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Old 02-21-2012, 05:17 PM   #41
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Good to hear that things are moving in the right direction again. Keep it up

- Tom
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Old 04-07-2012, 04:30 PM   #42
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I had my first track day last weekend with the rotrex and it performed flawlessly! w00t! The DFC/super/power/voodoo card is pig-rich and uninspiring, but at least my ---- didn't explode. IAT's (from what I could tell) were WAY warmer than I'm comfortable with so I restarted my intercooler project...

Oh, that reminds me, I've decided to turn this into a build thread where I complain about more things not working properly.




I made it home early-ish last night, got all my tools and parts out and got to work. Step one is to pull the nose and the ductwork off the front of the car... Then I lol'd, then reassembled everything and went back in the house.

It looks like the 99/00 cars have a dryer that lives in front of the core:

And basically takes up ALLLLL the prime real estate for the end of the core and the hoses. FML.

The internet claims this is a 2001+ core, You can see the dryer on the left side:

Mobius build thread seems to back this up. While not insurmountable, its a huge pain in the *** and something I was not prepared for last night. I'm looking into seeing if I can replace the 99/00 condenser with a 01+, plenty of used parts in the FS section.

Also: power steering "cooler" and lines are all kinds of in the way. Mobus sliced his off and ran rubber, I'll have to ask what kind of hose he used. Of course, the quick and dirty fix is to eliminate the AC and depower the steering rack... I'm still trying to decide if I can live without AC.

My Hornetball-style cowl intake is also stalled. I bought pipe and couplers for 2.75" only to discover that 2.75" + coupler + hose clamp is not going to fit in the space between the brake booster and master cylinder. The flange on my Aircraft Spruce duct thing is 2.5" so I'll most likely reorder my plumbing in 2.5". This should pose no restriction as the rotrex inlet is only about 51mm or 2" IIRC.

Brainy got my DIYPNP back to me earlier this week. I've not got it installed yet and it looks like I'm not going to have time to do it this weekend. SUCK! This means I also miss the dyno and tune session with Savington up in San Jose. Much sadness.

I'm also a ----- and bought NT01s:

Anyone want to buy my RS3s? Gently used with 4k street miles, 1 track day at Thunderhill and one weekend at Laguna Seca in the rain (last weekend.) I FINALLY managed to rub the "VENTUS" and the flames off the tread this last Sunday. Not abused because I drive like a noob

My baller VEI gauges and 2004 instrument cluster finally showed up. I will eventually merge these into one unit, and it will be glorious. More on this later.

Of course the FIRST THING I did was drop this ****** and crack the lens (lower left.) FML

Also, my coworkers started giving me ---- about driving a "gay car" again. They swapped my mousepad with a grossly undersized pink Hello Kitty unit. I decided to one up them with a new key ring:

This seems to have confused them even further. I await their next move.

Crap I need to do:

Figure out my PS/AC bullshit so I can...
Mount and plumb my intercooler
Replace my AEM UEGO with LC1
Temp install VEI AFR & Vac-Boost gauge
Temp install VEI oil pressure & oil temp gauge
Temp install VEI IAT & coolant temp gauges
Install a real header (RacingBeat or OBX or something, no riceland)
Install early gen 1 Flyin' Miata 2.5" stainless turbo exhaust (its not loud )
Buy parts for my Hornetball style intake, again
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Old 04-07-2012, 07:42 PM   #43
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Glad to hear things are getting sorted out.
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Old 04-08-2012, 12:17 AM   #44
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Regarding the PS cooler, on my car the hard lines run from a bracket on the lower left (left/right as seen from the steering wheel), diagonally up to the hood latch area, then across the hood latch area and loops back. A fairly sizable piece of contoured plumbing. I cut off everything except the horizontal loop part up by the hood latch.

PS hose from any parts store.

More about the gauge cluster plans. I am dissatisfied with my idiot oil pressure gauge in the cluster, and my semi-idiot coolant gauge , and am exploring alternatives. My 3 gauges in the radio console plus a scangauge give me all the information but it would be nice to move more into the cluster.

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Old 04-08-2012, 01:06 AM   #45
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Very cool, looking forward to seeing progress on this. You might have a bridge to sell me for mentioning this, but apparently KW/Skunk2 are getting back in the game with Rotrex and Miata plans.

