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DIYPNP on a 99

Old Feb 3, 2010 | 03:44 PM
  #121  
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Originally Posted by Reverant
Where did you get them? Farnell doesn't have them, and if they don't, I don't know who does.

Jim
There's this small electronics shop half an hour from me where I can get them. They are special order, so I usually have to wait a week or 2 before they have them. Last time I had to order them by 5. Still no big deal as they're not expensive.
Some items can't be ordered though, like the IRLZ44 for EBC for instance. Had to get that from Glenn's Garage.
Old Feb 3, 2010 | 04:31 PM
  #122  
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Ok. I'm going to try with a fully digital circuit, as the parts required there are much simpler to find.

Jim
Old Feb 3, 2010 | 08:53 PM
  #123  
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I had minimal luck at Radioshack. Or should I call them Cellphone Shack. They had the transistors, but no 1% tolerance resistors. Napa Auto parts next door was even more useless than the Radio Shack staff. Oh well, mail order for me.
Old Feb 3, 2010 | 08:59 PM
  #124  
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I used 5% tolerance resistors. They come in a multi-pack. Measure across them with a DMM and use the closest ones. They're typically dead on, or nearly dead on, anyway.
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Originally Posted by concealer404
Buy an MSPNP Pro, you'll feel better.
Old Feb 3, 2010 | 09:02 PM
  #125  
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Originally Posted by Reverant
Ok. I'm going to try with a fully digital circuit, as the parts required there are much simpler to find.

Jim
What is involved in going digital? Is it more expensive than a bag full of solid state parts?
Old Feb 4, 2010 | 01:26 AM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by r808
What is involved in going digital? Is it more expensive than a bag full of solid state parts?
Probably more expensive, but not by much. I will use the same circuit for a bunch of other stuff (like proper A/C control, battery & MIL light, 2nd fan control, etc) so the cost is not really tied to the alt control alone.

Jim
Old Feb 5, 2010 | 09:42 AM
  #127  
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If you guys have trouble finding components, try Mouser.com. Very wide selection and no mins if stocked. They are global, and usually at your door within 3 days.
Old Feb 5, 2010 | 12:46 PM
  #128  
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Have a look where we're all from.
Old Feb 5, 2010 | 02:27 PM
  #129  
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Mouser has sales in Europe and Asia and ships worldwide, usually in 3 days. I hear of people having trouble sourcing electronic components, so i thought I would help. They have always had what I need.
Old Feb 5, 2010 | 11:01 PM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by customstreetmachines
If you guys have trouble finding components, try Mouser.com. Very wide selection and no mins if stocked. They are global, and usually at your door within 3 days.
Just placed order. $2.27 for everything. Oh wow, going to return this $12 half a bag of Radio shack parts.
Old Feb 6, 2010 | 06:50 AM
  #131  
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Mouser, and in fact, no one else online, lists the TL431/CYL. Sure, there are other variations listed, but which one is right for this application?

Jim
Old Feb 6, 2010 | 07:22 AM
  #132  
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Jim, if you want me to mail you a letter with a TL431 in it, gimme a shout. I'm in the neighbourhood of that shop next week so I can stop by to get you one. Last time I ordered they told me they would stock a couple.
Old Feb 6, 2010 | 09:33 AM
  #133  
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Thanks Frank!

I'm going to try a custom circuit tomorrow on a friend's car, and if it doesn't work then I'll let you know. Thanks again!

Jim
Old Feb 8, 2010 | 01:16 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by FoundSoul
I'd only put one there if you're having problems, and it wouldn't need to be as big.

On the 12v, we have a 3300uf cap on the MSPNPs, which is really bigger than needed. Without the cap the stock electrical system (12v) gets somewhat noisy when the engine is under load. With about half that value smooths out the 12v pretty nicely, now having a nice nearly flat 12v (or 13.2 or whatever, bottom line is it stopped it from looking like a sine wave anymore) under load. The 3300uf made it pretty much perfectly flat, just a slight improvement over the smaller value. The cap was cheap, so I used the bigger one, done deal.

