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Old 09-11-2017, 06:04 PM   #1081
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My car a year ago was a roach(as Emilio likes to call it). It never saw an alignment rack until Sonny set it up here in prep for WSC.

Marcus' car has/had, more camber, more power, more rpm, ~80lbs more weight, sticker tires and I had another year of seat time in PT prepped NBs. We also didn't have the mental stress of double dipping into PT and were running within 7lbs of min weight every session. Marcus knew his fuel weight really well.(This time around I was the driver carrying the spare tire for ballast though!)
My Giken was not used to capacity because of my stock 7200rpm limiter. I was shifting at corner exit last year, where Marcus' car gets to pull for a while and make use of the exit speed better.

My inconsistent driving combined with the diff and brake issues cost us at least a second which would have allowed us to run with Nueman.

Theoretical gains from having the extra 15-20whp to reach the class cap or a 4.7 Giken only point to proof that PT NBs should run in the 39s.
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Old 09-11-2017, 06:10 PM   #1082
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Proof of terribad driving, torsen spinning and brake lockup issues:

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Old 09-11-2017, 07:13 PM   #1083
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Before PTE is gone, I really want to see a fully dialed NB1 points build with a top level driver set times at VIR, Mid-O, Sonoma, Miller, Watkins Glen and Buttonwillow. Those are all tracks we never got to with Super.
In 2012, I left a full second on the table with Crusher in the TT on A6's. The diff was toast, it was about 30whp down above 7500rpm (135 vs 172) and the car got about 1s a last faster when we brought it back and Greg changed the rules.
We were classed at 172 but made 159 at 7200rpm on their dyno. By 8200 it was down to about 135. That should have been a low 1:35 but I never went out in the fast session Sunday morning when everyone else dropped over a second. With a healthy engine and fresh diff, high 1:33's, I have no doubt.

That all leads me to believe that our mythical 142whp/2410# NB1 on R7's could do a 1:37 in good weather at Mid O. It's there.
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Old 09-11-2017, 07:25 PM   #1084
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Before PTE is gone, I really want to see a fully dialed NB1 points build with a top level driver set times at VIR, Mid-O, Sonoma, Miller, Watkins Glen and Buttonwillow. Those are all tracks we never got to with Super.
In 2012, I left a full second on the table with Crusher in the TT on A6's. The diff was toast, it was about 30whp down above 7500rpm (135 vs 172) and the car got about 1s a last faster when we brought it back and Greg changed the rules.
We were classed at 172 but made 159 at 7200rpm on their dyno. By 8200 it was down to about 135. That should have been a low 1:35 but I never went out in the fast session Sunday morning when everyone else dropped over a second. With a healthy engine and fresh diff, high 1:33's, I have no doubt.

That all leads me to believe that our mythical 142whp/2410# NB1 on R7's could do a 1:37 in good weather at Mid O. It's there.
Kohler did a 2:14.96 there at VIR during ECC. The NASA-MA record is stupid soft, it's a 2:16.19.

I've run a 2:17.2 (Should have been a 2:17 flat, but 4th gear was checking out) in a dyno classed NB2 that was 100lbs overweight, has no detune, no E85, factory LSD, no front end 0 pt aero, SM7s, factory glass, has never seen a tire pyrometer, and has an average driver at best so I'm thinking even Kohler's time is soft if you catch the right weather. (March or October are the events you're most likely to get the best conditions... or rain)

Go talk Tom Long or Mike Skeen into smashing a club record.
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Old 09-12-2017, 10:26 AM   #1085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doward View Post
Watching this back is painful. I've been working on my steering inputs alot and trying to stop sawing(SoloNats didn't help this), and to have a lighter grip in general. Adjusting to multiple cars each day is tough, and I never felt like I nailed a whole lap. :(

The laptime was amazing given the gremlins, but I see sooo much time left on the table under braking for all the right handers, Keyhole, T7, T11 into Thunder Valley, Carousel. The right rear would lock with what felt like 60% brake pedal if there was any steering angle input at all. I also missed the apex in keyhole and have to breathe off the throttle during exit, this ends up costing me several mph and negating the need for a 5th gear upshift(was this a wash? need data.), nearly miss the downshift at China Beach, coast through 10B and into 11 with a neutered line/entry to get the braking down in as straight a line as possible. All that and still set a PB. Your car is an $80 prop valve away from beating Neuman. That motor was clearly making some hero horsepower right before it let go!

Thanks again for letting me wheel a couple sessions! I never expected a low 1:41 (no offense) so it was awesome to achieve that. Nolan has gotten much faster this season and is legitimate competition. He nudged me back to third on Sunday when I drove another competitor's car.
Hope you make it back, Mid O is tough to master.

