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Old 02-04-2010, 05:29 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webby459 View Post
Illusion, that line being cut. But, hint 2, that one is connected to the prop valve.
I saw a XP miata in lincoln this year that actually had two proportioning valves. One to balance front and rear, the other, apparently similar to how yours is hooked up, to balance the left and right fronts. Seemed they couldn't "cure" a right front lockup tendency any other way.


Edited to not be a total thread jack. NO WAY NO HOW would an "instructor" drive my car.
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Old 02-04-2010, 05:31 PM   #42
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This thread is hilarious and slightly confusing
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Old 02-04-2010, 05:36 PM   #43
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I wondered why, until now, I ended up backwards on track during the first 5 minutes of the first track session ever in this car. Then, along with a lot of other ****, I backed that prop valve all the way out, where it's been until now. I can't ******* believe it.

Sounds like that XP car needed new calipers or a master or something. This is decidedly not the way to figure out l/r brake "balance." Once I fix it, I wonder how the rear braking will behave? I can't get more brake to the rear than just having that straight-through brass coupler to the rear line, can I?
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Old 02-04-2010, 05:41 PM   #44
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This thread is hilarious and slightly confusing
No, FTB, the PM'd secret I just sent you is hilarious and more than slightly confusing. I do not make this **** up.
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Old 02-04-2010, 06:07 PM   #45
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I'm not sure about your experiences with instructors, but......
Instructors don't generally beat on a car when they drive it for the student. It is more for the instructor to show the student the correct line and also feel how the car reacts to inputs, so they can better instruct the student. I know that at least every time I take out a student's car, I'm afraid of driving too fast because I don't want them to think that I'm beating on their car and don't want them to become uncomfortable.

That group in the video generally runs a great (but expensive) track day. I can tell you that this "instructor" won't be one any longer though, I know the guy who runs the group and have made him aware of this video.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:16 PM   #46
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So Is there any question of the guys "smoothness" or the line he's taking at all? I watched it twice, and the only complaint I could even consider is when he squeals the tires right near the end. If it were me, I'd have been happy with that lap if it was my first time, and I'd also be looking to make the instructer wet his pants by hanging it out as much as I could after being told to take him back in.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:17 PM   #47
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Any idea what kind of car that is in the video? I can usually figure out from in car shots, but didn't recognize this one.

Sorry for bringing this slightly back on topic
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:26 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rleete View Post
So Is there any question of the guys "smoothness" or the line he's taking at all? I watched it twice, and the only complaint I could even consider is when he squeals the tires right near the end. If it were me, I'd have been happy with that lap if it was my first time, and I'd also be looking to make the instructer wet his pants by hanging it out as much as I could after being told to take him back in.
seemed like maybe he was apexing a little too early on some of those corners, but I dont personally know the track, so idk. But I really didnt see anything in the video that stood out as absurd on the drivers part.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:30 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by nickt93 View Post
Any idea what kind of car that is in the video? I can usually figure out from in car shots, but didn't recognize this one.
Mazdaspeed3 (look at the title of the video).
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:38 PM   #50
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They told you they wanted someone to drive your car to show you?
I instruct with SV and I always ask my student if I can drive their car for the first two laps to show them the line. Having said that, I would prefer to drive their car at 20mph around the track for the first lap so I have time to talk about the lines. This is most important at WSIR, where the line is basically impossible to teach unless you can show the student exactly where to place the car - and because if they **** up the car placement in one corner (turn 9), you're going off in a big way, and someone died there a year ago. My biggest worry when driving a student car is going fast enough so that I don't hold up the ultra-beginner group.

I don't spend an entire session beating on a student's car - I take it for two easy laps, pointing out markers and braking zones and flag stations, and then give them the keys and pray to god they don't kill me.

