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Old 05-19-2011, 12:31 PM   #1
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Default FM needs "Us" to help them go racing... Lol

Saw this pop up on the GRM facebook page...

http://www.flyinmiata.com/projects/targa/index.php

I'm having a big Huh moment? Why is a shop asking for peoples help to go racing. Doesn't their parts markup help do that? Why are "we" supposed to pay for them to go racing and advertise their company. I'm lost.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:38 PM   #2
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They've had this telethon going on for a while now. While I really appreciate and respect their targa efforts, I just see this as tacky way to go about it. I'd rather see them get behind other racers in the community, but hey if it works for them then my criticism is probably just jealousy.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:42 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splitime View Post
Doesn't their parts markup help do that? Why are "we" supposed to pay for them to go racing and advertise their company. I'm lost.
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They've had this telethon going on for a while now. While I really appreciate and respect their targa efforts, I just see this as tacky way to go about it. But hey if it works for them then my criticism is probably just jealousy.
I agree with this, including the fact that my view may just be jealousy.

EDIT: pay $50 and get a t-shirt. They twist it to make you feel you are supporting the underdog miata in this epic international race, when in reality you are funding this small market high-end (i.e. larger markup) retailer, their marketing & advertizing, and their hobby. Slick.

I have no issue with looking for legit sponsors (name on car & media communications, etc) but it is the direct appeal from a high-margin retailer to the average joe enthusiast that bothers me. It's like having Prada asking soccer moms to donate directly to their fund so they can attend a Paris fashion show. Prada 'can't do it without you and needs your help'.

Last edited by TurboTim; 05-19-2011 at 12:58 PM.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:46 PM   #4
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"Yes, we have winners but our prize isn't money – its bragging rights and personal fulfilment. To that end, completing or just participating in Targa Newfoundland is reward enough and beyond anything you have ever experienced."

They need around $23,000 just to enter, get there, race and eat/sleep. With no realy way to recoupe the money. I'm sure most buisness owners wouldn't want to just hand that out. That's a lot of money for FM to put up for Keith to do his thing.

Is the Targa Miata Keith's own project or FM's? I don't see anything wrong asking for sponsors....how do you think NASCAR, F1, INDY, SCCA, etc. are financed.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:47 PM   #5
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I do know that if I ever get cash together and go for a more legit turbo system for my car it will be an absurdflow.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:50 PM   #6
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"Yes, we have winners but our prize isn't money – its bragging rights and personal fulfilment. To that end, completing or just participating in Targa Newfoundland is reward enough and beyond anything you have ever experienced."

They need around $23,000 just to enter, get there, race and eat/sleep. With no realy way to recoupe the money. I'm sure most buisness owners wouldn't want to just hand that out. That's a lot of money for FM to put up for Keith to do his thing.

Is the Targa Miata Keith's own project or FM's? I don't see anything wrong asking for sponsors....how do you think NASCAR, F1, INDY, SCCA, etc. are financed.
But the 'private' sponsors are not businesses who get advertising and whatnot. They are customers who are being double dipped to pay for someone else to go racing. Why in the hell would anyone do that, donate the money to a charity for gods sake... don't give it to someone to race and advertise their company.

Corporate/company sponsors I get. Soliciting people... I don't get.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:54 PM   #7
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I see no problem with it. As Scott said, it is no different than professional teams getting sponsored. They are still having to pay a large chunk of this themselves.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:59 PM   #8
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I see no problem with it. As Scott said, it is no different than professional teams getting sponsored. They are still having to pay a large chunk of this themselves.


It is different. Most professional teams get sponsors from companies that can use the sponsorship as a tax writeoff from their advertising budget and for advertising their product or services. There is a ROI. In FM's case they are asking their customers for money to pay for them to go racing, with no ROI in it for their customer. Sure they can claim R&D, but they'll still roll that R&D cost into the cost of their parts despite who donates and how much. As was mentioned it seems like double dipping from their customers.
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:59 PM   #9
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But the 'private' sponsors are not businesses who get advertising and whatnot. They are customers who are being double dipped to pay for someone else to go racing. Why in the hell would anyone do that, donate the money to a charity for gods sake... don't give it to someone to race and advertise their company.

