Help me make my car reliable. End my misery. - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Engine Performance This section is for discussion on all engine building related questions.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-05-2013, 08:54 PM   #1
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default Help me make my car reliable. End my misery.

I've been fighting an oil leak in the front of my engine ever since I went turbo. I have replaced the crankshaft seal way too many times and even paid to have it replaced to see if it'd go away. It did not.

Using oil dye I was able to spot a trail coming from the crankshaft main. I disassemble the engine... again, hoping to stop this once and for all. I want to finally enjoy the car, but I need to fix this.

I have some pics here



The red is were fresh oil was definitely present. The white lines are what I believe the oil to be coming from as the pulley is swinging as it comes out fo the crankshaft seal.




I am wondering if what I really need to is pulled the engine and reseal the entire pan or I'm simply doing the seal job wrong. Of note, I believe my engine was suffering from a lot of blow-by before I vented the PCV to atmosphere. I cannot think of anything else that can be causing this leak. Opinions? Please help end my misery
Attached Thumbnails
Help me make my car reliable.  End my misery.-oilleak_zps0aec253c.jpg   Help me make my car reliable.  End my misery.-img_1437_zpsfb5a217f.jpg  
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 09:43 PM   #2
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 6,010
Total Cats: 583
Default

I'd do the following:

1. Clean the ^&*( out of the engine. You want it squeeky clean and dry.
2. I assume the dye you used was the blacklight flourescent stuff. If not, get some of that and use it.
3. Re-assemble engine but leave the plastic TB covers off.
4. Start and run engine until the first sign of oil. Be using the blacklight around the front of the engine while you run it.
5. Start from the top of the engine to look for oil leaks. The leak will be from the highest part that has oil seepage.

In my case, it was camshaft seals. Before dye testing, I thought it was my oil pump. Oil pump leak = pull the engine.

Link: https://www.miataturbo.net/general-m...mp-leak-70789/
hornetball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 09:48 PM   #3
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

I did clean the engine. I soaked it with engine cleaner and this is what I got



I have some pictures of the trail which came from right in front of the crankshaft, but due to the light the fluorescence of the dye is not visible. I also inspected the camshafts and saw no oil there. The cam seal were replaced not long ago also.
Attached Thumbnails
Help me make my car reliable.  End my misery.-img_1381_zpsf68b0fdc.jpg  
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 10:02 PM   #4
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 6,010
Total Cats: 583
Default

Well, I'd do it again. You need to get that engine shut off at the first sign of oil. Once the oil hits the crankshaft pulley, it will scatter everywhere making tracking difficult.

Other gotchas:
1. AC bracket bolt that doubles as an oil pump bolt.
2. Oil pump O-ring missing.
3. Oil pump bolts bottoming in their bores.
4. FWD oil dipstick plug missing.
hornetball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 10:08 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 1,196
Total Cats: 12
Default

^ Exactly.



Clean it well, UV dye, and wait. Ever consider the oil pan gasket?
2ndGearRubber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 10:11 PM   #6
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Well, I'd do it again. You need to get that engine shut off at the first sign of oil. Once the oil hits the crankshaft pulley, it will scatter everywhere making tracking difficult.

Other gotchas:
1. AC bracket bolt that doubles as an oil pump bolt.
2. Oil pump O-ring missing.
3. Oil pump bolts bottoming in their bores.
4. FWD oil dipstick plug missing.
1. I installed a bolt there when I removed the AC
2. Don't know
3. Don't know
4. Huh? ...
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 10:13 PM   #7
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2ndGearRubber View Post
Ever consider the oil pan gasket?
Yeah, in my first post I asked if it is just better to pull the engine and do the pan. I got this engine from someone else so I have no way of telling if is something I did or it is something that already existed
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2013, 10:55 PM   #8
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 6,010
Total Cats: 583
Default

I've circled, in yellow, the highest drip I could see in your picture. That is in the area of the oil pump O-ring. However, there is so much oil here that the observation is unreliable.


That link I gave you had a lot of good discussion/pictures on this issue along with further worthwhile links. Might spur some ideas.

If you do decide to pull and reseal the oil pan, then you should also pull and reseal the oil pump. That way you'll know for sure that the oil pump O-ring is installed.

The amount of oil you seem to be getting would indicate a pressurized source, so it probably isn't the oil pan.

