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Hello everybody. Reading through the previous threads I think I have some idea of what my issue is with my car randomly dying, and in some cases getting me stranded in town, but could use some further insight. Quick background, I have a 2002 with an MS3x built by Braineack. The sync errors are random and can occur often in a 10 minute window and then go away for days of long driving.
I see four points that could be where the problem is. Cam sensor, Crank Sensor, MS3 (hardware/software), or the wiring. So far I have replaced the camshaft position sensor with a Beck/Arnley and on my first test drive I had sync errors. I decided to run an older tune and I did not get anything for 2 days so I thought I was onto something. I then decided to run my current tune and not only did my starts become quick, I had no issues for 3 days of heavy driving. This might start explaining my troubles with my startup tuning. Anyways, after my car sat for the work week I started it up and took a composite log where it died at idle. The only time where I successfully captured this type of log.
Attached is my current tune, a log of the issue, and a composite log during idle. I am hoping you guys could look at my composite log and give me some insight of where to look next. Air gap on crank sensor, trying another cam sensor, or adjusting the "CAM input sensitivity? or something" on my MS3x board (I didn't want to fumble with this unless I have decent directions).
I checked the air gap on the crank sensor to a tooth on the flywheel. Slightly less than credit card length but I couldn't get an exact measurement. I think that's about what it should be unless it can bee too close. Should I try enabling noise filtering in TunerStudio?
Brain doesn't usually run noise filtering on his ECUs IIRC, you could try checking the cam sensor connector. Mine was loose and I was able to physically move the connector up/down on the sensor before I zip tied it together. It would occasionally come lose and cause me to lose sync. If the crank sensor is new, and the gap is good, its usually the cam sensor, especially on NB2s. The sensor is prone to heatsoaking, the connector isn't very good, most solve this via hardwiring it or replacing it with the ballenger motorsports one + rewiring it. I can't find any sync loss on your attached crank log.
Brain doesn't usually run noise filtering on his ECUs IIRC, you could try checking the cam sensor connector. Mine was loose and I was able to physically move the connector up/down on the sensor before I zip tied it together. It would occasionally come lose and cause me to lose sync. If the crank sensor is new, and the gap is good, its usually the cam sensor, especially on NB2s. The sensor is prone to heatsoaking, the connector isn't very good, most solve this via hardwiring it or replacing it with the ballenger motorsports one + rewiring it. I can't find any sync loss on your attached crank log.
Thanks for your reply. Funny you post this right as I'm reading through your thread and looking at that Ballenger Motorsports CAM sensor pigtail. I remember reading about the heat soaking before but the solution of deleting the connector wasn't appealing at the time. I'm going to see if I can return my new cam sensor and consider buying this pigtail. Weird you didn't see any sync loss on my composite log, I don't know how to open it so I can't check. Right when I got the sync loss I stopped the logging so it should have been at the end.
The Ballenger Production Cam Sensor kit seems to have done the trick for me. No sync errors so far and my car starts consistently every time, so it fixed my startup issue. This whole time I thought I was just an idiot with startup tuning.
I lied, sync issue is back but start ups remain consistent. Any ideas? I'm thinking about pulling out my MS3x to check the cam/cas pot voltage and possibly making adjustments.
Adjusting the trim pots is your best bet at this point
Yeah, it may be. It's just that I had this MS3x in my last Miata (2004) before putting it in my current 2002 and I never had this problem before. Now perhaps when I modified my plug-n-play harness for '04->'02 I messed something up.
At the moment, I'm more concerned about what this VVT issue with the Ballenger unit is and if it may be responsible for my current sync issue and if it is safe with VVT on.
The Sync issue is, as far as I can tell, fixed. Apparently mounting the sensor 180 degrees makes it play happy with my VVT. A more robust version 2 of my mounting bracket didn't work because, well....it's still metal, magnetic metal, and it was thicker while being next to a sensor that works using a magnet. Surprising the car would run this way with no sync errors but would be very, very difficult to start. This is a temporary solution until Ballenger fixes this for me.
I don't want to be that guy who gave up his Miata because of these Sync issues. Almost two years later and I'm still battling this problem.
What have I tried since my last post:
Installed VVT correct Ballenger Cam sensor
Installed and gapped new Crank sensor
Adjusted Pot voltages on boards after zeroing. R56 to 7.5 turns CW, R11 to 4.5 turns CW, and R32 at 0. (Have not verified voltages with voltmeter)
Checked for missing/damaged teeth on trigger wheel
Secured all sensor connections and bolts.
I still have not isolated where the issue is coming from Cam sensor, Crank sensor, wiring, or ECU. I took another composite log and attached it here. Car lost sync at around 7min 7 sec (427 sec). It's too long for me to open with my peasant version of MegaLogViewer.
Give this a shot since you don't have much to lose and everything to gain. https://mazdaracers.com/topic/5310-c...or-issues-fix/ Go to post #20. Read it very well. Do the pigtail mod or solder directly to an old factory cam sensor (leave the ballenger one alone). Report back.
Give this a shot since you don't have much to lose and everything to gain. https://mazdaracers.com/topic/5310-c...or-issues-fix/ Go to post #20. Read it very well. Do the pigtail mod or solder directly to an old factory cam sensor (leave the ballenger one alone). Report back.
Hi hector,
Thanks for the link to that thread. I am definitely aware the sensors plug could be an issue, but to be clear, you are asking me to try this with my crank sensor and not the CAM sensor which is what is discussed in that thread? The new plug from the Ballenger CAM sensor was supposed to help with that. It's my understanding that the CAM sensor is only used to start the car and to figure out what cycle the engine is in and the crank sensor is what runs while driving around for spark/timing. Therefore if my issues are not with starting the car, but with it dying while driving or at idle, I would think it's the crank sensor in some way?
It would be great if someone was able to get some more insight from my composite log.
I am suggesting you do this with the cam sensor as outlined in the linked thread. In that thread in post #20 you will notice that they tried swapping out various sensors and even wiring harnesses. There just seems to be some issue with the connector that leads to noise which leads to sync errors especially on MS signal decoders.
On VVT cars, the cam signal is always needed, because, VVT. However, that might be something to try. Turn VVT off. Hopefully it will default to the state of using the cam sensor to sync for starting purposes only.
As far as doing this to the crank sensor, well again, it can't hurt. It is not a known issue but when talking about 20 year old cars, anything is possible.
edit: I tried looking at the comp log. I honestly don't know what I'm looking at. Sorry.
08-23-2020, 06:08 PM
MS3 Sync Error 31 & 32 Help Needed
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