HPDE / track day safety gear flow chart !!
06-08-2017, 01:54 PM
#402
Warning: I'm going to use the "D" word in the following post. I hope it doesn't trigger anyone.
The point of safety was really driven home to me yesterday and the fact of never taking short cuts. My best friend has been dealing with back issues the last few years and has been trying non-surgical routes to help the issue to no avail. Well yesterday he found out hes going to need major surgery on his back to fix cracked vertebrae. The likely cause? Improperly installed harnesses in his drift oriented AE86. In a rush and tight on cash he had installed his harness to the rear seat belt lugs and said "good enough, I'll get a cage/roll bar later". Well at an event held on a terraced parking lot, he understeered, when over a curb, and down to the next level air born. His best impression of a lawn dart left the car a write-off (buckled the roof) and him hurt. The ER found nothing then (hence why he's been trying PT, stretches, etc.) The harnesses likely compressed his spine beyond its limits and fractured his vertebrae. All of that for going no faster than 40-50 mph. Luckily the damage is somewhat repairable, but he may always be dealing with back pain for the rest of his life. Really makes me think about the safety measures I have in my street/HDPE car.
The point of safety was really driven home to me yesterday and the fact of never taking short cuts. My best friend has been dealing with back issues the last few years and has been trying non-surgical routes to help the issue to no avail. Well yesterday he found out hes going to need major surgery on his back to fix cracked vertebrae. The likely cause? Improperly installed harnesses in his drift oriented AE86. In a rush and tight on cash he had installed his harness to the rear seat belt lugs and said "good enough, I'll get a cage/roll bar later". Well at an event held on a terraced parking lot, he understeered, when over a curb, and down to the next level air born. His best impression of a lawn dart left the car a write-off (buckled the roof) and him hurt. The ER found nothing then (hence why he's been trying PT, stretches, etc.) The harnesses likely compressed his spine beyond its limits and fractured his vertebrae. All of that for going no faster than 40-50 mph. Luckily the damage is somewhat repairable, but he may always be dealing with back pain for the rest of his life. Really makes me think about the safety measures I have in my street/HDPE car.
https://www.schrothracing.com/products/quickfit#3317
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06-08-2017, 02:08 PM
#404
mkturbo.com
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I have budgeted $1000 per halo seat, then $300-$500 for Schroth endurance 6 point harnesses, then another $500 for HANS like device.
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06-09-2017, 09:34 AM
#405
I honestly can't see how the ASM which is nothing more than a tear away section like a factory belt changes physics. With it mounted like that it'll compress the spine, no way it won't. The lap belt will also ride up to abdomen and cause internal damage, again no way it won't. Then there is the submarining risk, ehh maybe the ASM works here? I just get the feeling scroth had enough cash for lawyers.
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06-09-2017, 12:16 PM
#408
Former Vendor
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I honestly can't see how the ASM which is nothing more than a tear away section like a factory belt changes physics. With it mounted like that it'll compress the spine, no way it won't. The lap belt will also ride up to abdomen and cause internal damage, again no way it won't. Then there is the submarining risk, ehh maybe the ASM works here? I just get the feeling scroth had enough cash for lawyers.
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06-09-2017, 01:42 PM
#411
Like I said, maybe the ASM helps with submarining.... And it looks like it does. You can see the belts are installed with the shoulder straps at the correct level, not anything like the install posted above. Even then you can see where the lap belt rode up slightly. A 5 or 6 point would be better in this regard, but hey maybe this it's acceptable to you. I know there is a better and even cheaper option available so that's what I installed in my car to protect my life.
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06-09-2017, 01:53 PM
#412
1:38 you can see the harness enter the dummy's gut. If the impact was over 3 g (could happen at 35mph), chances are it would be non-survivable.
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Your Source For Motorsports Safety Equipment
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703.430.3303
info@ogracing.com
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06-20-2017, 02:31 PM
#415
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Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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Read this whole thread from start to finish. Trying to figure out how best to arrive at safe/practical/dual-purpose, and it would seem that as with fast/reliable/cheap, you can only pick two.
For autocross and the occasional HPDE, I'm considering buying a Tillett B5 in order to maintain the OE safety systems for road use (3-point, OE wheel), and harness/HANS/center net for HPDE. Is this a good compromise between road usability and on-track safety? There were a few posts regarding Tillett, but I don't believe anyone commented on their overall safety, specifically the B5, since it is not FIA certified. Per the chart an A- rating is possible without an FIA seat but with added bracing. Would a B5 require bracing? I'm assuming that mostly refers to aluminum seats like the Kirkey.
For autocross and the occasional HPDE, I'm considering buying a Tillett B5 in order to maintain the OE safety systems for road use (3-point, OE wheel), and harness/HANS/center net for HPDE. Is this a good compromise between road usability and on-track safety? There were a few posts regarding Tillett, but I don't believe anyone commented on their overall safety, specifically the B5, since it is not FIA certified. Per the chart an A- rating is possible without an FIA seat but with added bracing. Would a B5 require bracing? I'm assuming that mostly refers to aluminum seats like the Kirkey.
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06-20-2017, 02:37 PM
#416
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IMO there is no compromise between track and street. You need to swap the seat. I run an Elise seat, 3-points, airbag on the street. For the track, I drop in an FIA Halo seat on a PCI bracket, Schroth FIA 6-points, and remove the airbag. Takes me about half an hour to do the swap. That gives me everything except the cage, and knowing that, I don't go 10/10ths through certain corners and I won't run at certain tracks.
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06-20-2017, 07:46 PM
#417
Elite Member
Join Date: May 2008
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Andrew, I assume you trailer your car to the track. That's another consideration for those who don't have a trailer, tow vehicle and assorted extra parking space. I have a track-dedicated vehicle, but it still has to traverse city streets and highway to get to our local track. Doing a switch-over at the track isn't an option, so some sort of compromise is forced either for on-track activities or the commute.
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06-21-2017, 07:56 AM
#420
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Join Date: Jan 2016
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but honestly for a dual duty car the real question is: Will a 6-point harness + Elise seats (or similar non-halo-seats be safer or more dangerous than a sloppy 3-point belt and wodden Nardi non-airbag wheel?
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