There's some chatter over on m.net from people who have spoken with them recently, who have apparently been told they are working on a new Miata kit, IC's, etc with a release date of "this summer"...

This is mildly exciting to someone like me who wants a Rotrex, but, you know, whatever.
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Old 04-08-2012, 01:53 PM   #46
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Tomi: Thanks!

Mobius: I appreciate the notes on the PS stuff. I've secured a 03 rack for depowerification but its not going to happen any time soon. As soon as I get home, I'll post more about the cluster project I've got a ScanGauge II as well but its not exactly easily readable @ 90-100mph.

GDSpeed: Sorry to be a jackhole but with Kraftwerks, I'll believe it when I see it. KW promised simple and AFFORDABLE upgrades for the package, it would be nice to see them deliver. You know, that and my CARB cert When I hear "this summer" I think of the CalGuns "two weeks" or the HalfLife3 "soon"

I'll have to see if I can find the posts on M.net, it would be interesting to see if they plan on rebuilding the whole thing from scratch or just restarting development on the current kits.
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Old 04-08-2012, 08:36 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
I'll have to see if I can find the posts on M.net, it would be interesting to see if they plan on rebuilding the whole thing from scratch or just restarting development on the current kits.
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=454121

There's more chatter elsewhere in the SC section but thats the main thread. KW put a new video on their website/blog/facespace with the statment "redesigned miata kits available soon" so we'll just have to see
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Old 04-09-2012, 02:54 PM   #48
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Gauge Project:

I've done a lot of reading on this and trying to pay attention to what other people are doing. This was pretty much the genesis of what I wanted to do:

Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
You want VEI guages. If I could spend the money again, I'd have VEI for everything with dual-display gauges.

With your two options, I'd say you do not want mechanical gauges at all. The last thing I want is fluids channeled into the cockpit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Second this. Very happy with my combo AFR/MAP(boost/vacuum) gauge from VEI.

Unless all you're going for is "looks," you should spend some time thinking about the parameters you want to monitor, how you want to monitor them, and visibility. Some established rules:

1. If what you care about is a value (like AFR), then it has been shown that humans acquire a digital value more quickly than any other type of presentation. This was actually shown during Army studies towards the end of WWII, and the finding surprised researchers. A clear single needle on a fixed, marked background came in second, but there can be resolution issues with that kind of presentation.
2. If what you care about is the dynamics of a value and how those dynamics compare to limitations (like engine RPM), then the analog pointer with a large sweep angle is the way to go.
3. Having a lot of gauges scattered around is never optimal, both from a clutter and visibility standpoint. That's the strength of the VEI dual gauges, you can condense what you need to look at and can place them in good locations. However, the VEI dual gauges are all-digital. So, evaluate what it is that you want to see on them. I would not use them for a tach, but for AFR and MAP . . . they're perfect.

I'll call that $0.03.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
If I could do this all over I'd...

Do VEI dual display water and oil temp on the right where my Omori gauge lives
VEI Dual Boost and AFR gauge on the left where the fuel lives
leave the oil pressure
Then take the fuel gauge, glue/foam it into a cheap gauge housing and stuff it by the radio.

For the record, I'm still not sure if I'm going to keep the G2X display there, we'll see what I think of the blinky-lights. I like the GPS speed and RPM for cruise though, I haven't used it on the track yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatGuy85 View Post
I'm not sure why a cop would give you a speeding ticket for having gauges, unless he got you on radar. Gauges aren't against the law..
Quote:
Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
But gauges are usually an indication that something is modified. I had this happen last weekend. Thankfully the blower was out of the car and everything is back to stock at the moment, but the Sparco seat, roll bar and dual gauge A pillar pod definitely got the cop hard.

Skidude: You have an 02 NB? This might interest you... The 04 and 05 cars came with a low fuel level warning light built into the cluster. All NB's are wired for this, all you need is a 04-05 cluster. Pull the fuel gauge out of that cluster and stick it in a single gauge housing and stick that below the radio/in the glove box, and then mount your wideband in the hole. Coincidentally, this is now my plan using a VEI Systems gauge, except I plan putting the wideband where the fake oil pressure gauge is, and then put a VEI oil press/temp gauge where the stock fuel gauge lives. (Credit for most of this idea goes to Hustler btw...)
As you can see, I can't take full credit for this project. It was inspired by a lot of reading and connecting the dots. I'm currently running an AEM UEGO and matching boost gauge in an A pillar panel. While visibility is decent, it also screams RICE! and MODIFIED! to me. I have the same set of demands... easily view-able non cluttered gauges, no live fluids in the cabin, etc etc.

