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Old 02-19-2010, 04:02 PM   #21
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The costs of government workers are amazing. Everyone skims off the top for each position, so that number sounds about right to me (each division, healthcare and other benefits, travel, space, equipment, etc.). As a contractor, it's even worse. I can only imagine how much my company is making off of me. I have a good job and good pay, though, so I can't complain. I just think it sucks that everyone has to pay so much in taxes just to support a small number of people.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:04 PM   #22
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I just think it sucks that everyone has to pay so much in taxes just to support a small number of people.

What?! I thought it was for the "greater" good...
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:13 PM   #23
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it's like driving your car around with one flat tire. fixing it is for the greater good.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:16 PM   #24
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nader 2012
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:31 PM   #25
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nader 2012
Why would we want more government mucking around in our lives? I'm all for supporting unviable candidates in order to make a point (at least, supporting them until you need to actually vote for the guy who can win), but we need more Alan Keyes, not more Ralph Nader.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:31 PM   #26
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Where do I sign up for one of those $225K jobs!

I was listening to NPR on the way home the other night and heard Obama talking about the stimulus package, the money spent and jobs created. I'd come to the same conclusion in my head. About 300 billion spent to create 1.25 million jobs. That's a hell of a lot of money per job.

The bigger trouble is that money spent only created those jobs in theory. They don't know what would have happened if they didn't spend that stimulus money. Would things have been worse? Maybe. They can't say for sure.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:50 PM   #27
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^Yep. Theres just the little problem of wanting to actually do something productive with oneself.

Newt did pretty well the last time he was on the Daily Show. I wonder if he will run for president. I think I would vote for him.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:52 PM   #28
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Newt did pretty well the last time he was on the Daily Show. I wonder if he will run for president. I think I would vote for him.

He more or less said he was last week on the Factor. He'd be my first choice.
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:56 PM   #29
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it's like driving your car around with one flat tire. fixing it is for the greater good.
Or it's like being forced to pay $265,000 for a spare tire that cannot perform like the other three for a fraction of the cost. Not only that, it cannot hold air, has zero tread, constantly goes on strike and will retire at the age of 50 will a full pension plan.
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Old 02-19-2010, 05:02 PM   #30
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Bottom line, you don't have a job, that's your problem, there's always options out there even if they are "below you," I have no sy,pathy for the majoirty of the unemployed.

100% with you on serving your country. Thank You.

But frankly its damned hard to find work and most people are not lazy. I am unemployed right now, and I send out a resume a day minimum. This is made harder by the fact that I am trying to find a job that actually does something productive for society. Not bitching here by any stretch, but I do hope I convey that its not exactly easy.

I applied for one part-time position in Jan for instance and was informed last week that that I was not selected and that there were just over 200 applicants for the job. Thats 200 people for a 11 dollar an hour part-time job with no benefits about 24 hours a week.

