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Old 07-28-2010, 02:26 PM   #21
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im pretty sad i didn't get quoted...

im eating muenster cheese right this very second too.
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Old 07-28-2010, 03:03 PM   #22
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I'm 6'1", 194 lbs, down from 206 about a year ago. My 3 big changes were:

Nonfat Yogurt + an apple(or other fruit) for breakfast.
No more cookies at lunch or afternoon snacks.
Changed my workout routine to 2 days aerobic, 2 days mixed aerobic/anaerobic every week(my old high school hockey program).

I also try not to completely gorge myself every night, usually successful.

The real suck there was giving up all the wonderful breakfasts like double-egg, ham and cheese sandwiches, grilled bagels with cream cheese, pastries, etc. I was working out anyway, just started doing a better job of it.

The downside is that results are very slow in coming - literally about 1#/month. The upside is that except for the womanly breakfasts, I can pretty much eat what I want. Also, this has become a regular part of my life, so it's not a hassle anymore - however, it took a few months for it to get that way.

Life already sucks too much to give up really good food. I think real Havarti(or emmenthal, or gruyere, or St-Andre, or.....) is worth a few hundred push-ups.
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Old 07-28-2010, 03:47 PM   #23
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I suppose instead of rum you could use a higher-proof alcohol like Everclear, or if you have the hookup, moonshine. A couple shots + one can of diet pepsi and you're set for the whole night.
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Old 07-28-2010, 04:18 PM   #24
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I shall do no such thing. I was once exposed to a product of this nature while dining at a friend's house, and it made me want to stab her in the eye. I'd rather eat a bowl of dicks.
Really, try a different type then... some of them can by rubbery feeling(kind of like a bowl of dicks.)
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:18 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Yes, I took the damned plastic off.
Then you threw away the best tasting part...

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Originally Posted by Preluding View Post
Really, try a different type then.
My wife eats the fat-free substitute American cheeseish product slices. They make me gag. I think they are a synthetic petrochemical product as well.

Mr. Perez, methinks you have met someone who resides quite close to where the Cuban sandwich bread is made fresh daily for most of the local restaurants. Would you like to arrange a special delivery? And proper industrial grade sandwich presses are, of course, a dime a dozen here in The Cigar City, if need ever again arises.

I went from 215lbs to 182lbs (6'1") over the course of two years by a loosely adhered-to combination limiting or eliminating evening meals, eating no fried foods for breakfast (low sugar cereal or oatmeal and occasionally adding fruit), and removing carbonated beverages from my diet (except for tonic water for my Beefeater Gin (all other gin sucks)). I also traded the sweet tea for unsweet with lemon squeezed in it. Lately I have been pushing my habits a bit further by three weekdays forcing myself to eat salads with either no meat or grilled meats, non-creamy dressings(vinaigrette) or Beef O' Brady's (local wing chain) sweet jalapeno wing sauce as the dressing. I always get spicy foods and order extra blackening spices on my blackened chicken salads. I use a lot of pepper. I also try to chew more times before swallowing the food so that I start to feel full sooner through the plate than I would otherwise. I think spices make me think I've eaten more, and can cover some of the mediocrity of eating a salad instead of a steak or hot wings.

BTW- a fellow just yesterday was raving about battered deep fried cheese curds. He was from Wisconsin and was amazed that they weren't a staple of our bar food regimen. He must have raved for twenty minutes. I'll have to try them.
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:38 PM   #26
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Beware people telling you of their favorite bar food. A man once told me about the wonders of cajun boiled peanuts and convinced me to try them. I severely regretted it.
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:51 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Of late, I've been trying to lose a little weight. That picture which I recently posted of myself standing over the engine in my build thread was kind of a wake-up call. It was, I think, the six months I spent in Manhattan last year that did it. Even though I was on my feet all day, we ate like gods every evening and drank an ocean of good beer.

At any rate, things need to change a bit. Nothing over-the-top like crash diet plans, vegetarianism or workout regimes- I'm far too lazy and undisciplined to sustain that sort of lifestyle change for any length of time; I know I wouldn't last. So instead, I decided just to make little incremental changes- things like reducing portion sizes a tad, mixing my rum with diet Coke (actually diet Pepsi- diet Coke turned out to suck), and bringing simple meals to the office for lunch rather than running across the street to one of the fast food joints every day.

Now, one thing which I do happen to enjoy quite a lot is a good sandwich in the evening. Sliced turkey or pork, loads of diced onion and crushed garlic, and two slices of Havarti on coarse-grained bread, grilled on a sandwich press until blackened. Utter heaven. Seriously, giving up this habit would be a major quality-of-life issue for me. I recently quit smoking (going on 3 months now) and I don't think I could bear to part with another vice just at the moment.



