Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 07-24-2012, 01:38 AM   #21
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Ok, update from this evening.

Got the AIT sensor wired correctly, connected the fuel pump relay wires (Runs when in On position) and downloaded the provided .inc files. AIT sensor is reading correctly now in Tunerstudio.

Since I got straightened out, I tried starting the car again. No luck. Got the car to crank over nicely and sputter trying to start but could not keep going. Was following the directions per various sources where you are trying to set the timing.

Ended up messing around with the timing trigger angle, CAS position, cranking and after enrichment pulse widths. Seemed to be getting closer but no cigar. Checked the spark plugs after and all had a little oil on them and carbon on the tip. Checked down into the combustion chamber and did not see any flooded cylinders.

I have attached my most current .msq file. Is my issue most likely a setting(s) in Tunerstudio or something with the installation of parts? Should I look over all of the grounding points I used? I have heard that mentioned as being highly important. Thanks.
Attached Files
File Type: msq 90BaseMap 7-12-12.msq (39.4 KB, 83 views)
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Old 07-24-2012, 10:05 AM   #22
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what size injectors do you have right now installed and what is the req_fuel set to in your map?
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Old 07-24-2012, 11:04 AM   #23
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I have 460cc RX-7 injectors and I believe the REQ_Fuel calculated out at 7.0. I used 12.7 AFR as advised in the Megasquirt manual.

Am I way off here?
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:22 PM   #24
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I am also wondering if I am going about starting the car and setting the timing correctly.

I would set the fixed angle to +10 degrees, and leave the rest of the settings alone. Then messed with the CAS angle a bit to see what kind of difference what would make. Then adjust the triggle angle up or down to see what difference that made. No starting in any of those situations.

Is this something where my timing is off? Or does it sound like I am short on fuel? or spark?

EDIT: Just noticed that the MS manual says to start the engine, THEN change the fixed angle from -10 to 10 degrees. I did that before trying to start the engine.

Would that make the car start or not start? Thanks.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:25 PM   #25
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fueling most liekly.

what your cranking pulsewidth table look like?
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:43 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
fueling most liekly.

what your cranking pulsewidth table look like?
Will have to get back to you on this one. Don't have my laptop with me at work today. I know initially I reduced it by a factor of (230/460) or multiply by .5 & added 1ms back in based on whatever guide I was reading at the time. Then last night, I tried increasing it by .4 or .5 at a time in each cell. Did that maybe twice. Seems to help a bit to keep sputtering for a second but would still die out.

Also tried the same strategy with the after enrichment pulsewidths.
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Old 07-24-2012, 08:19 PM   #27
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Here are a few of the tables. Anything obvious that needs to be changed in these? thanks.
Attached Thumbnails
Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-ase-settings.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-cranking-prime-table.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-dwell-settings.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-ego-control.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-spark-settings.png  

Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-spark-table-1.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-standard-constants.png   Lost on getting my car started. 1.6 M45 w/ MS-ve-table-1.png  
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:59 AM   #28
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Tried starting the car again tonight with no success. Basically the same as yesterday. Took this video to give you guys an idea of what it sounds like and what it's doing.

Miata Engine Start Attempt - YouTube

We got a spark tester and verified that all the coils are sparking. Also checked by listening to the injectors and all seem to be opening.

Here was a thought though, could I not be getting a good fire from the spark plug? They are the NGK 7 temp plugs, gapped to .040" as they come out of the box.
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:37 PM   #29
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Any ideas guys?? I would like to get the car started ASAP and am running out of troubleshooting ideas. Would it help for me to do a datalog during cranking and upload it here?

Is the information I have provided helpful? Any issues that are plain to see in the msq? Thanks.
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:49 PM   #30
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fueling. does it run with throttle open?
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:53 PM   #31
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Have not tried jamming the throttle open while cranking it over.

Would fueling mean working on the cranking/prime table to get more fuel in or the VE table? Basically not getting enough fuel? I have been checking the cylinders after each time at it and they are not flooded yet.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:13 PM   #32
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not during, after cranking. the car technically starts, it just wont stay running.

which makes me think your ve fuel table, ASE table, and/or warmup tables are messed up.

i dont think you have enough fuel after it catches.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:52 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
not during, after cranking. the car technically starts, it just wont stay running.

which makes me think your ve fuel table, ASE table, and/or warmup tables are messed up.

i dont think you have enough fuel after it catches.
Ok, I will try to keep upping the values in those tables and see if I can keep the car running. Will report back.

Do you think my spark plug gap is too large, .040", and might be causing an issue as well? Just want to check it off the list if not applicable.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:02 PM   #34
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doubtful on spark gap.
Anytime you do any changing or tuning you always data log and always make a backup of your current tune.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:06 PM   #35
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Quote:
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doubtful on spark gap.
Anytime you do any changing or tuning you always data log and always make a backup of your current tune.
Understood, definitely new territory for me. Not something I like very much up to this point. Just want to get it running and take it to a pro.

Hopefully I can get it to stay on so far. Glad that nobody has come back large red flags telling I should stop breaking things with such terrible settings
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:12 PM   #36
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I was gonna mention when you start your car and turns over but dies, try holding open the accelerator a tad to see if giving it a tad more air will keep the engine alive.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:17 PM   #37
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Will try. Is that also something I could adjust on TS? I have the TPS unplugged right now and the calibration doesn't work to my knowledge. Also won't let me input 255 for start/stop positions like detailed on boostedmiata.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:17 PM   #38
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What is your fuel table and why do you have 7.0 for req fuel?
if your tps isn't the variable type, don't use it.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:21 PM   #39
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Cranking, ASE and VE Table 1 shown in images in post #27. Req_fuel calculated at 7.0 for the RX-7 460cc injectors @ 12.7 AFR.

TPS is stock, so not variable, and unplugged currently.
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Old 07-25-2012, 07:27 PM   #40
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using e85 or 93 aki?
93 aki change req fuel to 6.2 since you are using 460cc injectors
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