A purpose built NB1 points car would go 1:38.9 in weather like we had Saturday morning.. I want so bad to see it happen.
Anytime man! That event with you made me realize my car is actually faster(competitive) than I thought it was haha. Still kicking myself for not installing the prop valve awhile back when I bought it from ya. For the shifting...my power falls off pretty hard after 6500, as a typical oem 4W does. So probably 6 one way, half a dozen the other *shrug*.

In regards to your hand grip, James and I both noticed you actually had a really light grip on the wheel. Mine was much tighter, but that was my first event with a proper steering rack. It was a literal work out beforehand. You were clearly comfortable in my car, slipping up and down madness with ease.


Quote:
Originally Posted by doward View Post
My car a year ago was a roach(as Emilio likes to call it). It never saw an alignment rack until Sonny set it up here in prep for WSC.

Marcus' car has/had, more camber, more power, more rpm, ~80lbs more weight, sticker tires and I had another year of seat time in PT prepped NBs. We also didn't have the mental stress of double dipping into PT and were running within 7lbs of min weight every session. Marcus knew his fuel weight really well.(This time around I was the driver carrying the spare tire for ballast though!)
My Giken was not used to capacity because of my stock 7200rpm limiter. I was shifting at corner exit last year, where Marcus' car gets to pull for a while and make use of the exit speed better.

My inconsistent driving combined with the diff and brake issues cost us at least a second which would have allowed us to run with Nueman.

Theoretical gains from having the extra 15-20whp to reach the class cap or a 4.7 Giken only point to proof that PT NBs should run in the 39s.

I'm 100% confident my car with correct brake bias, on-the-money weight, and another 15whp would be in the 1:38s at Mid-O with you driving for sure. My next trip up I plan to put down some 1:41s or 1:40s....hopefully.


Quote:
Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
Before PTE is gone, I really want to see a fully dialed NB1 points build with a top level driver set times at VIR, Mid-O, Sonoma, Miller, Watkins Glen and Buttonwillow. Those are all tracks we never got to with Super.
In 2012, I left a full second on the table with Crusher in the TT on A6's. The diff was toast, it was about 30whp down above 7500rpm (135 vs 172) and the car got about 1s a last faster when we brought it back and Greg changed the rules.
We were classed at 172 but made 159 at 7200rpm on their dyno. By 8200 it was down to about 135. That should have been a low 1:35 but I never went out in the fast session Sunday morning when everyone else dropped over a second. With a healthy engine and fresh diff, high 1:33's, I have no doubt.

That all leads me to believe that our mythical 142whp/2410# NB1 on R7's could do a 1:37 in good weather at Mid O. It's there.
Getting both of those two together is difficult, but possible!

With my engine going out I'm at a turning point. Do I....
A. Source another "junkyard" engine and put'er in, continue to run rest of season, and stay on schedule for cage install.
B. Build a 0 points engine, buy ECU, move points around, cry a little, swap to corn, tune it correctly for 140-145ish, and push the cage back a couple of months.

I like option B because
1. It SHOULD last many track hours
2. I know I could beat the PTE(1:43.5ish) and TTE(1:43.1xx) records at Road Atlanta with that power. My PB with ~130 is a 1:44.2xx and ~5hp on that track nets quite a bit of time.

However, I don't like that option because it pushes my cage plans back and stretches my budget pretty thin. I sometimes forget this is my "hobby" since I'm so involved with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FatKao View Post
Kohler did a 2:14.96 there at VIR during ECC. The NASA-MA record is stupid soft, it's a 2:16.19.

I've run a 2:17.2 (Should have been a 2:17 flat, but 4th gear was checking out) in a dyno classed NB2 that was 100lbs overweight, has no detune, no E85, factory LSD, no front end 0 pt aero, SM7s, factory glass, has never seen a tire pyrometer, and has an average driver at best so I'm thinking even Kohler's time is soft if you catch the right weather. (March or October are the events you're most likely to get the best conditions... or rain)

Go talk Tom Long or Mike Skeen into smashing a club record.
I believe I did 2:19s at ViR there on RS3s the time I went there two years ago. So low 2:14s/high 2:13s is definitely possible with top flight NB1 points build. I planned to make Oktoberfest next month, but engine woes has stopped that.
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Old 09-12-2017, 10:12 PM   #1086
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Anyone pull the seat mounting brackets out? Looking to see what size spot weld bit i'll need.
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Old 09-13-2017, 02:03 PM   #1087
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Originally Posted by blkmkiii View Post
Anyone pull the seat mounting brackets out? Looking to see what size spot weld bit i'll need.
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Old 09-15-2017, 07:11 PM   #1088
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NASA August 2017 MidOhio Performance Touring Race Report:

David Zeigler's first PTE race, resets Mid Ohio pro Course record to 1:40.31.
He is a good driver and in a no-aero, R7 NB1.


PTD record was also reset at the same event, to 1:43.011.....
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