pre-dyno tuning / minimizing dyno time and ching-dow
08-09-2008, 05:15 PM
#22
Y8S this is what I'm using for AFR targets currently. So MLV changes everything around idle and I change those 4 cells back to 44 because I've tried manually lowering the VE in those cells and the idle gets rough and there's a lot of popping going on. I'm also currently at 18 degrees advance in those cells, I'll try 14.
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08-09-2008, 05:41 PM
#24
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Y8S this is what I'm using for AFR targets currently. So MLV changes everything around idle and I change those 4 cells back to 44 because I've tried manually lowering the VE in those cells and the idle gets rough and there's a lot of popping going on. I'm also currently at 18 degrees advance in those cells, I'll try 14.
Lean those cells and play with spark, its worked for me.
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08-09-2008, 07:26 PM
#25
I did a short datalog of the idle after changing the advance to 14 like you advised. I was able to bring the VE down to 35 in the cells around idle and now the AFRs are hovering around 13 but the AFRs and RPM hunt a bit more as well. This is definitely a step in the right direction though! Anything of interest in the datalog or should I just keep playing with spark and ve? Thanks for the help thus far!
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08-09-2008, 07:29 PM
#26
btw, my injectors are 550cc rx7 injectors but flowed at 620cc when i sent them out, call them what you will
and after today i think i have it dialed in to idle 14.8-15.2 even with 123 degrees of iat heatsoak
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08-10-2008, 10:23 AM
#29
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you can add a few degrees to your timing map and maybe a little fuel BELOW your idle cells to generate more power during idle dips. or you can open the idle screw and decrease the idle valve pulsewidth so there's more air for "catching" the rpm drop.
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08-10-2008, 11:06 AM
#31
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MSI HiRes with 550s and 460s in my 2 Miatas and I can idle em both at 15, 16, or 17 AFR. WTF are you doing wrong? I run 18 degrees at idle for both. Using the correct Req Fuel value for each, not inflated for higher res. Idle cells are in the 40's for both cars.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
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08-10-2008, 12:04 PM
#32
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You don't need a dyno to tune the spark map of a car, but you do need a repeatable piece of road and someone in the car doing the tuning other than the driver. It is possible albeit more labor intensive to get a great map on the road, provided you have the right road and a car that is reasonably safe to drive.
You want to find a long uphill stretch of straight road in the middle of nowhere. Baker Grade in California is perfect for this but roads like this exist everywhere. Unfortunately you can't do the speed limited type of tuning that is possible on a dyno, but you can get really close, close enough not to matter.
Datalogs are your friend, stolen spark tables are your friend, remember your motor is likely to act in a VERY similar manner to most everyone else. Dyno time is really useful when you are looking for that last 5-10 HP, that's it. Everything else can be done on the road.
I would rent the dyno without any tuning support. Most dyno guys can't help themselves anyway, they'll likely jump in and help. Rent an hour, see how you do after you have really thoroughly road tuned it.
Mark
You want to find a long uphill stretch of straight road in the middle of nowhere. Baker Grade in California is perfect for this but roads like this exist everywhere. Unfortunately you can't do the speed limited type of tuning that is possible on a dyno, but you can get really close, close enough not to matter.
Datalogs are your friend, stolen spark tables are your friend, remember your motor is likely to act in a VERY similar manner to most everyone else. Dyno time is really useful when you are looking for that last 5-10 HP, that's it. Everything else can be done on the road.
I would rent the dyno without any tuning support. Most dyno guys can't help themselves anyway, they'll likely jump in and help. Rent an hour, see how you do after you have really thoroughly road tuned it.
Mark
Would anyone care to explain this part: "You want to find a long uphill stretch of straight road" a little further?
What I mean is; why on an uphill and what grade?
Thanks
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08-10-2008, 12:22 PM
#33
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MSI HiRes with 550s and 460s in my 2 Miatas and I can idle em both at 15, 16, or 17 AFR. WTF are you doing wrong? I run 18 degrees at idle for both. Using the correct Req Fuel value for each, not inflated for higher res. Idle cells are in the 40's for both cars.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
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08-10-2008, 12:35 PM
#34
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and more importantly, if you try to go flat out in taller (4th, 5th) gears to fine tune your high boost maps, you'll end up going very fast on public roads.
on a steep hill in 2nd you can keep it at reasonable speeds.
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08-10-2008, 12:39 PM
#35
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steep as possible. the reason is that you can't generate full boost in lower gears because there's not enough load on the motor
and more importantly, if you try to go flat out in taller (4th, 5th) gears to fine tune your high boost maps, you'll end up going very fast on public roads.
on a steep hill in 2nd you can keep it at reasonable speeds.
and more importantly, if you try to go flat out in taller (4th, 5th) gears to fine tune your high boost maps, you'll end up going very fast on public roads.
on a steep hill in 2nd you can keep it at reasonable speeds.
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08-10-2008, 03:11 PM
#37
MSI HiRes with 550s and 460s in my 2 Miatas and I can idle em both at 15, 16, or 17 AFR. WTF are you doing wrong? I run 18 degrees at idle for both. Using the correct Req Fuel value for each, not inflated for higher res. Idle cells are in the 40's for both cars.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
Thought you were gonna make it down this way one day so mess with your MS.
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08-10-2008, 07:34 PM
#38
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Also if you are looking for a spot on tune contact Tony at T1 in Dallas, he is the man.
He tuned a buddy of mines Civic for under $600 and that included installing Hondata, and the car seriously behaves like stock.
Not only that, but you will go home with a baggy that has a lifetime supply of sparkplugs as he pulls them after every run to check for detonation and swaps in a new set.
He tuned a buddy of mines Civic for under $600 and that included installing Hondata, and the car seriously behaves like stock.
Not only that, but you will go home with a baggy that has a lifetime supply of sparkplugs as he pulls them after every run to check for detonation and swaps in a new set.
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08-10-2008, 10:55 PM
#40
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If you do a pull, then pull the plugs immediately afterwards if there was any detonation, including any you wouldn't be able to hear, it will show up as shiny metal like flakes on the plug.
That is what I was told from Tony himself, who I would trust with any tuning based information.
That is what I was told from Tony himself, who I would trust with any tuning based information.
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