I will diverge here for a moment to air a grievance concerning sandwich presses in this country. The recent popularity of Panini-style sandwiches in the US over the past few years has planted in the minds of most Americans the notion that the grilled Panini is prepared upon a ribbed press, which imparts unto the sandwich a peculiar and distinctive striped pattern, and also a uniquely rough texture which I cannot quite put into words.

This is bullshit.

An authentic western-European style sandwich press uses flat plates. It also has a simple but very effective articulated hinge which allows the press to accommodate sandwiches of any thickness while permitting the grilling plates to remain parallel, which prevents the sandwich from being flattened unevenly.

These crappy units that I see everywhere from discount stores to trendy upscale restaurants would make my dear Abuela turn in her grave if she ever saw them. (Fortunately, Wal-Mart had not yet made it to to Hato Rey, PR at the time of her death.) They might be good enough for a washed-out former heavyweight boxer to drain all of the moisture out of his hamburgers with, but if you want to experience a proper grilled sandwich, you need the right tool for the job. Several years ago, while on an assignment in Teaneck, NJ, I finally found a unit which I judged to be of comparable quality to those which I remembered seeing in the various Perez family kitchens as a child. It is made by Breville (ironically, an Australian company) and cost $90. It is worth every penny. Sadly, I have found it quite impossible to procure proper Cuban bread in southern California, however that is a subject best left to a separate rant.



Now, to return to the matter at hand. This evening after work, I was at the supermarket, and one of the items which I needed was cheese. I typically buy the Primo Taglio brand, which despite being the Vons' house brand, is actually rather richer and creamier than Boar's Head or any of the other common name-brands. It is, quite frankly, the best Havarti I have ever found outside of a proper artisan creamery or NY delicatessen. And as it happened, the deli counter at Vons was completely out. The woman behind the counter rather apologetically suggested that they had some O-Organic brand prepackaged Havarti over in the general dairy section. Well, what the hell. I trundled over to that aisle and pulled a pack off the shelf. Apropos of nothing, I flipped the package over and happened to note on the nutritional label that this cheese contained 120 calories per slice, and the slices were considerably thinner and narrower than the ones I typically get at the deli counter. (I like my Havarti really thick. 3mm per slice or so.)

This gave me a moment of pause. That's probably 300-400 calories surplus in an evening the way I make a sandwich. Surely there must be a better way.

So I started browsing around the other prepackaged cheeses and cheese-like products. And I happened to land on Kraft Singles brand American-style artificially flavored nonfat pasteurized prepared cheese product. (I'm copying this straight off the label.)

Ok, I know. This is probably a mistake. But I looked at the back and, hell, 25 calories per slice?! Ok, so the slices aren't quite as large and thick as I'm accustomed to, but hey, that's actually my whole plan to begin with. So I picked up a pack and tossed it in the basket.



Let me be clear: I went into this with reduced expectations. I knew that this probably represented a step down in quality, but small sacrifices are the name of the game here.



I was not prepared for what happened. This product is completely and totally unfit for retail consumer sale.

First off, it liquefies when you heat it. I don't mean that it goes all gooey like Velveeta, it actually turns into a nearly water-like consistency! In other words, I opened the sandwich press to retrieve my bounty and found a nicely blackened sandwich standing in the middle of an ORANGE PUDDLE.

(deep breath)

Ok, I can do this. It's for a good cause. I retrieve the sandwich from the press and flip it onto a plate, being careful not to slosh too much artificially flavored pasteurized prepared cheese product around in the process. I let it cool for a few minutes while sipping my Rum and Diet Pepsi (admittedly, I'm doing OK with that one) and finally pick up the sandwich and take a bite.


Now, I consider myself a reasonably well-educated and intelligent person. I'm no Henry David Thoreau, but I did go to college, got reasonably good marks, I read quite a lot, and I've been known to compose the occasional scholarly paper in the course of my employment.

And yet I find myself utterly unable to describe the horribleness of this gustatory sensation. I simply lack the proper vocabulary for the task. Honestly, there is not a single experience familiar to me with which I can compare the flavor of this product. I doubt rather seriously, in fact, whether there exists within the English language an adjective of sufficient fervency to convey the opprobrium which I harbor towards this product. Perhaps if I were fluent in Arabic I would be able to put into words the sheer magnitude of the contempt which I feel right now (the Arabic people, as a broad generalization, seem to possess a particularly refined aptitude for hating things), though of course only Kotomile would understand.

I imagine that if one were to collect the sweat from ten thousand Bedouin gypsys' ********* into a large basin, add a few drops of the pus from a gangrenous wound, allow a camel to bathe in the resultant broth and then, after it was done, jump in yourself and fart copiously into it at great length, and only then add some yellow food coloring and artificial cheese flavor, that one might then begin to approach the horribleness of this food-like product.