People see all these job postings online and say "Hey look at the work out there..." and dont realize that every one of them will get 50 plus applications. I just missed getting a job this week, where I made the final cut of 16 out of 67 applicants because the job was in a much more rural area. Thats as good as it gets. If I was not 100% debt-free or if I had kids/family I would not have even bothered to apply for that job because it would have been impossible to make it work financially. One job I really wanted had over 500 applicants by the time it was over. Its not a matter of 'below you'. Its a lack of supply vs demand.
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Old 02-19-2010, 05:55 PM   #31
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I see jobs everywhere in San antonio, and i hear people say that they can't get work. The local BBQ place is hiring starting at 10 dollars an hour. Paying people not to work apparently creates new jobs. However, if they actually gave that money to small businesses, or even allowed them to make very very low interest loans, it would create way more jobs. My buddy owns a shop back home, and he needs help, but the money isn't there. With just 100000 dollars (lots to an enlisted man like me, but not much out of that huge bill) he could hire 2 people at 30k and take 40k and invest in things for the business. Therefore creating 2 new jobs, giving him money to invest. Then the 2 workers could also put money back into the economy. Instead of giving it to huge corporations that just like to get money and hold on to it, and give more money to the people with 7 figure salaries. The bad state of affairs is our fault, because of poorly managing money. Most americans live way beyond their means. The only reason huge companies lay off, is someone got the idea that profits should ALWAYS increase. After a while you start losing key components in the search for profit increase. After a while, it is like removing your engine to make your car lighter.(I am very aware of inflation, don't throw that in there.) Then they spend money irresponsibly, and then are like, hmmm i wonder why we are going bankrupt. We need government money to keep wasting so we don't have to fire the people we haven't laid off yet. I say the Government gives no one money, and lets the people that can't manage money get whats coming.
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Old 02-19-2010, 06:45 PM   #32
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Or it's like being forced to pay $265,000 for a spare tire that cannot perform like the other three for a fraction of the cost. Not only that, it cannot hold air, has zero tread, constantly goes on strike and will retire at the age of 50 will a full pension plan.
but it gets you home instead of leaving you stranded on the freeway...?
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Old 02-19-2010, 07:19 PM   #33
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but it gets you home instead of leaving you stranded on the freeway...?
yes...it does get you home, agreed
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Old 02-19-2010, 07:35 PM   #34
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Bottom line, you don't have a job, that's your problem, there's always options out there even if they are "below you," I have no sy,pathy for the majoirty of the unemployed.
I do agree with you to an extent. Been unemployed off and on for like 5 months now. I have been trying for anything possible. I had a part time job at Costco for a little over a month (seasonal) then was promptly laid off, last day I worked was on christmas eve. I've been trying to find a full time job but have had very little to no luck. I've had interviews that went great but 3 out of 4 of my last interviewers ended up not hiring anyone at all. I have a great resume and have never ever had such a hard time finding work.

Right now unemployment is paying out the same as a part time job (thank you stimulus) so I have no motivation to take another part time job. Everyone is either laying people off or cutting pay. No one is hiring in this town.
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:04 PM   #35
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I see jobs everywhere in San antonio, and i hear people say that they can't get work. The local BBQ place is hiring starting at 10 dollars an hour. Paying people not to work apparently creates new jobs.

However, if they actually gave that money to small businesses, or even allowed them to make very very low interest loans, it would create way more jobs. My buddy owns a shop back home, and he needs help, but the money isn't there. With just 100000 dollars (lots to an enlisted man like me, but not much out of that huge bill) he could hire 2 people at 30k and take 40k and invest in things for the business. Therefore creating 2 new jobs, giving him money to invest. Then the 2 workers could also put money back into the economy.


I say the Government gives no one money, and lets the people that can't manage money get whats coming.

The middle paragraph hell yes, the rest no.

You think the contruction worker or the architect or the saw mill operator is getting screwed because he/she cant manage money? They got screwed due to a sudden plunge in demand through 0 fault of their own.

See how many people apply for that 10 dollar an hour job at the BBQ.
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:06 PM   #36
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Obviously in the current market this may have changed but...

As an employer I have used the state unemployment office match service before when I needed an employee. Not a bad deal for an employer, they pay a portion of the wages paid for a few months if you hire someone currently on unemployment. I post a job there. I get 20-30 people interested. Talk to a number of them on the phone and that thins the herd to 5-10 still interested. Make appointments for interviews with them. 2 actually show up and they both had 0 chance of actually doing the job. Completely ignored what the job required when they applied.

Granted this was a couple years ago when we were at 6% unemp.

You want effective stimulus for less than 250K per person employed? Offer a grant to every small business that has reduced workforce in the last 2 years. Pay a significant percentage of all wages, benefits, payroll taxes, social security, etc for any person they hire, for two years, up to the pre-crash employment level. Get people back to work in middle America.