I would still repeat the test from a clean, dry engine. You need to shut down at the first indication of oil. Don't wait until so much has leaked that you've got a huge puddle on the ground.
Attached Thumbnails
Help me make my car reliable.  End my misery.-oilleak_zps0aec253c.jpg  
hornetball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 09:27 AM   #9
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,900
Total Cats: 1,792
Default

this could even be cam seals...
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 12:52 PM   #10
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: oceanside,ca
Posts: 64
Total Cats: 0
Default

mine was the cam seals also. the timing belt would throw it all around the inside of the timing cover and i thought it was the crank seal but was wrong. noticed that the timing cover was wet right where the cams were and that fixed my problem. oil went everywhere once it hit the crank pulley after it leaked out of the bottom of the timing cover which made me think it was the crank pulley..... nope
miata94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 01:35 PM   #11
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Granbury, TX
Posts: 6,010
Total Cats: 583
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
In my case, it was camshaft seals.

Link: https://www.miataturbo.net/general-m...mp-leak-70789/
I think I see a pattern. LOL.
hornetball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 02:03 PM   #12
Junior Member
iTrader: (13)
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 498
Total Cats: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Well, I'd do it again. You need to get that engine shut off at the first sign of oil. Once the oil hits the crankshaft pulley, it will scatter everywhere making tracking difficult.

Other gotchas:
1. AC bracket bolt that doubles as an oil pump bolt.
2. Oil pump O-ring missing.
3. Oil pump bolts bottoming in their bores.
4. FWD oil dipstick plug missing.
^^ All of the above. I had the exact same oil leak. Well in my case, it was #2 and I used the wrong o-ring for the oil dipstick. Check your oil pump. That's where the leak is coming from. Since then I replaced the o-ring on the dipstick and added the o-ring on the oil pump. Oil leak fixed.
lsc224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 02:28 PM   #13
I haz no trubo
iTrader: (2)
 
Oscar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bolton, UK
Posts: 3,021
Total Cats: 114
Default

Holy ****, that motor is filthier than the barrio you live in. Pull, clean and rtv the **** out of it
Oscar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 06:38 PM   #14
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

I've did not see any oil markings on the plate in front of the camshaft seals (as in Hornetball's thread pictures). I bought cleaners and dye but I can't seem to find my blacklight now. I'm going to have to order one from ebay because I am not paying $15 for one at a parts shop.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lsc224 View Post
Check your oil pump. That's where the leak is coming from. Since then I replaced the o-ring on the dipstick and added the o-ring on the oil pump. Oil leak fixed.
That means pull the engine right?
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 10:49 PM   #15
Moderator
iTrader: (11)
 
sixshooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 15,686
Total Cats: 1,562
Default

I'm going to say the oil pump O-ring could be a good candidate.

I'm not much help, but if you get bored I'll be driving on the track at Homestead on Sunday and you could come by and say hi. I don't know if Hooked On Driving allows passengers.
sixshooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 11:10 PM   #16
Junior Member
iTrader: (13)
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 498
Total Cats: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by buffon01 View Post
That means pull the engine right?
Yes or drop the front subframe.
lsc224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2013, 11:19 PM   #17
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
I'm going to say the oil pump O-ring could be a good candidate.

I'm not much help, but if you get bored I'll be driving on the track at Homestead on Sunday and you could come by and say hi. I don't know if Hooked On Driving allows passengers.
I'm starting to think that is the culprit :/ I just ordered another blacklight flashlight. I feel like just pulling the motor since everything is pretty much apart already

ALSO the amount of oil on my alternator is ridiculous. I've seen other cars with alleged cam/crank seal leaks and the amount of oil on other components in the engine bay is not even close to what I see in mine.
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2013, 12:38 AM   #18
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Livonia, Michigan
Posts: 5,684
Total Cats: 10
Default

Something else to add to the background of the issue. I've had this similar leak happen with two engines now both of which I replaced the headgasket on. The first one never really leak until the gasket was replaced... what did I fudge?
buffon01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2013, 10:01 AM   #19
Junior Member
iTrader: (13)
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 498
Total Cats: 6
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by buffon01 View Post
Something else to add to the background of the issue. I've had this similar leak happen with two engines now both of which I replaced the headgasket on. The first one never really leak until the gasket was replaced... what did I fudge?
It is possible. I have oil leak on my headgasket too. When I installed my headgasket, I had it flipped covering one hole for the oil, which also led to oil starvation to my cylinder head.
lsc224 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2013, 10:16 AM   #20
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,900
Total Cats: 1,792
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by buffon01 View Post
what did I fudge?
everything you touch.


how about this:

clean your motor.
observe where leak is.
fix.
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mystery Engine Trouble. Halp, mt.net! vehicular General Miata Chat 12 09-14-2015 04:17 PM
Project DDoS: '99 "Budget" boost build ProjectDDoS Build Threads 1 09-09-2015 02:52 PM
New Miata owner... need thoughts on bada** interior? mdkimbal Meet and Greet 10 09-08-2015 10:09 AM
Annoying little leaks AlwaysBroken Engine Performance 5 09-06-2015 01:53 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:13 PM.