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Old 11-02-2010, 12:15 AM   #21
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What is the common standard? 26 hp loss?
There is no set number, but 15-20% about right.

Now just to be clear, dyno's are just a tool to see how much one has gained and not the end all be all power measurement. trap speed is the real power indicator. But lets get real here, there is no way in hell an intake/exhaust nb is putting down 145whp. Or 130 even.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:26 AM   #22
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I posted earlier that it was put on a dynojet and registered 136 hp. That was with compression loss and 9.5:1 pistons. I am now running full compression and 10:1. I stated in the same post that "I am assuming around 145 hp, but without a dyno chart to prove it, I cannot concretely say that, but it feels like it picked up some". I am sorry if it came across that I was bound and determined to have 145 hp, as I cannot prove it. This post was not meant like that. I will be going back to the dyno soon to see how the new block performs, at that time I will post my new charts.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:29 AM   #23
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so you're saying with a shot block you put down more power than any other miata with those mods EVER in the history of miatas?

Better call the guiness books of records asap
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:35 AM   #24
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And yes, I completely agree with you on trap speed over dyno. I can't find my time slips though
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:51 AM   #25
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And I wouldn't say "EVER" either. There was a build thread on here at one point of an N/A that produced 170 hp, and he did not have too much more than I. (Cams, more tuning)
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:59 AM   #26
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OP sounds legit. Everyone knows a k&N is good for 50whp.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:59 AM   #27
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And I wouldn't say "EVER" either. There was a build thread on here at one point of an N/A that produced 170 hp, and he did not have too much more than I. (Cams, more tuning)

You can't be serious.

1st of all cams and tuning is a whole helluvalot more than just intake and exhaust.
2nd even with "just" cams/ecu/intake/exhaust there is no way in hell an otherwise stock bp will make 170whp. You are dreaming.

I'm not wasting any more time on this retarded conversation. You will realize soon enough how ridiculous/retarded your claims/beliefs are.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:03 AM   #28
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haha, I'd be happy if you could get 3. Heat soak is so bad with the filter basically on top of the header. How could I prevent that? Oh yea... a turbo : )
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:26 AM   #29
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There is no set number, but 15-20% about right.
So the amount of drive line loss is variable? If I make 500bhp I'm only getting about 425-400whp? I'm thinking no. The amount of loss is constant (in relation to engine HP). 25hp is a pretty commonly thrown around number.

Carry on.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:26 AM   #30
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And I wouldn't say "EVER" either. There was a build thread on here at one point of an N/A that produced 170 hp, and he did not have too much more than I. (Cams, more tuning)
Lurk more.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:31 AM   #31
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Thank you Jayc, and i'm not too sure how to respond to the "lurk more" comment. But how much power are you making with that setup?
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:39 AM   #32
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Out of curiosity....Am I missing something? Why is the crossover point on your dyno graph NOT 5252rpm?

Also, are torque and HP on a different scale? It must be because those numbers don't add up at all. Either way, that dyno sheet looks like a pile of horse ****.

dyno #s don't mean **** anyway, but they at least tend to mathematically add up. Your sheet.....doesnt. :/
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:48 AM   #33
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Yes, the scales are different. My torque at 3k (where the graph begins) is 101, and peaks at 116. My hp, on the other hand, is only at 58 at 3k, and rises to 120 over the course of the graph. Left (torque) side reads from 95->116. Right reads from at 58->120. The shop looked very low-quality, but is one of the only ones around that offers dyno-days.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:53 AM   #34
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Me and a friend (stock miata + MSpNp), only went to compare mine to what a stock one would read. To my understanding, even if a dyno differs from other dynos, it is still reliable to an extent as long as you stick to that dyno. Dyno1 1st results vs. Dyno1 2cd results = comparable. Not Dyno1 vs. Dyno2
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:54 AM   #35
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Dyno days are an easy sell when you have an optimistic dyno
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Old 11-02-2010, 02:00 AM   #36
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Stock miata registered 104 hp. Seems consistent with Mazda specs. 140bhp - 25 (drivetrain losses) = 115. Remember this was a mustang dyno, so add 12% to = dynojet standard. = 116 hp. +/- 1 hp doesnt seem too optimistic
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Old 11-02-2010, 02:03 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Antipyper View Post
Thank you Jayc, and i'm not too sure how to respond to the "lurk more" comment. But how much power are you making with that setup?
Lurk more. Every time you mash you fist against your keyboard and produce some barely intelligible crap you look like a moron. Lurk more and look less like an idiot.

I don't know what numbers I'm getting on my setup. I press the go pedal and it makes me feel happy.
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Old 11-02-2010, 09:12 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by jayc72 View Post
So the amount of drive line loss is variable? If I make 500bhp I'm only getting about 425-400whp? I'm thinking no. The amount of loss is constant (in relation to engine HP). 25hp is a pretty commonly thrown around number.

Carry on.
How much horsepower does it take to make the drivetrain actually turn then? 25hp? 26hp?

Have you ever put a wrench on your crank bolt and turned the engine over? Here's a hint - YOU are a man and not a horse, YOU produce FAR LESS than 1 horsepower.

It's a fact - you will lose a percentage of torque via "drivetrain loss" - if it was a set number, people wouldn't be worrying about transmission fluid temps on track.

Hell - NASCAR uses a rear differential cooler and pump - there is only one reason they would need to cool the fluid in their differentials - heat buildup from friction in the differential, that friction robs power as a percentage. If it were a set number, our family sedans would have differential fluid pumps and coolers.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:05 PM   #39
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How much horsepower does it take to make the drivetrain actually turn then? 25hp? 26hp?

Have you ever put a wrench on your crank bolt and turned the engine over? Here's a hint - YOU are a man and not a horse, YOU produce FAR LESS than 1 horsepower.

It's a fact - you will lose a percentage of torque via "drivetrain loss" - if it was a set number, people wouldn't be worrying about transmission fluid temps on track.

Hell - NASCAR uses a rear differential cooler and pump - there is only one reason they would need to cool the fluid in their differentials - heat buildup from friction in the differential, that friction robs power as a percentage. If it were a set number, our family sedans would have differential fluid pumps and coolers.
Awesome ******' post, mang.
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Old 11-02-2010, 12:14 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayc72 View Post
So the amount of drive line loss is variable? If I make 500bhp I'm only getting about 425-400whp? I'm thinking no. The amount of loss is constant (in relation to engine HP). 25hp is a pretty commonly thrown around number.

Carry on.
Not variable on power level but variable on drivetrain and its moving parts.

Saying "25hp" is just stupid.
Read up on drivetrain loss.
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Originally Posted by fooger03 View Post
How much horsepower does it take to make the drivetrain actually turn then? 25hp? 26hp?

Have you ever put a wrench on your crank bolt and turned the engine over? Here's a hint - YOU are a man and not a horse, YOU produce FAR LESS than 1 horsepower.

It's a fact - you will lose a percentage of torque via "drivetrain loss" - if it was a set number, people wouldn't be worrying about transmission fluid temps on track.

Hell - NASCAR uses a rear differential cooler and pump - there is only one reason they would need to cool the fluid in their differentials - heat buildup from friction in the differential, that friction robs power as a percentage. If it were a set number, our family sedans would have differential fluid pumps and coolers.
CORRECT. Worded it better than I could have. Thank you
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