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Old 11-28-2010, 07:51 PM   #1
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Default Noob spark table question

I found the first on Miata .net, while the second image is the first spark table in the default MSPNP map (w/AFM) and the third image, the second spark table. To me, the second spark table looks far more like a stock Miata table might look.

What am I missing?
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Noob spark table question-spark3.jpg   Noob spark table question-spark1.jpg   Noob spark table question-spark2.jpg  
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Old 11-28-2010, 07:56 PM   #2
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93' 1.6 that is.
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Old 11-28-2010, 08:03 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
the second spark table. To me, the second spark table looks far more like a stock Miata table might look.

What am I missing?
it's scaled for boost, while the third table is scale for what looks like a mid to high altitude car
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Old 11-28-2010, 09:22 PM   #4
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Keep in mind that a naturally aspirated engine can only go up to 101.3kPa @ sea level, or whatever the atmospheric pressure is at your elevation, and from 0-100kPa the last two maps are relatively similar, with the middle one a little more aggressive and scaled for boost.

Idk why the last spark table only goes to 6400 rpm and has funky rpm intervals though.. where did you get it? It looks like it's for a supercharged v8.

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Old 11-28-2010, 11:33 PM   #5
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It was the spark table 2 from the stock MSPNP map with the AFM. I guess it's not used, but I was wondering. Now why would they put a map in accounting for boost if they say it's for a stock Miata?
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Old 11-28-2010, 11:52 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
It was the spark table 2 from the stock MSPNP map with the AFM. I guess it's not used, but I was wondering. Now why would they put a map in accounting for boost if they say it's for a stock Miata?
the explanation I was given is. If a turbo owner tries to run an NA map they risk engine failure. If an NA owner runs a turbo map they risk using a lower resolution table.
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Old 11-29-2010, 12:52 PM   #7
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I don't suppose they gave you a why on that? ;-)
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Old 11-29-2010, 12:56 PM   #8
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my map is very close to the attached OEM 1.6L WOT map.



The maps you posted are retarded to keep **** safe as a base.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:03 PM   #9
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my map is very close to the attached OEM 1.6L WOT map.



The maps you posted are retarded to keep **** safe as a base.
my map looks like yours, just tops out at 105 kpa
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:09 PM   #10
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And if you look at the 100kPa row, it's very similar to the oem map, a little advance in lower RPMs and less advanced in upper rpms...but not by much.

I know DIYautotune found that, N/A, they make best power on the map they provide without risking too much advance. So around the lower 30s should suffice for most people...going more advance probably nets no extra power. They have the dyno, I don't.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
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the explanation I was given is. If a turbo owner tries to run an NA map they risk engine failure. If an NA owner runs a turbo map they risk using a lower resolution table.
Actually, are you talking about a a boosted car using a stock table? As in my Greddy? I was using a Bipes to pull timing, and if I were to use the second table, I'd pull timing as well once it hit boost along the lines of what the Bipes was doing.

However, since the second table actually goes up to about 5psi (if I'm not deluded) then it would work as well.

What I'm wondering is why the stock table goes all the way up to 230 kpa which is way, way more boost than I'm capable of. I guess I'm going to do my own which tops out with my own measly 5 psi.

A lot to learn, though it's beginning to make sense. One of these first days, there'll be one of these things that tunes itself without even having to attach laptop.

Need to go logging and maybe smooth out some of the rough spots. I'm pretty sure they didn't do this map in cold weather! ;-)
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:18 PM   #12
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You'll have to rework the entire map if you ever run more than 5psi. Just leave it scaled to 230kPa and tune within your window. There's no real loss of resolution since there isn't much change happening between rows/columns.
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Old 11-29-2010, 02:42 PM   #13
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Sounds like a better idea. Less work.
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:44 PM   #14
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One thing I still don't get. Why does the table from Miata.net say 10 BTDC at 800 rpm, and the MSPNP 17 BTDC. Is there some sort of offset that I'm not getting, or is there more info I'm lacking?
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:50 PM   #15
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When's the last time you saw your timing map hit 800RPM at 100kPa?
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Old 11-29-2010, 04:57 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonljacobi View Post
One thing I still don't get. Why does the table from Miata.net say 10 BTDC at 800 rpm, and the MSPNP 17 BTDC. Is there some sort of offset that I'm not getting, or is there more info I'm lacking?
I believe the MS is counting the 10* base timing in the table. Is this right Brain?
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:04 PM   #17
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no. the basemap from diy idles at 17*. the stock miata doesn't always idle at 10*.

i idle at 12* without a/c and 17* with. whatever works.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:13 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
no. the basemap from diy idles at 17*. the stock miata doesn't always idle at 10*.

i idle at 12* without a/c and 17* with. whatever works.
would that be the same if you set the CAS to 0* instead of the 10* DIY says?
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:16 PM   #19
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no. you intially lock your timing at 10 when you install your MS to simply sync the CAS signal to the MS. it's an arbitrary number. You could set it to 0 or 20 and do the same.

on their map, they like to idle at 17, and thus is why that area is all 17. They also like to idle at 13.0:1.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:19 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
no. you intially lock your timing at 10 when you install your MS to simply sync the CAS signal to the MS. it's an arbitrary number. You could set it to 0 or 20 and do the same.
the mud is clearing
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