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Old 03-17-2006, 11:24 AM   #41
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depends on the application. either of he starions will handle what you're going to throw at the kit.

if it's cooling the intake charge to reduce the possibility of detonation, it's working fine.
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Old 03-17-2006, 11:29 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fergus
So WHAT IS the best IC to use ? Vertical or horizontal core ?
Which of the Starion ICs is better ? I've heard that the smaller one is better than the larger one.
Mitsu - 14 row or 17 row - whatever most say go with the larger.... There must have been a reason why Mitsu changed their design on their turbo application (they have a whole engineering team that works on this kind of thing every day - just see the new Evo VIII)
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Old 03-17-2006, 11:49 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bartsimpson
Mitsu - 14 row or 17 row - whatever most say go with the larger.... There must have been a reason why Mitsu changed their design on their turbo application (they have a whole engineering team that works on this kind of thing every day - just see the new Evo VIII)
Theres engineers that design and then theres engineers that figure out how much money they can save.....
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Old 04-01-2006, 11:13 AM   #44
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are they overpriced maybe maybe not. Lookat other turbo kits. As much as people want to bash FM or their "loylist" some of you are just as bad as the people you talk about. As much as I enjoyed being a Greddy pioneer sometimes I wish i would have gotten a FM or BEGI or another pre-fab kit in the first place. You you save money but not time. Just thinkg about it,pros and cons both ways. Dont be so quick to judge;

now back to enjoying my n/a miata
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Old 04-06-2006, 12:23 AM   #45
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I think FM is a good company that has sort of put the miata on the map and certainly helped increase the aftermarket. There tech support is fairly good and they have been helpful on many occasions. At the same time, many of their products are a bit too expensive, their IC pipes for are hideous, and the local miata mechanic didn't speak very highly of them. I should state that I am using there ECU and it was way too expensive. But I certainly put the rest of my kit together and fabbed it myself.
-Michael-
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Old 04-06-2006, 01:02 AM   #46
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Just being the devil's advocate (as usual ), but I don't see how powder-coated intercooler pipes that clear every bit of air conditioning and power-steering piece can be considered hideous, especially when designed to work with the "vertical" intercooler, as it's become popular to refer to.

Furthermore, I'm not sure why you consider their Link ECU overpriced, when it's basically the same price as any other ECU (and cheaper than the TEC II/III) out there, has wiring and components designed to drop right into your Miata and has more Miata-specific support than any other ECU...by a long shot...which other ECU could you purchase with default na/super/turbo maps specifically for the Miata? Sure, you could buy an ECU with more features for the same price, but you'd have to spend a TON of your own time (I don't know about you, but mine's valuable) setting it up...and it likely wouldn't be nearly as clean an install as the Link is out of the box. Do you think you'd ever be able to call up Electromotive or AEM or Motec or Megasquirt (I know, I know...just trying to make a point) and expect to get an easy answer to a Miata-specific install or tuning question?

Again, not a huge proselytizer of FM, but many of you bring the same, tired arguments to the table against FM...I suppose a lot of it depends on how much free time your lifestyle affords you...and how much your personal time is worth...and how much money you make (god knows I can't afford much from FM's catalog). But to call them over-priced...is close-minded.
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Old 04-06-2006, 01:31 AM   #47
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Is it just me, or does this "distribution block" thing seem totally pointless?
http://www.bellengineering.net/Pages...osystems3.html

It takes all the lines to the side of the head, right next to the turbo, and then sends them to the turbo. Does anyone know the reason for it?
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Old 04-06-2006, 01:59 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bripab007
Just being the devil's advocate (as usual ), but I don't see how powder-coated intercooler pipes that clear every bit of air conditioning and power-steering piece can be considered hideous, especially when designed to work with the "vertical" intercooler, as it's become popular to refer to.

Furthermore, I'm not sure why you consider their Link ECU overpriced, when it's basically the same price as any other ECU (and cheaper than the TEC II/III) out there, has wiring and components designed to drop right into your Miata and has more Miata-specific support than any other ECU...by a long shot...which other ECU could you purchase with default na/super/turbo maps specifically for the Miata? Sure, you could buy an ECU with more features for the same price, but you'd have to spend a TON of your own time (I don't know about you, but mine's valuable) setting it up...and it likely wouldn't be nearly as clean an install as the Link is out of the box. Do you think you'd ever be able to call up Electromotive or AEM or Motec or Megasquirt (I know, I know...just trying to make a point) and expect to get an easy answer to a Miata-specific install or tuning question?

Again, not a huge proselytizer of FM, but many of you bring the same, tired arguments to the table against FM...I suppose a lot of it depends on how much free time your lifestyle affords you...and how much your personal time is worth...and how much money you make (god knows I can't afford much from FM's catalog). But to call them over-priced...is close-minded.
agreed on all points.

and "proselytizer". good scrabble word.
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Old 04-06-2006, 02:04 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Hounos
Is it just me, or does this "distribution block" thing seem totally pointless?
http://www.bellengineering.net/Pages...osystems3.html

It takes all the lines to the side of the head, right next to the turbo, and then sends them to the turbo. Does anyone know the reason for it?
It looks like a more efficient way to run the oil and the coolant lines.
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Old 04-06-2006, 01:48 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supersaiyan93
agreed on all points.