If they refuse, I'll just take them out in my car, but it's usually quieter in theirs.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:53 PM   #51
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All the track days I've been to they specifically say don't let the instructors drive your car. They also tell us to tell them to **** off if they say pass if/when we know passing isn't allowed. I've had awesome instructors, including some damn good SM guys. Although the past 3 events I haven't had one at all, and the two before that they were only in for one session.

I'd be pissed during the lap, but more than happy to get rid of him and get a new instructor. I'm glad he taped the evidence, so they can get rid of him.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:11 PM   #52
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I just got the chance to listen to the whole dialog. Just from an interpersonal standpoint, well, this guy is an *******, flat out. I would tell him so in person, without a problem. That guy was doing nothing overtly wrong, no way was he even risking an off or spin at any point. Amazing. The instructor just didn't want to be instructing, I will not be convinced otherwise.

I'd like to know the follow-up to all this. All the instructors I've either known or ridden with have been great. They've all had different types of personalities, obviously, some quiet and some outspoken, but just berating someone like that is being a douche, he lives under a rock, and can't procreate.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:24 PM   #53
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Did my part to make sure this guy never instructs again, posted it on every board I frequent. He's about to be famous!

2500 views and counting!
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:27 PM   #54
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Jacob, I posted a comment on youtube right after you did. I will probably spread the vid around a little, too.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:39 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashnscar View Post
I'm not sure about your experiences with instructors, but......
Instructors don't generally beat on a car when they drive it for the student. It is more for the instructor to show the student the correct line and also feel how the car reacts to inputs, so they can better instruct the student. I know that at least every time I take out a student's car, I'm afraid of driving too fast because I don't want them to think that I'm beating on their car and don't want them to become uncomfortable.

That group in the video generally runs a great (but expensive) track day. I can tell you that this "instructor" won't be one any longer though, I know the guy who runs the group and have made him aware of this video.
Sooooooooo who was the instructor?


Although a small track, my first time out on one was Talladega GP. It was just a fun run-at-your-own-pace day but I opted to have someone ride with me my first time out. I had watched a bunch of video of people running TGP to get an idea of the line before I went out there as well. Needless to say, the instructor was pleased with my driving and only had minimal input...that I didn't have to drive the "fast line" all the time.... meaning I was getting about 6" away from the shoulder of the track to get the fastest line through But running that line meant ZERO room for error under braking/downshifting....one little slip of the wheel and I would have been mowing the lawn. I never did that day...and was cutting consistant 1:09 with some in the 1:08 range.....which is "pretty damn fast for a street car" according to the track staff. Anyone on here run TGP?

Last edited by Doppelgänger; 02-04-2010 at 10:49 PM.
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Old 02-04-2010, 10:46 PM   #56
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the director of teh group was posting comments on the video...
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Old 02-04-2010, 11:12 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rleete View Post
the only complaint I could even consider is when he squeals the tires right near the end.
If you're not making street tires squeal you're not doing it right.

It's tough to tell if he was jerking the wheel since it's out of frame, but just judging by the line it looked smooth enough to me. I didn't see the car's balance get upset either. If there was any lack of smoothness the instructor certainly wasn't giving any constructive advice to fix it. In fact there was not even a shred of useful input that I heard, just what he thought the driver was doing wrong. If I'm carrying 200 pounds of ballast in the passenger area I expect it to be giving me some useful advice. I'd much rather have a stack of steel plates bolted to the floor than have that insufferable douche in my car.
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Old 02-04-2010, 11:24 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doppelgänger View Post
Anyone on here run TGP?
Hopefully I'll be running my first track day there on Feb 15th with a small group of people in the miata. I've been there on other days but never as a driver(The cars were running 1:02s that day.) How long ago did you do that track day?
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Old 02-05-2010, 12:02 AM   #59
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When I instruct, I generally exit the pit in the reverse direction, like in gran turismo when you're mad at the AI for shoving you off of the track.
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Old 02-05-2010, 12:33 AM   #60
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The AI in that game is based on Matt Neal's driving style lol.
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