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Old 09-27-2012, 04:58 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by golftdibrad View Post
It bothers me. And that thing is heavy, no way an ej20, full of water, and a radiator is heavier than that.
Are you kidding me? I can pick up a type 1 longblock (sans alternator / fan / manifolds) by myself. If a fully-dressed EJ20, with radiator and coolant, doesn't weigh twice as much as a fully dressed T1 with fan, I will eat my own hat.

There's more to it than weight, of course. Placing a radiator in a vehicle body not originally designed to accommodate one is rarely done in a manner which is both effective and aesthetically pleasing.
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Old 09-27-2012, 05:08 PM   #42
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Are you kidding me? I can pick up a type 1 longblock (sans alternator / fan / manifolds) by myself. If a fully-dressed EJ20, with radiator and coolant, doesn't weigh twice as much as a fully dressed T1 with fan, I will eat my own hat.

There's more to it than weight, of course. Placing a radiator in a vehicle body not originally designed to accommodate one is rarely done in a manner which is both effective and aesthetically pleasing.
I cant speak to the type1, but my t4 with the 103's.... it was out of the question to pick up alone even with the heads and fan housing off. that thing has got to be pushing 300 lbs as a full longblock.

There is some data on the build thread of the car... let me see if i can find it.

edit: http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewto...p?f=19&t=97449

looks like ~60 based off officially avaiable numbers, maybe a few more for an alternator and radiator, 4 gallons MAX of water (~16lbs)
For DOUBLE the HP. No brainer question.

Last edited by golftdibrad; 09-27-2012 at 05:26 PM. Reason: found it
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Old 09-27-2012, 05:53 PM   #43
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The easiest route is to integrate the entire Miata rear subframe.

Others have designed their own rear control arms and modified the "Book" frame as necessary to locate the pick-up brackets and differential mounting points.

There are also plans for modifying the Haynes chassis for Miata uprights. http://www.ntsengineering.co.uk/asse...Guide-rev3.pdf
If you can design and build the front suspension and independant rear suspension is a piece of cake. Mazda already did all of the work, just change the upper pick-up point geometry to lower the roll center relative to the front and mount the transplated Miata diff.

While alot of people have used the Miata Rear subframe is makes for a heavy car. I know I've run across a thread where someone was using the Miata front subframe as well. I'll have to find it.
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Old 09-27-2012, 06:05 PM   #44
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I know I've run across a thread where someone was using the Miata front subframe as well. I'll have to find it.
This guy in Okinawa, Japan who built an Exo in a shipping container?

LocostUSA.com • View topic - My Tube Frame Miata Subframes build.
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:12 AM   #45
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...change the upper pick-up point geometry to lower the roll center relative to the front...
What does this mean? I feel dumb cause I know nothing about suspension.
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Old 09-28-2012, 10:33 AM   #46
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:50 PM   #47
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Hmm.

(looks at hat.)

I must admit that looking at some of these links, especially the one where the fellow had some pieces of round steel tubing pre-bent into a nice atom-like radius by a local shop for virtually nothing, are starting to tempt me. The more I think about it, the more practical a stretched-and-widened Formula-Vee car is starting to seem.
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Old 09-28-2012, 12:53 PM   #48
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Hmm.

(looks at hat.)

I must admit that looking at some of these links, especially the one where the fellow had some pieces of round steel tubing pre-bent into a nice atom-like radius by a local shop for virtually nothing, are starting to tempt me. The more I think about it, the more practical a stretched-and-widened Formula-Vee car is starting to seem.
are you thinking making a street legal single seater or what?
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:08 PM   #49
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So I read the book from Gibbs last night. While it has a ton of good info in it, building the car from scratch is definitely above my head. I will probably stick with going with some sort of kit to get started when I finally get to building something.
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:16 PM   #50
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are you thinking making a street legal single seater or what?
That would be my dream car, yes. Single-seater, mid-engine, a bit of a storage compartment (for groceries, etc) between the driver and the engine.

Basically, just take a Formula Vee, stretch it by about 18 inches, and widen the driver's compartment by about six inches. And replace the bloody VW front beam and swingaxle rear with A-arms on all corners, using the '68 and later IRS-style transaxle.

Basically, something I'm not qualified to build.
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:34 PM   #51
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That would be my dream car, yes. Single-seater, mid-engine, a bit of a storage compartment (for groceries, etc) between the driver and the engine.

Basically, just take a Formula Vee, stretch it by about 18 inches, and widen the driver's compartment by about six inches. And replace the bloody VW front beam and swingaxle rear with A-arms on all corners, using the '68 and later IRS-style transaxle.

Basically, something I'm not qualified to build.
honestly, its not that hard. It just takes a crap load of time and dedication.

Like I told the FSAE guys the other day, don't get caught up in the details. If the suspension picks ups or off a tad, if the frame is not a torsionaly rigid as you predicted, if the engine makes a few less HP.... it will still be the fastest thing most of you will every drive, save for a shifter kart.
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:50 PM   #52
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honestly, its not that hard. It just takes a crap load of time and dedication.
And the ability to weld.

I can tack a couple of pieces of tubing together to form something which, with sufficient grinding, can plausibly be called an intake pipe. That's about the limit of my fabrication skills in this regard. The thought of driving around in a chassis that I built myself terrifies me.
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Old 09-28-2012, 01:56 PM   #53
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Buying a chassis isn't that expensive in the grand scheme. By the time you figure in materials, a welder, and a means to cut the materials, it is about a wash. Sure, if you want something completely custom it'll cost you, but there are a lot of options. Plenty of builders who make Atom knockoffs, book/caterham frames for reasonable money.

Of course your best bet is to find an unfinished project and go from there.

I though you had an Atom knockoff in the works a while back. What happened to that one?
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:03 PM   #54
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I though you had an Atom knockoff in the works a while back. What happened to that one?
I kind of lost interest.

The guy I was dealing with (the same fellow who built the chassis that golftdibrad has now) got hooked up with some other dude in a business arrangement that seemed a bit smarmy to me- they wanted to turn it into some kind of standard build, and he kept adding on little features and ratcheting the price up.


Around that same time the reality of trying to register a Subaru-powered kitcar with no MSO kind of came down on me.

That's actually one of the biggest appeals to me about the ACVW design- so long as you start with an engine built before 1966, you don't need to worry about the SB100 process. The vehicle will be automatically exempt. (Whether you elect to swap out said engine afterwards with something newer and turbocharged is entirely up to you.)

I'm just dreaming right now. Doubtful I'll be pulling the trigger on anything wild and exotic in the near future. If I *really* get bored, I might just buy an actual Formula Vee car (the older ones are insanely cheap) and just cut it in half and lengthen in.
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:03 PM   #55
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I though you had an Atom knockoff in the works a while back. What happened to that one?
sold it, lost my *** on it. Live and learn, etc, etc. But I still have the green car
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:05 PM   #56
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sold it, lost my *** on it. Live and learn, etc, etc. But I still have the green car
Wait- which car did you sell?
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:07 PM   #57
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Wait- which car did you sell?
I was pretty deep into an MEV rocket.
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:12 PM   #58
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I like how this thread has gone from potential purchases, to dreams of future projects, to the harsh reality of lost money and incomplete builds.
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:15 PM   #59
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I was pretty deep into an MEV rocket.
Huh- I totally missed that.

Glad to hear that the Green Goblin is still with you.
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Old 09-28-2012, 02:17 PM   #60
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I like how this thread has gone from potential purchases, to dreams of future projects, to the harsh reality of lost money and incomplete builds.
Well I am to a large degree of success keeping a kit car on the road and having a ball with it.
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