So what I've got...

D1-BOP-WBA-MO
dual display, boost in psi & wideband in AFR, orange display (LC1 to support)

D1-IAF-WTF-MO
dual display, IAT in F & water temp in F, orange display

D1-OPP-OTF-MO
dual display, Oil pressure in psi & oil temp in F, orange display

...plus a bitchload of sensors.

I did everything in orange because I dislike red and blue is WAY to jarring in the cabin of the car. The orange has just the right amount of "softness" in the color, plus it will match the speedo and tach in the 04 cluster, and I've already changed everything else in the cabin over to orange. It may end up being a little more yellow than I was expecting, but it should be fine. Again, because these are in the cluster under the gauge hood, I have no doubt that readability should be spectacular. I'll see if I can power these bishes up tonight and get some pics.

VEI gauges usully have a momentary push button on the face of the gauge that allows you to set parameters. As I'm mounting them behind the factory bezel, the default button placement will be inaccessible. VEI offers what they call the "motorcycle mod" where the gauge is built without a button in the face, and the leads are extended out the back of the gauge for a remote SPST momentary button. I don't plan on accessing these often so I'll probably stash them somewhere out of the way. I'm also reading there is recall and hi/lo alarm settings on these things... I didn't see documentation for that on VEIs site or in the instructions. This would be an unexpected benefit fo sho.

VEI also makes a tiny 41mm (1 5/8") gauge housing. If I decide to go insane and spend more money, I might have them custom build me a temp gauge in this size and use it for the Rotrex oil system.

Jeebus, this could almost be its own thread
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Old 04-10-2012, 11:24 PM   #49
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In for pics of powered-up bishes.
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Old 04-25-2012, 06:43 PM   #50
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And here they are:


I tied the power and grounds to the cig lighter circuit just as a test


Good visibility


Temp location, derp


Big *** numbers!

I've got concerns that the bezels on these things may be significantly larger than the 52mm mounting hole, but I've not measured them yet as I can't find my stupid calipers.

With the 3 cameras I own, I CANNOT get a good picture of the color. Its not that yellow. Its like if the stock gauges were brighter, the color is a pretty damn good match. The numbers are huge and highly visible in the cluster opening. The little icons for the gauges are not as easy to read in direct light, but my brain will adapt in time.

I'm thinking I'll get all the sensors and wiring in place and mount this up in the center console to work out the bugs, then move it to the cluster later.
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Old 04-25-2012, 07:37 PM   #51
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Quote:
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ಠ_ಠ


I learned how to take off bra with one hand eyes closed in the dark back in high school.

16 years later it still amazingly impresses the girls.
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Old 04-25-2012, 08:32 PM   #52
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Funny, I just added the fail tag to this today too
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Old 05-29-2012, 03:12 AM   #53
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MuahahahahahahahHAHAHAH!

I HAZ MS2... and it is GLORIOUS!

On the downside, I now know hate...
  • hate for the band-aids fuel solutions
  • hate for the factory advance table
  • hate for the restrictor that lives in my Rotrex that is stopping me from making more power,
  • hate for my NB1 injectors running 90% DC @ 6psi MAP
  • hate for my AEM WBo2 and its goofy number offset
  • hate for my lack of intercooler
  • hate for my factory exhaust

I can see that I've got soooo much more to learn, but I no longer fear the Megasquirt. I guess it helps that it fired up the first time, and that I had Gesso there to kick me in the *** and get me moving. Mad props to him for swinging by and hanging out on this one. We spent a couple of hours driving around running VEAL and figuring out some of the new stuff (he had a MS1 based MSPNP in his 95) and generally seeing what things would do.

