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Old 06-12-2010, 05:34 AM   #1
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Default Bad Tuning

Is anyone with experience will just know which settings I may have set incorrect that cause the fuel map will need very rich burning in order for the engine to run smooth between 55-60 MAP and 2500-4000rpm?

I'd try to retard the timing table in these areas by 3 degree, but hasn't see a little improve yet.

Or I should build a new spark table to the same figures with my fuel?

The car do pull and runs well, I may only felt very little vibrations between 3K to 4K rpm.
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Old 06-15-2010, 10:18 AM   #2
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Are you running boost? If so how much.

Your ignition table and VE table scalings are way off! VE Table suggests you are NA and ignition suggests you run a built motor with WI.

Your VE Table cells more than double in value within a 5kpa difference!? Are you auto-tuning, manual tuning, using MLV etc?
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Old 06-15-2010, 10:23 AM   #3
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fail/aids

You need to rescale both tables and make linear shifts in cell values for VE. Spark is
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:29 PM   #4
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That is far and away the most FUCKED UP VE TABLE I have ever seen posted on this forum, and we've had some doozies. I literally LOLed at the 3000 rpm column... 10 @ 41 kPa, 162 @ 55 kPa. I could generate a better table by randomly clicking the mouse on different cells while rubbing my flaccid ***** back and forth across my keyboard's number row.

Start over with an appropriate base map from mspnp.com. That will have sane ignition table scaling and a VE table that's not an abortion. Then tell us what software/methods you are using to tune. You do have a wideband O2 gauge, yes?
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:29 PM   #5
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I will rescale the spark table then, at first I thought that it would not make much difference as the timing issue below a turbo, NA area are just the same as NA, except with lower resolutions, guess I'm wrong.
I've try both manual and auto tuning, believe it or not, the car pulls pretty well with these settings, whenever I try to put the rich spot lean(55,2500,114), or a lean spot rich (41,2500,10), the car will jump as it will be either with rich ve value but lean as WB tells me, vice versa in 41,2500.
I read that the fuel delivery in bank one and bank two are quite difference, 14 vs 9, and second thoughts, I am thinking that the fuel injections delivery un-even fuel, and result in variable figures, but why is it always in these two sports, even if I swipe the VE table and redo, same same asking for fuel in that areas..
The idle is also smooth, so I also drop the ideas of faulty injections.
So last thing to experience is to change the entire spark table..
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:33 PM   #6
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Please fix that giant retarded rich spot.... please!!! What is your req fuel? If that is off then everything is. But hell.....

Edit, and please humor us with your set up.
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:39 PM   #7
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its a mustang IIRC.


what are your AFRs in that area? Gotta be a reason it wants to dump in so much fuel.
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:47 PM   #8
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Yes, I've been trying to put in linear figures from low to high runing from left to right, only if I do, the car will cough, and the WB O2 will read and jump between 9.x to 2x.x 30.x 40.x
I will try the spark table, seems like suggestions are both table in the same scale will eliminate problems.. even it is a NA..
Oh, Yes, the area now in is 60 @ 3500rpm, VE=115
Result AFR = 16
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Old 06-15-2010, 01:55 PM   #9
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what WBo2? it shouldn't be outputting anything leaner than 20:1. Did you calibrate your MSQ for the correct wideband controller? I wonder if it's not still set to narrowband looking for a 0-1v input and when you're giving it 3-4-5volts it's showing crazy lean.
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Old 06-15-2010, 02:18 PM   #10
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I am with I had to mess with my wideband to get the ms to correlate correctly too, but thats not an issue you need to deal with. I am betting on NB input is selected. MY ms only reads to 20:1 but my wideband goes to 34.27, although not that accurately.
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Old 06-16-2010, 12:25 AM   #11
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I've select the default innovate LC-1, so there should not be any problems there, it does gives out correct AFM, only facts is I've got fewer resolutions within the range. But I may always re-program LC-1 to get 10-20 readings.
For >20 readings is from my off gas after throttle, since then I had change the 20Map area to 50, but it still said I do not have enough fuel there, so, I may change it to 80 and try again, these pictures only tells me that the rich area are seems to be jumping every 20 MAP on VE, Very Lean, Very Rich VE in these loop, but after 60MAP, seems Normal..
BTW, I do select the MSPNP90-93 Map to start with, but it doesn't matters, since only end result on VE like this will make the car run smooth and pull.. Funny Eh~
I always think this is something to do with the fuel delivery, pump? injectors? but why the pattern is on different MAP, so, it should be something else..
I just can't wait for the books that I pre-order started to ship.. from DIYAutoTune.. Guess that will help more..
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Old 06-16-2010, 01:37 AM   #12
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can you post your MSQ?
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Old 06-16-2010, 02:05 AM   #13
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Last edited by edwardsuen; 06-16-2010 at 03:10 AM.
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Old 06-16-2010, 02:47 AM   #14
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Like I suspected; change your EGO switch point, under Exhaust Gas Settings, from 0.5v to 2.35v. Youre telling the MS that at .5v it should be seeing 14.7:1. On a wideband with a 0-5v output, outputting 10-20:1, that's telling that MS everything above 10.5:1AFR is lean.

MS should never show you more than 20:1. If you have an output that you know is never outputting leaner than 20:1, you should know right away when you see 30:1 or 40:1 that something is amiss.

One thing you could probably do is run logworks through the LC-1 controller and see what the LC-1 is actually outputting to confirm the readings in Tuner Studio.



Then under Basic Settings, Engine Constants, turn off barometric corrections.

I'd also change my fan off setting to something like 5-10* lower than the ON point. The way you have it setup, it'll never stop running once triggered.
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Old 06-16-2010, 03:21 AM   #15
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Thanks, I wasn't aware of the EGO settings at all, thought that the LC-1 I selected will do all the jobs..
I have a innovate AFM Guages installed, so, it both matches from TS and gauges.
For the Barometric Corrections, is it better to turn off even my areas have lots of hills, that I will drive in different heights all the time?
OK, now I will drive around and see the results..
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Old 06-16-2010, 03:54 AM   #16
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do you have a second map sensor?

even still, the range you need to adjust for is 90-100kPa, yours is way too far of a correction scale.


I still don't see how you can display 40:1 AFR, let alone run the car with that little amount of fuel.
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Old 06-16-2010, 11:47 AM   #17
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Here is the first run after I'd set the ego = 2.45 (Because I hasn't re-program LC-1 to 10-20 readings yet), Barometric Off.

http://61.93.9.190/2010-06-16_22.42.20.baro_off.msq
My MSL Log File 1.5MB
The Rich Spot seems not respond to the settings changed..
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Old 06-16-2010, 01:47 PM   #18
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your VE table is really fucked up - start with a new MSPNP VE table from scatch - or maybe even better with a whole MSPNP MSQ.
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Old 06-16-2010, 04:39 PM   #19
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I think that you're so rich, the car is misfiring which shows up as lean. The solution to that is not to keep adding fuel.

I'd recommend going back to the basemap. It's pretty solid and would be a better starting point.


Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardsuen View Post
Here is the first run after I'd set the ego = 2.45 (Because I hasn't re-program LC-1 to 10-20 readings yet), Barometric Off.

http://61.93.9.190/2010-06-16_22.42.20.baro_off.msq
My MSL Log File 1.5MB
The Rich Spot seems not respond to the settings changed..
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Old 06-19-2010, 01:57 PM   #20
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Started to re-tune a brand new map again (Manually)
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