Honestly, I just cannot imagine how the various layers of management, QA, marketing and product qualification which I imagine to exist at such a corporate entity as Kraft Foods would have permitted such a blight to find its way into production. I would stake that if they have ever had but a single repeat customer for this particular item... well, I don't even know how to finish that sentence.

I scoured the packaging, looking for the smallest print which might indicate "satisfaction guaranteed" or some such nonsense. Hell, I didn't even bother writing to Minute Maid to inform them that, speaking from the perspective of someone who grew up in an environment where there were always orange trees in the back yard, their orange juice is nothing at all like "eating a fresh, ripe orange." But this blight on the culinary landscape simply cannot be afforded to remain unchecked.
Jesus Christ Joe!

Here is what you do. Get a laptop and put it on a treadmill. Keep writing threads like that and be one slim and trim M***** F*****.
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:59 PM   #28
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Joe, first off, Miataturbo.net is not a nutrition site. The information you get here is all worthless (I'm rounding up from 99.9%). Get the **** off this forum to figure this out.


Second, the critical thing about human dietary needs is that (and I will bold this):

The human body requires nutritional value AND caloric intake

That is to say that eating purely calories will not satisfy your hunger and you will want more. But if you eat a nutritionally rich meal (dark leafy greens, high protein meats, fruits, berries, nuts, etc) then your body will get the valuables it needs to keep functioning and not be so hungry.

If you eat nutritionally empty crap like carby carb-carb foods or cheap meats, your body will still hunger for them. You'll go back for more shitty food (mcdonalds?) and the cycle repeats until you're fat and almost get what you need to survive.


It's really not that complicated and can be done with a few simple ideas.

  • shop at a local farmers market (if you have one) every week. buy your meats and vegetables there. the stuff produced by small time farmers is more nutrient and FLAVOR dense than mass produced food that is designed to sit in a big truck for most of its existence. grass fed beef (or better yet, bison) has a lower fat content, higher omega 3 content, and significantly higher protein content per unit weight than average store-bought meat. if you dont have a farmer's market, go to whole foods and buy their local/organic stuff.
  • eat your carbs in whole grain form. brown rice instead of white. whole wheat instead of wonder bread.
  • dont buy snack foods (crackers, cookies, chips) for your house; buy fruits (fresh or dried) and nuts.
  • drink only water and beer (and the occasional hard liquor if you want). soda does nothing for nobody. if you need soda in your life, make it hard to aquire--get only cane sugar soda or some other weird rule. dont bother with diet soda, just wean yourself. or replace it with fruit juice (not fruit flavored drink!) and club soda if you need fizz.
  • never have seconds.
  • always order the smallest normal size portion and dont get appetizers / sides.
  • stop eating when you're 80% full
  • put your fork / sandwich / drink down between bites. (this one is HARD but helps with the previous one)
  • go to chipotle. dont get a burrito, get TACOS without beans and rice. seriously this is huge. 3 tacos with just meat, salsa, cheese, and lettuce is about 600 calories. the burritos are just under 1000. and chipotle uses good practices to procure their ingredients. i've eaten dinner with their pork farmer.

I've been trying to "diet without dieting" for a while now. It helps to have a fiancee who works on food production. And getting into some habits that prevent you from eating bad stuff really makes a difference.

I used to be like anyone and gorge myself on chili-cheese dogs 3-at-a-time when my metabolism was better, but it doesn't last (I'm looking at you KPLAFIN). Honestly I dont miss the junk food now that I'm not surrounded by it or eating it regularly. I still get the occasional Arby's Beef 'n Cheddar, but now it's just one and just once in a while.
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:01 PM   #29
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Jesus Christ Joe!

Here is what you do. Get a laptop and put it on a treadmill. Keep writing threads like that and be one slim and trim M***** F*****.
We can say Mother ****** here, mother ******.

Nice thread Joe. I quit smoking almost 4 years ago, good for you.
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:11 PM   #30
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We can say Mother ****** here, mother ******.
I have dropped a few F bombs here. Sometimes the polite side of me comes out.

*******.
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:24 PM   #31
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I like some of your ideas, y8s. Will use...
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:43 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
Joe, first off, Miataturbo.net is not a nutrition site. The information you get here is all worthless (I'm rounding up from 99.9%). Get the **** off this forum to figure this out.
Hahaha. Heck, I only came in here to pen a good, solid rant, as it had been a while since I'd sat down and authored a really proper complaint.
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Old 07-28-2010, 08:20 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Hahaha. Heck, I only came in here to pen a good, solid rant, as it had been a while since I'd sat down and authored a really proper complaint.
in that case, our farmers market has cheese. fresh feta, mozz, cheddar (with dill and bacon in it?!) and a few others.

kraft singles only belong on aforementioned chili cheese dogs.
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Old 07-28-2010, 08:37 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
im pretty sad i didn't get quoted...


