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Old 08-05-2011, 05:34 PM   #1
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Default MS1 setting assistance

To start off I have been reading through MT and megamanual all day.

I need help with a few things:

1. Should I be using the estimate the megamanual states for calculating the cranking pw's (Generally the -40F cranking pulse widths should be about 3 to 5 times the 170F number) and if so what is the best method for faring the in between numbers in?

2. Edit: deleted because it was a stupid question

3. Is the only way to decide on the proper dead time (other than running and making a graph) to measure the voltage at the injectors? Edit: it should be determined by the voltage seen by the ECU


I am trying to make sure my **** is correct because I am having trouble getting the initial startup to happen. I started modifying my startup pw's by using the pw calculator on mt to convert the stock tune from mspnp and inputed them into an old working tune. Then I adjusted down by .2 till I got to .4 @ 160 which didn't get it to start and/or stay running. Then I went up from what I calculated by .2 till I got to a point where it would start and kinda stay running and tried to get it running better by going up/down .1 but it is far from rite. When I would disconnect power to the fuel pump at that point the car would run very smoothly so I really feel the thing is too rich.

For the curious (my setup): stand alone v3 MS1, 90 chassis, stock sensors, id1000's, BP with 84mm pistons, 99 head w/ exhaustake.

Also attached screen shots/tune/log for the curious and here is the ID deadtime chart:




You can belittle me all you want, I know I don't know what I am doing but if you want to trash talk me please throw in something constructive and relevant that will help me get my car started this weekend. Thanks mt
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MS1 setting assistance-ase.jpg   MS1 setting assistance-constants.jpg   MS1 setting assistance-cranking.jpg   MS1 setting assistance-warmup.jpg  
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File Type: msq trying even harder.msq (34.8 KB, 79 views)

Last edited by astroboy; 08-11-2011 at 04:09 PM.
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Old 08-10-2011, 11:50 PM   #2
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So after ******* around with my cranking pw's (started at .2 and went up to 2.0 or something like that) with the tune I posted my **** still wouldn't start.

The I decided the car is still way too rich and it would be a good idea to just go after the req. fuel even though ms calculated it and most concur it should be around 3.2

I dropped it to 2.8 or so and it started and idled for a few seconds till it puttered out (but it was repeatable). Seeing how I can't measure the afr I pulled all of the plugs and they all were wet with fuel. Seeing how my fuel system holds fuel pressure @ 50psi for hours I don't believe fuel is leaking through the injectors.

Now I don't really think this is the correct way to fix whatever problem I have but am not sure what else to do; so I will most likely keep knocking the req. fuel down till something good or bad happens unless I come up with something else. Can somebody please give me any sort of input?
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Old 08-11-2011, 08:36 AM   #3
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Are those peak and hold injectors?

regardless, that's REALLY ambitious of you to try to run those on a MSI in batch configuration...
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Old 08-11-2011, 08:54 AM   #4
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Yeah, just workin with what I have for now. I will be going ms3 after I figure this ms1 stuff out.

I am pretty sure they are peak and hold.
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Old 08-11-2011, 09:20 AM   #5
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I'm sure its still just completely too rich. lower the req_fuel more, lean out the fuel map and enrichments. That thing will probably be able to idle smooth at 11:1.
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Old 08-11-2011, 12:26 PM   #6
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Ok, is there a point where I should stop driving the req. fuel down?
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Old 08-11-2011, 12:57 PM   #7
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We will find out when you tune your fuel map. if you see tiny or huge VE values, then you need to go back to req fuel. Remember when I first messed with your car a year ago? The previous "tuner" had your VE table going into the 200's. I raised your Req. fuel and lowered your VE's.

The difference is your REQ Fuel doesnt only change your VE, it changes ALL fueling calculations. Still, its not a problem to lower it down. just remember you will have to tune everything else later.
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:06 PM   #8
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Ok, I am going to mess with it more this afternoon. Thanks for the help so far guys!


I just got off the phone with T1 motorsports and they said my method for determining dead time is correct (and it should be at 1ms) and the injectors are Saturated. Are there settings I should be changing to accommodate this?
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:31 PM   #9
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nope, saturated just means high impedance, which is what you need if you are running high res code (which u are)
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Old 08-11-2011, 02:24 PM   #10
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K, guess I'll bump down required fuel till she plays ball then.
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Old 08-11-2011, 09:33 PM   #11
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Weeeeeeeeell I called DIYautotune and when I mentioned adjusting the req.fuel and they pointed out that if the cranking rpm's (under more cranking stuff) are lower than the rpm's the engine is turning (which was the case with my settings) ms won't use the cranking pw's.

Sooooooooo I changed it and that ****** started first crank. Then it died, so I started a log and started it a few times. I am not ******* with it any more tonight because there was a pool of oil under her from the other day and I need to find where it is coming from.

Would you better versed lads mind looking again at my log and give me advice? I really hope to break this engine in this weekend.
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File Type: msq original modified.msq (34.8 KB, 74 views)
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Old 08-11-2011, 09:53 PM   #12
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That explains why my car doesnt start for **** in the cold. guess I never have been using cranking pw. Oh well.
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Old 08-11-2011, 10:22 PM   #13
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Sweet, I helped us both out then If I get this hoe working this weekend want to take it out for the break in?

I was looking at the log and was unable to decipher anything useful from it. Can anybody else pick anything up from looking at it?
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Old 08-11-2011, 11:41 PM   #14
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I wont be able to go for a ride unless its sunday... in the rain. And I doubt u will do that.
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Old 08-11-2011, 11:45 PM   #15
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Unfortunately you are correct.
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Old 09-02-2011, 11:15 PM   #16
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Any updates? You have power at your place?
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Old 09-03-2011, 10:18 PM   #17
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I just got power (about 3 hours ago) and haven't done anything with the car yet. Tomorrow should be another story though
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Old 09-28-2011, 09:33 PM   #18
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UPDATES. Whats up stranger?
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Old 09-28-2011, 11:21 PM   #19
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Wana come over and fire this ---- up? Friday is i-day. It's gunna happen.
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:16 AM   #20
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dentist apt at 4 on friday. gotta fix my gf's car this weekend, Her steering rack bushings are non-existent. . . and get some parts on mine. its sitting outside and its killing me.
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