The bastard financial and insurance companies that got us in this situation shouldn't have got a cent and the bonus they throw around are a slap in the face to the entire world. They didn't just screw America they screwed the financial security of the entire world. I'm suprised there wasn't more backlash from that fiasco.


EDIT: Didn't see Chickdigmiatas had pushed for small business help before I wrote this. Right on brother. Obviously mediocre minds think alike!
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:34 PM   #37
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The middle paragraph hell yes, the rest no.

You think the contruction worker or the architect or the saw mill operator is getting screwed because he/she cant manage money? They got screwed due to a sudden plunge in demand through 0 fault of their own.

See how many people apply for that 10 dollar an hour job at the BBQ.
Thanks Cueball! Spare tire, maybe i misworded, well i did. I'm not saying that the workers lost their jobs because they personally couldn't manage money, i was saying it was the companies they work or maybe just other companies in general that caused this whole C.F. did the mishandling. They were just innocent people caught in the crossfire. However, if they are broke with a job, **** happens. I used to be in debt and got out, so can everyone else.

As for 10 dollars an hour, 400 a month is better than zero, and losing your house, and ruining your credit and/or begging for money at intersections, and cussing at me in espanol when i wont give it to you, lol.
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:17 PM   #38
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You want effective stimulus for less than 250K per person employed? Offer a grant to every small business that has reduced workforce in the last 2 years. Pay a significant percentage of all wages, benefits, payroll taxes, social security, etc for any person they hire, for two years, up to the pre-crash employment level. Get people back to work in middle America.

EDIT: Didn't see Chickdigmiatas had pushed for small business help before I wrote this. Right on brother. Obviously mediocre minds think alike!
Bingo on the small business. What scares me a bit now is this idea of forcing small (5+ plus people I think?) employers to provide healthcare. Liability insurance alone is as expensive as the employee him/herself in some places. When I was in school we looked at what it cost to hire w welder in CA. The pay was about 45% of the total cost! You tack more expenses like that on and you can forget about new hiring for most local businesses.

Virtually everyone I know at work can relate to how there is plenty of work that idealy would be done by extra people, but no way can an owner hire them right now safely. If you want to help people, make it safe for them to get hired, then lower insurance costs so they can get their own damn insurance. Catastophic insurance for me is about 100 dollars a month. I have 0 prescriptions, low blood pressure, a resting heart rate of about 55BPM and weigh a whoopong 160 LBS. I do 26 mile hikes up and down Pikes Peak for fun. And emergency only insurance is 100 ******* dollars a month. God knows what it wuld be if I was 40 and had high cholesterol and wanted some dental or vision.

Leave my employer alone, get that basic cost down to 60/mo and watch the economy improve.
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:27 PM   #39
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Thanks Cueball! Spare tire, maybe i misworded, well i did. I'm not saying that the workers lost their jobs because they personally couldn't manage money, i was saying it was the companies they work or maybe just other companies in general that caused this whole C.F. did the mishandling. They were just innocent people caught in the crossfire. However, if they are broke with a job, **** happens. I used to be in debt and got out, so can everyone else.

As for 10 dollars an hour, 400 a month is better than zero, and losing your house, and ruining your credit and/or begging for money at intersections, and cussing at me in espanol when i wont give it to you, lol.
Gotcha, I misunderstood. Honestly there was a lot that fugged it up way up the food chain from anybody here as far as I can tell.

But I will say that it just blows me away how people marched into these ARM and baloon payment mortgages. How the hell can you not 'read the fine print' when a 1/4 million bucks is getting thrown around? So I have revise myself a bit and say that there are also plenty of people who are actually screwed because of their own stupidity.

Which wouldnt be so bad if they had not been a few more gallons of water in the flood.
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:29 PM   #40
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If the government would do no or really low interest loans, not only would they get the money back, they could stimulate the economy, instead of just giving it to the problem in the first place. But, that is how our government solves problems, they just throw bills at it and hope it works out, kinda like a rap video.
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