Although after y8s' post you'll most likely ignore me, I just wanted to say that the calorie counting is essentially what Weight Watchers is. As NA6C-guy said, fat content doesn't matter quite as much, but what WW did was make a simple formula to consider calories #1, total fat content #2, and trans fat content #3, and then assign a point value. They have a nifty slide calculator like you get when you learn about your company's 401k plan.

Not that you need to join them and pay them $20 to go to a meeting of insecure women every month (god I hope my girlfriend doesn't read this), but you can at least get a hold of their formula easily and use it to help include counting the fat content. Their freezer meals are also cheap, and list the point value in the corner of the box, easily readable since you don't have to pick it up and look at the back of the box.

On a side note, if you lower your standards just a bit, you can use the previously mentioned WW freezed food section to pick up previously mentioned insecure women. Caution: look before you cross.
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Old 07-28-2010, 09:43 PM   #35
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BTW- a fellow just yesterday was raving about battered deep fried cheese curds. He was from Wisconsin and was amazed that they weren't a staple of our bar food regimen. He must have raved for twenty minutes. I'll have to try them.
They are gross. I ate one, felt my proximal left anterior descending coronary artery start to close up, gagged, and threw the rest in the trash.
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Old 07-28-2010, 09:46 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by y8s View Post
Joe, first off, Miataturbo.net is not a nutrition site. The information you get here is all worthless (I'm rounding up from 99.9%). Get the **** off this forum to figure this out.
Do I need to dig out my papers from Human Health and Nutrition? Its only a 207 course, but had some decent insight.
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Old 07-28-2010, 11:29 PM   #37
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I was up to 235 from my, comfortable, 185. Last week, I decided to stop drinking and I've lost 5 lbs. right off the bat. When class starts again, I'll be hitting the gym pretty hard. Ironically enough, it's going to take me moving into my fraternity house to get my **** together.

I decided to start boxing again, ****, three years ago now and dropped 40 lbs in a month in a half by just biking 15 miles every day and 48 miles on Fridays. I got down to 180 but got distracted an never went into the gym. It's taken three years of drinking excessively, smoking almost two packs a day and gorging myself on shitty food to get up to my all-time high of 235.

Oh shitty lifestyle, how I'll miss thee:

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Old 07-28-2010, 11:49 PM   #38
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BREAKFAST-
12 oz fat free skim milk
2 scoops of quality protein powder
1 table spoon of NATURAL peanut butter
1 banana

All blended together, if I don't have banana's then i have 1 slice of low cab whole wheat bread

MID MORNING-
24 almonds
1 small pure protein bar
8oz water

LUNCH-
1 cat of tune in water
1 cup of brown rice
I still need to add a vegetable
8oz of water

LATE AFTERNOON-
2 scoops of quality protein in 12oz of water

PRE WORK OUT-
Either 1 scoop of NO SHOTGON or 1 scoop of 1MR (which ever I remember to bring) with 8oz of water

POST WORK OUT-
1 scoop of quality protein in 8oz water

DINNER-
6-8oz of 1 of the following
Chicken breast (organic)
Turkey breast (organic)
Salmon (careful what you buy here, you don't want farm raised or imported)
Lean steak
or Lean beef
NO PORK, EVER!

One of those with either a cup of spinach, broccoli or a good salad and of course water!.

EVENING SNACK-
1 sugar free Jell-o or 1/2 a cup of fat-free cottage cheese.

RIGHT BEFORE BED-
1 scoop of quality protein n 8oz of water


That's my daily meal plan. I'm sure I stick to it more than 90% of the time. I have a cheat meal here and there. Scott just recently put me onto Chipolte, so if I do eat out for lunch that's where I will go.

Oh, I'm 5'8" and I've dropped from 208 to 182 lbs.
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Old 07-28-2010, 11:51 PM   #39
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You count your almonds!?!

Also- Skippy Natural peanut butter is BA. No mixing, no dry bottom half, no gagging as you eat it.
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Old 07-28-2010, 11:57 PM   #40
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You count your almonds!?!

Also- Skippy Natural peanut butter is BA. No mixing, no dry bottom half, no gagging as you eat it.


1oz of almonds is about 24, so yeah I count them lol.


I've been buying the Smuckers, it doesn't taste that great but since I mix it in my shake it doesn't bother me. I'll look for the Skippy though.
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