo for identification. I wonder if they ask for the number if you have a need for warranty servicing? - rob
It's crazy that your Chinese turbo is cheaper than my used turbonetics t3/t4 (or buying and rebuilding). I'm curious to see how it goes. I had a rebuilt t3/t4 that lasted about 30 seconds under boost. It used a Chinese center section with "supposed" Garrett internals. I took it apart and the internals were ground to crap. It looked like a tolerance issue to me (oiling setup is the same now w/o issue). Whether it was the rebuild or the casting, I don't know.
btw- as a bonus- if your Miata is ever stolen and thieves grind off your VINs, you've always got a serial number on your turbo for identification.
I wonder if they ask for the number if you have a need for warranty servicing? - robNow as far as it doing ok, so far so good... no boost on it, but it seems to be functioning ok, yes the car is running again. I should know more once the new flange is on the downpipe and the car ready for battle with the dyno.
As far as the turbo, it has a one year warranty, and I have about as much faith in that warranty as I do in the Dhali Lama coming to visit me.
Mark
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 10:24 PM
#31
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 536
Total Cats: 0
Well it's going to be interesting, obviously having good clearances is critical to it fundtioning properly. This has a "chinese" center section but looks so Garrett like that I can't tell the difference between it and the real thing. Outside the crude method of balancing it's hard to tell.
Now as far as it doing ok, so far so good... no boost on it, but it seems to be functioning ok, yes the car is running again. I should know more once the new flange is on the downpipe and the car ready for battle with the dyno.
As far as the turbo, it has a one year warranty, and I have about as much faith in that warranty as I do in the Dhali Lama coming to visit me.
Mark
Now as far as it doing ok, so far so good... no boost on it, but it seems to be functioning ok, yes the car is running again. I should know more once the new flange is on the downpipe and the car ready for battle with the dyno.
As far as the turbo, it has a one year warranty, and I have about as much faith in that warranty as I do in the Dhali Lama coming to visit me.
Mark
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 10:44 PM
#32
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,380
Total Cats: 2
So you guys are saying it is a cheap manifold? I wanted to go with the Begi but this came with the motor plus its brand new and looks good the welds and everything looks like a clean job. But the wastegate is in a bad area? I thought #4 cylinder was the most supposed to have the wg closest to it?
It should function fine for you, but in my case the Tial wastegate would not fit because it hit the valve cover. I had to cut it off and move it slightly so that I could use the Tial wastegate. I still have my Tial off the #4 runner.
So don't go thinking it's horrible, but I also had to relocate my water lines and power steering pump lines in order to run this manifold. It runs too close for my comfort to some pretty important lines.
Mark
Reply
0
0
11-03-2006, 10:46 PM
#33
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 536
Total Cats: 0
It is a cheap manifold, but the welds on mine looked ok, albeit the collector was a bit sloppy. The wastegate is in a suboptimal area. The wastegate should be attached at the collector, this should not prove to cause any problems it's just not the location your would chose given the choice to put it anywhere.
It should function fine for you, but in my case the Tial wastegate would not fit because it hit the valve cover. I had to cut it off and move it slightly so that I could use the Tial wastegate. I still have my Tial off the #4 runner.
So don't go thinking it's horrible, but I also had to relocate my water lines and power steering pump lines in order to run this manifold. It runs too close for my comfort to some pretty important lines.
Mark
It should function fine for you, but in my case the Tial wastegate would not fit because it hit the valve cover. I had to cut it off and move it slightly so that I could use the Tial wastegate. I still have my Tial off the #4 runner.
So don't go thinking it's horrible, but I also had to relocate my water lines and power steering pump lines in order to run this manifold. It runs too close for my comfort to some pretty important lines.
Mark
Why don't you just put a heat shield on it? Btw I've been thinking about just changing the pistons+H Rods. Anybody mind throwing some brand names at me to give me an idea. Also what do you guys think about changing the pistons + H rods ?
Reply
0
0
11-04-2006, 06:52 AM
#35
I'm Miserable!
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: QLD, Australia
Posts: 44
Total Cats: 0
You could run 250 alright on the stock engine... 300 would have to be babied a bit, or it might not last long...