I've got a bunch of issues I need to figure out...
  • why my AC compressor does not cycle on/off w/AC on
  • why it runs so damn lean at startup, but only for 2 minutes or so, then hits targets like a boss
  • why my ------- spark plug boots keep pushing off the coil towers (no COPs atm)
  • why my idle is 1500RPM (because racecar?)
  • AC + headlights + HVAC fan + stereo = 600RPM idle? (This is down from 1500...)
  • better location for IAT (KW default location is stoopid)

Gesso also prodded me about my spare steering rack so that may be getting some depowerafication soon. I also finished gathering the correct parts for my Hornetball-style intake. If I can get the holes drilled and the mounting fabbed up, that should go pretty quickly. I need more tools... specifically a drill press and a big vice

I have seen the top of the mountain, and it is good. This is going to be wicked fun to play with
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Old 05-31-2012, 12:25 AM   #54
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Consider wrapping your crossover pipe in than thermal barrier reflective tape stuff. That aluminum pipe sitting directly behind the radiator is a huge heat sink, in the wrong direction. With it in place, stock as yours is now, I would regularly see 175 iat when idling about in traffic and whatnot. 135 was common at cruise in mild temps. Now that I'm intercooled that's all in the past. Since you has MS2 now there's nothing keeping you from intercooling. Do eet ! Yesterday on track my IAT's were roughly ambient + 20.
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Old 05-31-2012, 02:25 AM   #55
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Absolutely need to get my intercooler on! I've got a pile of Reflectix leftovers sitting in my garage from my carboy jacket project that should work for the crossover tube, I'll probably do that in the morning. I know Emilio was using something like that on Crusher IIRC, but I don't remember if he specified what exactly he used.

I'm using the Kraftwerks pre-Rotrex IAT location for my GM IAT sensor, for now. I know its FAR from ideal but my boost is low and timing is super conservative so I can live with it, for now. Anything I can do to keep my IATs down will be a bonus.

Speaking of timing, I somehow screwed it up by 3 so when the MS2 thought it was at 10, it was actually at 13 I'm not sure how I screwed that up, but its good to know I've got at least another safe 3 in my entire ignition table

The idle is seriously pissing me off. I CAN NOT get it to drop below 1600RPM. I can go into "Idle Valve Test" and manually set the valve to a minimum and get a constant 760-ish idle, so something is telling the IAC to operate, I just can't quite figure out what it is. My "Closed Loop Idle Target RPM" curve looks perfectly fine and my coolant temp sensor is good, so IDKWTF at this point. I've been following these 2 guides:

How Do I Tune My Idle With A Standalone? - MX5nutz
Tuning Idle Valve - Ms2 - MX5nutz

They both look pretty legit, its just not working.

Searching here on MT has led to threads with people having similar issues, but all of them have been related to vacuum leaks. I cut my teeth in the world of carburetors so take my word when I say I know how to identify them, and I know I don't have any. The IAC valve test pretty much proves that anyway.

Also, some more sexy showed up in the mail the other day:

I've got a spare injector harness to splice the clips into, so no bulky ugly adapters for me! Hopefully those black injector clips don't cause interference with the fuel rail/intake manifold. They were supplied by FIC for my application, so they should fit... guess Ill find out.

So much sexy and so little time.


Edit: Gesso and I (mostly him, I tweaked my back so bending was somewhat uncomfortable...) installed the muffler from the older 2.5" Flyin' Miata turbo exhaust I picked up form Cordus a couple months ago. I was surprised that it bolted up to the factory midpipe without leaking. Its not super-duper loud but it does have some bass to it! Me likey! I can't wait to find a long tube header and install it with the FM 2.5" midpipe and see what happens.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:32 AM   #56
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is Closed loop idle actually activating to drive the idle down?

Add in an indicator for CL idle to tell you.

Also add in an Idle DC guage, what's the idle DC?

(I wrote those guides above )
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:37 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richyvrlimited View Post
is Closed loop idle actually activating to drive the idle down?
I don't actually know, still learnin' the interface

Quote:
Originally Posted by richyvrlimited View Post
Add in an indicator for CL idle to tell you.

Also add in an Idle DC guage, what's the idle DC?
Will do, I'll play with this some more tonight. I'd have tried this today but the forum was down and I woke up late.

Herp-Derp-Edit: The default dash has a "CL Idle" indicator, it turns green at idle

Quote:
Originally Posted by richyvrlimited View Post
(I wrote those guides above )
And thank you for providing them! I searched and searched through MT but this site is so big and the search function is so sketchy that I couldn't find a guide recent enough, or DIYPNP specific. The google machine has some good results.