I discovered this a couple years ago when troublehooting the occasional misfire issue we used to see. Turns out I solved that with a much smaller cap on the 2nd input to filter the 2nd trigger, and noise on that signal had been the root cause of that. This cap on the 12v really is not required at all, but doesn't hurt, may help in some cases, so we left it in. BTW, before someone asks, there is already filtering on the DIYPNP's 2nd trigger, this little cap shouldn't be needed.
I got my car running and have been road tunning it for a couple of days. My big issue now is the occasional hiccup accompanied by a sudden loss of tach signal. Looking at the log it seems like MS2 is loosing sync for an instant and then catches back on. I want to try Jerry's capacitor on the 2nd tach signal line. Jerry, what size capacitor did you use?

Thanks.
-Raj
Old Feb 9, 2010 | 12:12 PM
  #135  
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It's a 0.1 uF - and too large for MS2.
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Old Feb 9, 2010 | 12:57 PM
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We put the alternator circuit together a few weeks ago and I thought it was working fine. In Tunerstuidio I read 15v all the time the car is running, isn't that a little high?
Old Feb 9, 2010 | 01:32 PM
  #137  
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That's a little high, but probably not dangerously so--as long as you're not going over 15v. You might go through headlight bulbs a little quicker.
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Originally Posted by concealer404
Buy an MSPNP Pro, you'll feel better.
Old Feb 9, 2010 | 01:47 PM
  #138  
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You really should check the voltage at the battery using a DVM.
When my DVM said 12V battery voltage, MegaTune said 11.6V. Battery voltage is determined with a resistor voltage divider to bring the 12 volts down to under 5V for the MCU to convert. R3 (50K) and R6 (10K) on the Megasquirt PCB form this voltage divider. These are both 5% tolerance resistors and in my case, the ratio was 5.22 instead of 5, causing the difference between actual and MS values for battery voltage. It's best to use 1% resistors for this. It's important to have a correct reading because the MS changes certain values (injector opening time, dwell etc) depending on the input voltage.

If you find that everything is correct and you really measure 15V at the battery check if you used 1% resistors in the alternator circuit. The setpoint is determined with the formula: 2.495V*(1+ R4/R11), so it's important to use 1% resistors for R4 and R11. I used a 5% for R11 and found my setpoint to be 15.1V!
If you used 1%, you might want to replace the 48K7 resistor with a lower value like 47K5 or 46K4. Make sure your setpoint is about 14.4V. In your case, you'd have to use the 46K4 resistor to get 14.4V if you now have 15V.
Although 15V is still within spec, I don't feel comfortable with it. Your bulbs as well as your battery will live longer at 14.4V
Old Feb 9, 2010 | 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt Cramer
It's a 0.1 uF - and too large for MS2.

2nded I fitted the cap and it ran fine apart from a complete loss of sync around 5k. remove the cap al all was golden.

If you were to run a cap though, what would you recommend?
Old Feb 10, 2010 | 03:42 PM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by f_devocht
You really should check the voltage at the battery using a DVM.
When my DVM said 12V battery voltage, MegaTune said 11.6V. Battery voltage is determined with a resistor voltage divider to bring the 12 volts down to under 5V for the MCU to convert. R3 (50K) and R6 (10K) on the Megasquirt PCB form this voltage divider. These are both 5% tolerance resistors and in my case, the ratio was 5.22 instead of 5, causing the difference between actual and MS values for battery voltage. It's best to use 1% resistors for this. It's important to have a correct reading because the MS changes certain values (injector opening time, dwell etc) depending on the input voltage.

If you find that everything is correct and you really measure 15V at the battery check if you used 1% resistors in the alternator circuit. The setpoint is determined with the formula: 2.495V*(1+ R4/R11), so it's important to use 1% resistors for R4 and R11. I used a 5% for R11 and found my setpoint to be 15.1V!
If you used 1%, you might want to replace the 48K7 resistor with a lower value like 47K5 or 46K4. Make sure your setpoint is about 14.4V. In your case, you'd have to use the 46K4 resistor to get 14.4V if you now have 15V.
Although 15V is still within spec, I don't feel comfortable with it. Your bulbs as well as your battery will live longer at 14.4V

We did use a 1% resistor but we did not test it, I'll look at it again tonight. Thanks for your help.

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