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Old 03-27-2009, 10:58 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenR View Post
Why not just ban A/C?
If theyre so concern about the enviroment, getting rid of a/c would be of greater benefit, than making emphazis on certain colors of the cars. Besides a/c is over rated it only took me a couple of month to get use to not having it in my car.
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Old 03-27-2009, 01:04 PM   #22
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Jesus...no more wanting to live in Cali.
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Old 03-27-2009, 01:36 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by 96rdstr View Post
I agree.
As far as the graph goes, how much of that is due to cleaner emissions cars in general, and not necessarily the CA emissions? I mean there how many cars were there in LA basin before catalytic converters were even installed on cars or emissions were even a concern? You may be seeing the effect of things being cleaner in general. Not necessarily from the CA standards, but from the car's being cleaner all the way around. The basin will always have smog, the main issue of the problem is where it situated.
the jet stream blows east. actually it's the northeast US that has acid rain problems from the rest of the country's pollution...
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Old 03-27-2009, 02:00 PM   #24
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the jet stream blows east. actually it's the northeast US that has acid rain problems from the rest of the country's pollution...

Actually, it is just Cleveland and Pittsburg 's fault.

They are officially the armpit of America.
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:08 PM   #25
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Yuk, that picture of LA is gross. It looks like that around here sometimes, unfortunately. I remember driving through a valley here and seeing brown clouds floating above the fields and ****.

We only get air stagnation warnings like twice a year though luckily. The jet stream keeps our smog moving east as someone else noted =P
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:22 PM   #26
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Smog filled air grows hair on yur chest.
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:30 PM   #27
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If they ban black cars are they going to pay to have all the black cars painted? Or is this just going to be a ban on new black cars?
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:37 PM   #28
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You also save water because black cars need constant washing.
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:40 PM   #29
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Have they proven the extra pollutants from utilizing an A/C more?

Have they concluded, in a scientific test, that people with black cars use the A/C more than any other color?
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:49 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Vashthestampede View Post
Smog filled air grows hair on yur chest.
this would explain my 4" long nip hair.
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Old 03-27-2009, 04:11 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by 96rdstr View Post
Actually, it is just Cleveland and Pittsburg 's fault.

They are officially the armpit of America.
Don't forget to also give proper credit to Detroit.

The red brick buildings in Cleveland are black with soot unless they are either new or have been pressure washed recently. Kinda depressing. And not related to the use of automotive air conditioning.
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Old 03-27-2009, 04:39 PM   #32
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Cali is simultaneously the best place and the worst place to be a gearhead.
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Old 03-27-2009, 05:01 PM   #33
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Acid rain is caused by all that smug blowing east. If they ban black/dark cars are they also banning...

1. Tar or dark roofing materials, shingles, tiles, etc.
2. Blacktop for roads/parking lots
3. Black car interiors
4. Dark exterior colors for house paint

Maybe CA politicians figure if they get the public in an uproar over little useless crap like this maybe the public will ignore the meaningful stuff, like the state being broke!
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Old 03-27-2009, 05:04 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
Have they proven the extra pollutants from utilizing an A/C more?
I can feel the loss of power when the A/C compressor kicks on, in the Miata, 4runner, and Saturn. Could be because they are all fairly gutless 4-cyls. But intuitively, if I have to open the throttle a bit more to maintain speed or accelerate at the same rate, then I am using more gas to travel the same distance.

Quote:
Have they concluded, in a scientific test, that people with black cars use the A/C more than any other color?
First, there wouldn't be any consistency to that. My dad leaves the A/C on max almost all the time in his white car to get the interior temp down into the 60s, while I in my black vehicles use it enough to get things merely comfortable and then I dial it back.

Second, I would doubt the legitimacy of any "scientific testing" (if any) done by CARB because they are anything but a neutral party.

Quote:
Originally Posted by y8s View Post
...california's smog control programs have reduced smog levels immensely over the last few decades.

Compare that to Denver's measurements of tailpipe emissions. They've had a bit of a smog problem as well, and it's nowhere near as bad now as it was when I lived there in the early 90s. The CA graph shows days exceeding an arbitrary smog standard and the Denver one is actual emissions, but the comparison is valid if we're assuming that vehicles are the major cause of smog.

You'll note a remarkably similar downward trend, yet vehicles in Colorado are not subject to California regulations. One could therefore conclude that vehicles are generally cleaner across the board, and that stringency beyond the federal standards has very little to do with things being cleaner in CA or anywhere else today.

Despite CA's stringent standards, 5 of the top 10 most polluted cities in the country, and 16 of the top 25 most polluted counties in terms of particulates and ozone, are in California. That is recent data (2007/08) from the American Lung Association BTW. If you merely looked at CA's smog graph that ends at 1998 and extrapolated, you might assume that by now, 10+ years later, it would be a Utopia of cleanliness.

And since Vash's comment about the state controlling your thermostat flew mostly under the radar:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/11/us/11control.html
I linked to the NY Times version so the left-wingers will know it's true and unbiased. Every time I see something like that I laugh at CA and the sheeple who allow their govt to control them to that extent.
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Old 03-28-2009, 05:03 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by NA6C-Guy View Post
Just build some big fans to blow the smog northeast into Las Vegas, no one there would be sober enough to notice or care.
Hey... I live there! In northeast las vegas. We are actually starting to have more smog here becuase this city is blowing up, but it's doesnt last but a week or so before the winds blow it all out of the valley anyways.
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Old 03-29-2009, 07:52 PM   #36
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It would be awesome if CA just earthquaked itself off the map.
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Old 03-29-2009, 09:55 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by nam106 View Post
It would be awesome if CA just earthquaked itself off the map.
it would be awesome if you stuck two ***** in your mouth.

also:

Black is back for California drivers (actually, it never left) | Up to Speed | Los Angeles Times
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Old 03-29-2009, 11:27 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y8s View Post
it would be awesome if you stuck two ***** in your mouth.

also:

Black is back for California drivers (actually, it never left) | Up to Speed | Los Angeles Times
Yeah, that would be pretty awesome.

The most foolish part of the story is the lack of understanding by the pollution control fanatics of the basic design of automotive air conditioning systems. Auto A/C compressors are always cycling on and off, but when your car is cooler inside, you are mixing hot air from the heater core to moderate the temperature. So you are cooling the air at the maximum capacity to do so, and then adding a little heat back into it.

In a house, by comparison, you only blow cooled air and then shut off airflow until additional cooling is needed. No mixing occurs.

With the home system, reduced cycling will show benefits in reduced energy usage, but until fundamental changes occur in the design of auto A/C systems, you can't fix it by making a more reflective car.

The policy makers are simply ignorant.
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Old 03-30-2009, 12:59 AM   #39
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I guess the size of the car interior isn't enough thermal mass to maintain a constant enough temperature.

as a crazy environmentalist liberal type, even I know when something is not a significant enough contribution to the greater good to warrant restricting the choice of a color of your car.

it's like this newsletter my gf got that said not to wet your toothbrush before brushing your teeth to save a teaspoon of water. what the ****. how about I just drink 7.75 cups of water a day instead of 8?
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Old 03-30-2009, 10:30 PM   #40
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Is Cheryl Crow still only using one square of toilet paper these days?
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