The B series engines are factory turbo engines and are boost friendly. Up to 15 PSI if you are kind to your engine (yes drive it hard, but don't thrash it) then it will have a few miles in it. 15 or over and it won't last long.
The B series engines are factory turbo engines and are boost friendly. Up to 15 PSI if you are kind to your engine (yes drive it hard, but don't thrash it) then it will have a few miles in it. 15 or over and it won't last long.
Reply
0
0
11-04-2006, 10:47 AM
#36
a buddy of mine has been running 270rwhp for five years on a 1.8, AVO turbo and Link ecu. He does about 5 track events a year and it still runs well. Good tuning does a lot for longevity.
I would have had the same issues Mark did with the manifold, but I had to modify all my coolant (rad/heater) lines anyway. The welds look good on mine, but the inside is not pretty. Both my flanges were flat by my machinists edge and haven't leaked since that last turbo install ~500 miles. And I've got no gasket between the turbine housing and header. I'm using internally gated turbo. I don't see any reason not to use this if you already have it. It really doesn't take much time to pull the entire turbo off the car. Just realize that once you do use it, everything attached to the turbo is relative to it's position based on the header. So if you swap, you'll changing all that stuff for the new header.
I would have had the same issues Mark did with the manifold, but I had to modify all my coolant (rad/heater) lines anyway. The welds look good on mine, but the inside is not pretty. Both my flanges were flat by my machinists edge and haven't leaked since that last turbo install ~500 miles. And I've got no gasket between the turbine housing and header. I'm using internally gated turbo. I don't see any reason not to use this if you already have it. It really doesn't take much time to pull the entire turbo off the car. Just realize that once you do use it, everything attached to the turbo is relative to it's position based on the header. So if you swap, you'll changing all that stuff for the new header.
Reply
0
0
11-04-2006, 03:49 PM
#37
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 536
Total Cats: 0
a buddy of mine has been running 270rwhp for five years on a 1.8, AVO turbo and Link ecu. He does about 5 track events a year and it still runs well. Good tuning does a lot for longevity.
I would have had the same issues Mark did with the manifold, but I had to modify all my coolant (rad/heater) lines anyway. The welds look good on mine, but the inside is not pretty. Both my flanges were flat by my machinists edge and haven't leaked since that last turbo install ~500 miles. And I've got no gasket between the turbine housing and header. I'm using internally gated turbo. I don't see any reason not to use this if you already have it. It really doesn't take much time to pull the entire turbo off the car. Just realize that once you do use it, everything attached to the turbo is relative to it's position based on the header. So if you swap, you'll changing all that stuff for the new header.
I would have had the same issues Mark did with the manifold, but I had to modify all my coolant (rad/heater) lines anyway. The welds look good on mine, but the inside is not pretty. Both my flanges were flat by my machinists edge and haven't leaked since that last turbo install ~500 miles. And I've got no gasket between the turbine housing and header. I'm using internally gated turbo. I don't see any reason not to use this if you already have it. It really doesn't take much time to pull the entire turbo off the car. Just realize that once you do use it, everything attached to the turbo is relative to it's position based on the header. So if you swap, you'll changing all that stuff for the new header.
I'm glad to hear your friend is having such luck. I think i'm just going to slap on this kit for the time being then replace the internals + tranny + rear end after a few months. I really appreciate you guys taking your time to help me out with this.. I understand there have been tons of people who come here posting the same type of threads then after a few weeks dissapearing and not purchasing what they asked. But I can honestly tell you guys i'm going to be going through with this. I've decided to go with the GT28RS with this manifold I believe it should work. I'll be replacing all the hoses and t bolting everything with new gaskets and fluids to make sure it runs right. I'm curious to see who can tune this thing around here i've been part of the Toyota Supra community for about 5 years now and those guys are in 4 digit mark as far as HP and I know a few tuners for those cars in my area so maybe I can get one of them to tune this.
Update: I've updated the list of the original post so be sure to read and let me know what you think about the mods
Reply
0
0
11-13-2006, 11:59 PM
#38
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 536
Total Cats: 0
Guys I've got an idea.. I'm thinking about building the bottom end of the 1.8 and having a 99+ head put ontop is that a good idea?
also I've updated the list I now have E-Management Blue
also I've updated the list I now have E-Management Blue
Reply
0
0