I honestly didn't think I was going to get a response in this thread, thanks for stopping by

As long as I have the attention of someone more knowledgeable, I've been reading here:
https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquirt-18/ms2-first-start-62918/
and here:
http://www.miataforumz.com/showthread.php?t=374
And both threads recommend turning EGO off before running VEAL. To be 100% honest, I can't figure out how to do that. My ARFs are "close enough" at the moment that the car is driveable, but I'd like to do this "right"

On a related note, today when I started the car, it actually followed the "Closed Loop Idle Target RPM" curve! I tweaked the "Warmup Enrichment Curve" a little bit so it shuts off at 160 rather than 178 or whatever it was. (I think my thermostat is a bit off... my temps were moving around a bit and the WUE kept kicking on while at idle. Its a non-issue now.) What I'm saying is... I no longer have a 1600rpm idle, so something must be working. What I DO have now is an oscillation between about 780 and 900rpm at idle. This matches a nearly full point AFR change on the gauge and in TS. I'm not sure if this is a fuel table or ignition table issue (jumping between cells?) or possibly my completely untuned PID system. I copied your settings from the screenshot (2,2,2,100) and figured I'd start there. I'll keep working on it and continue to read.

I'll be honest and say that I didn't make my way completely though the "How Do I Tune My Idle With A Standalone?" guide last night. When my idle refused to cooperate I decided it was time to walk away before I got really frustrated.

Again, thanks for the reply, I look forward to working on this and getting it squared away!

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Old 06-02-2012, 11:04 PM   #58
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Crap I'm retarded... found the EGO settings

It looks like all the enrichments are functioning like they should (ASE, WUE, etc) and CL Idle appears to be working as intended.

I screwed with the idle a bit more and manually flattened out my VE table in the idle cells. I'm getting a 30rpm fluctuation but honestly, its almost rock solid @ 850rpm. If I load this thing with AC, it draaaaaags the idle down, but it does not quite die. When I turn the AC off, it REALLY jumps, then it dies. I'll have to play with it moar.

Time to go play with the VEAL some more
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Old 06-03-2012, 07:03 PM   #59
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Did some more fiddling today. Idles mas bueno, AC still drags it way down, but it does not die anymore. With the AS on it will eventually creep back up to my 850-900RPM idle target, but the engine sounds like ***. AFRs will fluctuate but only with the AC on. With PS @ lock and headlights on, everything is ****. Give it AC and it goes to hell. I need to go visit Hustlers "35mpg" thread and see if I can find some nuggets of information in there, I seem to recall he had some similar issues.

It would be nice if this thing kicked up to about 1200-1300rpm like the factory ECU when the AC comes on. I believe this DIYPNP was built with AC in mind, so I'll have to do some more searching to find out how exactly that is implemented.

Reading the "MAT correction" thread and that might explain what is making my ARFs do goofy crap while playing with VEAL. It keeps adding, then removing, then adding, then removing... I need to see if I can create a MAT Correction gauge in TS to watch, or maybe find out if VEAL ignores MAT Correction... or I'll just cancel it out with GAIR like my hero Brainy. I'm probably having this issue because my IAT is PRE-Rotrex (I'm working on it...) and I'm still recirculating. Any time the bypass opens it dumps a bunch of that pre-heated air from the heatsink of a crossover tube into the intake tract right before the compressor near the IAT, and it continues to recycle through the blower. I have no doubt this slows airflow to a crawl near the filter and the sensor REALLY heats up, then the correction goes crazy and pulls fuel, then it gets lean, then it adds fuel... probably?

AFRs are close enough to not explodificate anything currently, I need to focus on getting the IAT moved somewhere more logical and/or getting my intercooler installed.
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Old 06-07-2012, 06:20 PM   #60
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ARF Targets:

Advance:


Still can't get my stupid idle stable but it drives just fine with these numbers. Sticking this here so I can't loose it, and maybe get some criticism. I'm thinking about robbing that useless 225 row and adding more resolution somewhere else. Not sure if this will be beneficial or not, seeing as I'm not screwing with the spark map at all, other than at idle.

And before someone points is out, yes I need to fix that 19/1500 cell :lol:
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EO2K contemplates the universe, his rotrex, and why they both fail-afr_6_7.jpg   EO2K contemplates the universe, his rotrex, and why they both fail-spark_6_7.jpg  

Last edited by EO2K; 06-07-2012 at 06:35 PM.
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