will definitely agree with you.

if i had to pick just one, id say R&P.

 

rt615
star specs (all of them)
nt01s
z214 c71
hoosier a6
kumho xs
rs3

I'll probably never buy anything other than nt01s again. 4th set and I couldn't be happier. They are not very good in wet track days so maybe I'll get myself a wet setup.

 

Hooser SM7 take-offs. Because $100 to $200 for a set of four.

 

Shopping for new tires. Don't want to get so wide that I overtire the little car. I've read the tire thread, but still have Q's on my selection:

For those that roadrace: Will I be faster on a 225x50 or a 245x45 r7 hoosiers?

2500#, only 250 rwhp, 9"rim, fenders rolled/not pulled, typical racing height and alignment, home track is PIR.

 

I've just about reached the same point and I'm also thinking about a cheap dedicated wet setup. Anyone have any suggestions? I've read the LeChump forums a little to try and see what they use, but those guys are running enduros so they want a tire that is just acceptable in the rain and still very fast in the dry. I want NT01s for dry and damp conditions, plus a set of real rain tires so that I'm not sitting in the paddock pissed off when the whole day gets rained out and there's standing water and rivers running across the track.

So far my top contender is the BFG g-Force Sport COMP-2. It's the required rain tire for NASA Spec Z and a full set in 195/55/15 is $327 shipped from discount tire. I know it probably won't come close to a set of Hoosier wets, but I'm talking track days, not real racing and... $327 vs. ~$1000.

 

Buy a set of used Hoosier h2o's from a spec miata racer. They can be had cheap as they only stay fresh for about 2 season's. These make a very good intermediate rain tire when shaved/worn to about 1/2 tread and hardened by a little age.

 

For HPDE I think it's hard to beat the RA-1. Sure, it's old school but they work and they last. Some people claim that they are decent in the wet as well.

After reading the other pissing match thread I did some research on Tire Rack. Something I think some people have missed is that section width of a tire IS NOT equal to the tread width of the tire. Just looking at the specs on Tire rack, many 205/50/15 tires have a smaller tread width than section width.

205/50/15 Toyo RA1-8.4 inch section width/8 inch tread width
205/50/15 Potenza RE-71R-8.4 inch section width/7 inch tread width
205/5015 Dunlop Z2-8.4 inch section width/7.5 inch tread width

Point is that saying that a 205 50 15 on an 8 inch wheel is always best is only part of the story.

 

There are street tires that beat the RA-1 in every measurable metric

several different street tires

 

Which RA-1? I'm under the impression that the latest versions of the RA-1 is very similar to the NT 01. Also, are you referring to shaved street tires or as manufactured? Certainly the NT 01 and RA-1 have the advantage due to a more shallow tread depth which prevent squirming and chunking on track.

Personally I prefer the feel of the RA-1 over the original Star Spec. I also prefer the feel of the Yoke AD 08 over the Star Spec. Maybe that's the difference in slip angles making one easier to drive than the other.

 

I dunno, Chump experience here...The rivals really weren't bad in the wet (atleast compared to everyone else!). I will say I run NT-01s in the dry on the miata. Once its down to a slick, it doesn't make sense as a wet tire...I would stick with an extreme summer, maybe that new Bridgestone or the old RE-11? I have also heard good things aobut the Z2s in the wet.

 

It might just have been my car setup and track conditions but I felt like I was driving on the edge of a knife with the original Star Specs in the rain.

 

205 50 15 Hoosier H20 are $173 a piece last time I checked.


Heck, I just did a heck of a fun rain race at Autobahn South NASA event last month with GT Radials treadwear 460 that cost me a less than $200 shipped for the set of 4 from Discount tire (195 55 15). Not as good as RA1 full treads but a hell of a lot cheaper too! (plus they are the drive to/from track tires for our G20)

 

I used to do this with motocross tyres when I raced the national series and so on here...

Spare set of wheels with a new set of standard tyres on ONLY for use in wet weather. Same theory in motocross as wet weather tyres applies, sharp edges with as deep a tread/knobby as possible.

In my case my first ever race (about 2 years ago) was in a near monsoon day on a set of brand new 205 50 15 Dunlop 03g's....they were amazing until I ham fistedly did a full power 4th-5th gear change right on top of a river across the track.....the quick step out and save was sphincter clincher for sure but I qualified 3rd out of 15 experienced competitors.

I have since switched to 225 Nitto NTt01's and believe they will work the same....short of big puddles/rivers.

The great thing is as the "dry" tyres wear, the used (or unused) wets get cycled to the dry setup and you don't end up with a 4 year old set of hardened wets you have barely used....which used to be the case when I raced road bikes.

Unless you constantly race in rain then I would consider a proper rain set....

 

BFG R1S, A6 / A7 = AX, TT or W2W qualifying ( or National / Major W2W )


BFG R1, R6, R7 = W2W or fast track day

888, NT01, RA1, 555 = track day ( no track records )


Toyo R1R = wet track


Hoosier = wet track ( the fastest )

 

RE-11a's great for an all purpose tire and I use it to drive to and from the track as well as on the track. Tires grip well for a street tire.

 

You're saying that the newest street tires (RE71-R, BFG S) are better in the wet than a similarly sized RA-1? i.e. a 205 on an 8" wheel? I do like my RA-1 for the wet, but they aren't cheap so it'd be great to hear if there's data supporting that the new breed of street tires trumps a 100TWR ole' reliable goat in the wet.

 

The local autox classes here are pretty basic and hinges on tire tread wear, 140tw and up is "Street class", the "unlimited" class is spec tire of either the R888 or RA1. As the level of chassis work/prep in my car is far beyond what a "street" car is considered to be I have been bumped into the unlimited class.

Right now I'm on 2 year old 225/45R15 R1R's. Considering my 1.6 lacks in the power department and that the car is ~2100lbs, would the RA1/R888 in 225's have diminishing returns over 205's?

 

What width are the wheels?

 

15x8 Konig Flatout's

 

205 on an 8" will give you a better turn in and feel, 225 on an 8 might give you a little more grip but will probably suffer in transitions and turn in. I'd go with the 205. If you're sticking with the 8" wheels and don't mind the faster wear rates RE71Rs in a 205 will be quicker than the RA1s/R888s on an 8" wheel, and possibly quicker than the 225 RA1/R888 on a 9.

In autocross more grip is always better, maintain that momentum. Track is a little bit different since there's a lot more straightaway and faster speeds.