and "proselytizer". good scrabble word.
Most of the proselytizers around here have been pulled off the streets by the police undercover stings.
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Old 04-06-2006, 02:22 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRX
It looks like a more efficient way to run the oil and the coolant lines.
But more efficient how? I'm just wondering how centralizing the lines 6 inches away from the turbo is better than centralizing them... on the turbo. It's not exactly something that anyone has had problems or complained about, so it just seems like ---- over-engineering.
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Old 04-06-2006, 02:29 PM   #52
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And why does it cost $150 to upgrade to a GT2560R from the GT2554R? They cost the same almost everywhere I've looked....
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Old 04-06-2006, 03:23 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Hounos
But more efficient how? I'm just wondering how centralizing the lines 6 inches away from the turbo is better than centralizing them... on the turbo. It's not exactly something that anyone has had problems or complained about, so it just seems like ---- over-engineering.
Agreed, for the most part...perhaps it was created merely to help keep the engine bay looking clean and uncluttered. I suppose it could help avoid potential chafing problems on other parts/belts. Looks nice enough, though.
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Old 04-06-2006, 10:36 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kung fu jesus
i was a little bored during lunch, so i assembled the intercooler piping in my office. the parts not shown are the dustpan intake, the AFM mount and transition, the BOV, and a few other smaller pieces:


That intercooler is quite small. You are running a small turbo, right?
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Old 04-07-2006, 04:36 PM   #55
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gt2554r.

small for what? 250hp? yeah. 200hp? no.
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Old 06-22-2006, 10:58 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bripab007
Agreed, for the most part...perhaps it was created merely to help keep the engine bay looking clean and uncluttered. I suppose it could help avoid potential chafing problems on other parts/belts. Looks nice enough, though.
It was done for cleanliness, order, and durabilily. Corky has seen a few lines running to and from the turbo fail. This just ensures they won't.

And, maybe it's over engineered a little.....
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Old 06-23-2006, 04:28 PM   #57
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Threads like this cast doubt and confusion for a Miata n00bie like me. I love the price of the GReddy, but not necessarily all the reviews I've read about it (the stock kit). Now, I'm still doing my research...but so far, I've heard a lot about cracked manifolds for the kits...and expensive upgrades. I see a lot of people around here are, in fact, the DIY crowd in that they pool parts together and fit them to upgrade the base GReddy kit.

But the confusing part is all the back and forth between the FM lovers and FM haters (generalizing terms here, don't read too much into it). While some swear by the quality and overall reliability/support of the FM, others insist that it's just over priced, and could easily be reproduced by a patient DIY for less. I'm still searching for it, but it'd be nice to see a side by side comparison. A base FM kit vs. a DIY home brewed kit. Dyno numbers...installation times...reliability, etc.

That's dreaming, of course, but...again, still left confused. I get numbers, statistics and arguments from both sides...and both sides make sense, which means I bounce back and forth, unable to make up my mind. I know, first hand, that FM has awesome customer service. I've heard about a couple techs here and there not being very pleasant, or causing issues...but overall, I think FM is well known for its support...and, as a consumer, I appreciate that.

Given all this...talk of the split (BEGI and FM), the new designs and the 'sides' thrown in, where can I look for some solid guidance on a decision? Should I assume that it's something like this:

Have money, but not a lot of time = FM
Have time, but not a lot of money = GReddy/home brewed?
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Old 06-23-2006, 04:54 PM   #58
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those are great observations and even better questions. I had a highly modified greddy system and am in process of piecing together a begi/fm fit from parts i'm finding. i think you nailed it on the head on time vs money issue, and i think everyone doing this needs to weigh the importance of their time. personally, i like the 'fit and finish' of the begi stuff i have over the greddy. to me, there are more safties incorporated into the engineering. it's not perfect though. before this forum, greddy owners were grabbing at straws for help in a way. the support for the kit is miles ahead of where it used to be a few years ago. (congratulations to phillip for running and paying for it).

i'm newly married with a (until recently) busy career and house to care for. my level of fabrication isn't what it used to be, nor can i afford the time to do it. i think if you're patient, or if you take advantage of the fm/begi split and the new parts that are rolling out, you can build an fm2 for the same price and level of a modified greddy.

one last thing...corky_is_the_MAN. he and his company have been very courteous to me and more than willing to help me with the parts i needed to build my kit. their time spent working with me and answering my questions helps me feel like i'm getting a good product from a good company. i'm not just saying this because stephanie replied to this thread, but i'm just voicing opinion and personal experience.
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Old 06-23-2006, 04:58 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kung fu jesus
those are great observations and even better questions. I had a highly modified greddy system and am in process of piecing together a begi/fm fit from parts i'm finding. i think you nailed it on the head on time vs money issue, and i think everyone doing this needs to weigh the importance of their time. personally, i like the 'fit and finish' of the begi stuff i have over the greddy. to me, there are more safties incorporated into the engineering. it's not perfect though. before this forum, greddy owners were grabbing at straws for help in a way. the support for the kit is miles ahead of where it used to be a few years ago. (congratulations to phillip for running and paying for it).

i'm newly married with a (until recently) busy career and house to care for. my level of fabrication isn't what it used to be, nor can i afford the time to do it. i think if you're patient, or if you take advantage of the fm/begi split and the new parts that are rolling out, you can build an fm2 for the same price and level of a modified greddy.

one last thing...corky_is_the_MAN. he and his company have been very courteous to me and more than willing to help me with the parts i needed to build my kit. their time spent working with me and answering my questions helps me feel like i'm getting a good product from a good company. i'm not just saying this because stephanie replied to this thread, but i'm just voicing opinion and personal experience.
I certainly appreciate your input. If it can all be summed up in the terms I used at the end of my last post, then I think that will help me make up my mind. Until I know for sure, I'll continue researching...as I'm still looking for a vehicle.
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Old 06-23-2006, 06:33 PM   #60
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If I had the money I would have gone with a BEGI kit, they know what they are talking about and do great service. I dont know about FM yet (they havent made any of their own prodducts, but i may be wrong) but so far they are over priced for what you get.
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