Corporate/company sponsors I get. Soliciting people... I don't get.
I bought a set of seats from a conversion van for my bus from a guy that was a van dweller that was going to drive to Panama. After talking with him, he had set up a whole site for people to be able to follow him and he would post pictures and videos from his planned 6 month travel. On the site there was a spot to donate money so that he make the trip and I donated $50 to it. We all get to live vicariously through him making his trip and the same happens for us with FM.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:03 PM   #10
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I guess, I never was much for watching sports though. No fun unless actually doing it.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:10 PM   #11
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It is different. Most professional teams get sponsors from companies that can use the sponsorship as a tax writeoff from their advertising budget and for advertising their product or services. There is a ROI. In FM's case they are asking their customers for money to pay for them to go racing, with no ROI in it for their customer. Sure they can claim R&D, but they'll still roll that R&D cost into the cost of their parts despite who donates and how much. As was mentioned it seems like double dipping from their customers.
If you are looking at it with a monetary ROI, then I do agree with you that there is none. The ROI in a situation like this is qualitative and for the people that contributed, that is what they are after.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:15 PM   #12
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If it is Keith and HIS car then I see no issues.

The way I see it, its simply FM helping Keith promote the car and I'm sure FM is provided a good chunk of all the equipment on the car as well.

If we don't help him then it'll be up to 1 sponsor (FM) to cover all the costs... more car going up there have several sponsors, big and small.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:16 PM   #13
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If you are looking at it with a monetary ROI, then I do agree with you that there is none. The ROI in a situation like this is qualitative and for the people that contributed, that is what they are after.


Like I said earlier, probably me just being jelousy. But that is why I don't donate for their effort, I wish them success, but my budget goes to my own track experiences.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:17 PM   #14
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If it is Keith and HIS car then I see no issues.

The way I see it, its simply FM helping Keith promote the car and I'm sure FM is provided a good chunk of all the equipment on the car as well.

If we don't help him then it'll be up to 1 sponsor (FM) to cover all the costs... more car going up there have several sponsors, big and small.


"For 2011, we're representing Miatas by running a two-car team. One car will run in Targa class and one in Grand Touring.

Flyin' Miata will be entered as a small manufacturer, allowing us to take on the big factories face to face."
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:30 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by BenR View Post
"For 2011, we're representing Miatas by running a two-car team. One car will run in Targa class and one in Grand Touring.

Flyin' Miata will be entered as a small manufacturer, allowing us to take on the big factories face to face."
If it was personal, I could see, That would be like "hey gays I just blew my engine.. no not like that and I though it would be nifty if each of you mt'ers donated to something that makes no difference to you." Don't get me wrong, I would like to see him win, but FM is a company that does a good bit of business. The prada reference was perfect.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:38 PM   #16
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Coming from someone who's spent a bunch of money with FM it rubs me the wrong way. When their goal was reached they reset the clock and asked for MORE money. Kinda pisses me off especially considering how much they mark up their items. I suspect though that most of their clients are on M.net, not here, and probably have more money than good sense.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:42 PM   #17
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When companies go racing it is on their own dime and it is largely a tax write-off as advertising and R&D testing. When individuals go racing they solicit parts and financial assistance from companies that write it off as an advertising expense on their taxes and the individuals pay everything else out of pocket.

If I could coax people into funding me driving in the Targa I would do it, no doubt.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:47 PM   #18
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About 10 years ago I gave money to a bum. the next day I saw him at the bank with a purple suit on (no I am not joking this is real), blue shirt, gold watch, etc. making a very large cash deposite. I felt cheated. I decided to give money to my charity of choice rather than give money to bums at that point.

If it had been a privateer type thing on a solo unafilliated website it would be one thing but it did rub me the wrong way too. Furthermore like someone said when the clock was reset when the goal was hit.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:51 PM   #19
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I have no problem with FM leaving donations open to anyone wanting to help them out. I also see it as a good testiment to their R&D and their parts since they use all of their own stuff on the cars. Sure many of us with FM stuff drive our cars, do some track days and autoX, but to see these "off the shelf" parts take a week long pounding on surfaces that are the opposite of a nice smooth race track is another thing. If you don't like it, don't donate...pretty simple. I'm sure if Tim or Abe or Reverant was looking to develop a product or do something to further develop their work and asked the MT community for a little extra "push", it would probably get done. I doubt that Keith/FM are expecting ALL of the money for the Targe to come from donations, God knows how much of their own funds they've already put into it.
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Old 05-19-2011, 01:52 PM   #20
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I'm not donating unless I get some seat time.
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