The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread
12-26-2016, 09:41 PM
#1043
Hi Everyone,
Rear:
MSM Rear Shocks
TSM top hats - TSM Shock Mounts
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 350lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-72-07-350
Rear:
MSM Rear Shocks
TSM top hats - TSM Shock Mounts
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 350lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-72-07-350
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12-26-2016, 11:10 PM
#1044
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: San Diego
Posts: 557
Total Cats: 54
Hi Everyone,
Just picked up an NA and a full set of used MSM shocks (came with hats, springs, etc) for cheap. I just finished reading through this awesome 52 page thread, but just want to run the parts through y'all before ordering.
Basically going to be using mgeoffriau's setup (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1098453665)
Front:
MSM Front Shocks
NB Top Hats
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 550lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-72-07-550
Rear:
MSM Rear Shocks
TSM top hats - TSM Shock Mounts
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 350lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-72-07-350
Thanks in advance for the input!!
Just picked up an NA and a full set of used MSM shocks (came with hats, springs, etc) for cheap. I just finished reading through this awesome 52 page thread, but just want to run the parts through y'all before ordering.
Basically going to be using mgeoffriau's setup (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1098453665)
Front:
MSM Front Shocks
NB Top Hats
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 550lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-72-07-550
Rear:
MSM Rear Shocks
TSM top hats - TSM Shock Mounts
Advanced sleeve/perches - https://www.advanced-autosports.com/...sleeve-and-nut
Integra shock bumpers cut to 36mm - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...9-50/overview/
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Energy Suspension Coil Spring Isolators 9-6103R - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ens-9-6103r
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->RideTech 70010828 delrin thrust washers - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/art-70010828
<!--td {border: 1px solid #ccc;}br {mso-data-placement:same-cell;}-->Summit Racing 350lbs 7" L 2.5" ID - https://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-72-07-350
Thanks in advance for the input!!
One thing you haven't stated is the intended use - street, track, auto-x, your local road conditions and of course ride-height you are aiming for.
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12-27-2016, 12:50 AM
#1045
Newb
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Total Cats: 0
Thanks for the quick replies everyone! And thanks Zeller for the isolator catch!
Noted on the rubber bushings, will add those to my orders.
I intend to use the car for auto-x and less frequent track days (4-6yr) without having to trailer it to the event. I live in the CA Bay Area where road conditions are pretty decent except for the occasional potholes and bad drivers... Although this is my dedicated fun car I can't bring myself to buying Xidas/Ohlins yet, since I'd like to spend that money now on good wheels/tires/brakes + auto-x/track time. With that said, would you change the setup I'm about to purchase?
I intend to use the car for auto-x and less frequent track days (4-6yr) without having to trailer it to the event. I live in the CA Bay Area where road conditions are pretty decent except for the occasional potholes and bad drivers... Although this is my dedicated fun car I can't bring myself to buying Xidas/Ohlins yet, since I'd like to spend that money now on good wheels/tires/brakes + auto-x/track time. With that said, would you change the setup I'm about to purchase?
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12-28-2016, 11:27 PM
#1047
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Lambertville, NJ
Posts: 1,215
Total Cats: 74
I just got my third set of NB Hard-S Billies. This one is for playing with. I would like to take them apart and play with the shims. BUT: I have no clue what I'm doing. Can anybody point me to any type of literature or write-up where I can find which shim is doing what? I mean essentially Bilstein should have a list saying: This shimstack will make these compression/rebound curves. Or am I totally off on that?
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12-29-2016, 10:18 AM
#1048
I just got my third set of NB Hard-S Billies. This one is for playing with. I would like to take them apart and play with the shims. BUT: I have no clue what I'm doing. Can anybody point me to any type of literature or write-up where I can find which shim is doing what? I mean essentially Bilstein should have a list saying: This shimstack will make these compression/rebound curves. Or am I totally off on that?
The only way to do this right is to get or make a shock dyno, get a pile of shims and start experimenting...... This is why companies that do revalves charge crazy money for what amounts to a few bucks in parts. Black magic and all......
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12-29-2016, 06:54 PM
#1049
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Lambertville, NJ
Posts: 1,215
Total Cats: 74
What you ask for simply doesn't exist, at least not for a Miata. There are some shim stack kits sold for circle track shocks but they are no where near right for us.
The only way to do this right is to get or make a shock dyno, get a pile of shims and start experimenting...... This is why companies that do revalves charge crazy money for what amounts to a few bucks in parts. Black magic and all......
The only way to do this right is to get or make a shock dyno, get a pile of shims and start experimenting...... This is why companies that do revalves charge crazy money for what amounts to a few bucks in parts. Black magic and all......
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12-29-2016, 08:34 PM
#1050
Newb
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Total Cats: 0
Has anyone had success on removing the shock eyelet bushing from an MSM shock? My bushing came out but the sleeve is still stuck, and the local dealership wants $140+ to remove it. I tried rigging something together but was unsuccessful. Going to try calling some auto/machine shops tomorrow.
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12-29-2016, 10:40 PM
#1053
Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 48
Total Cats: 2
I intend to use the car for auto-x and less frequent track days (4-6yr) without having to trailer it to the event. I live in the CA Bay Area where road conditions are pretty decent except for the occasional potholes and bad drivers... Although this is my dedicated fun car I can't bring myself to buying Xidas/Ohlins yet, since I'd like to spend that money now on good wheels/tires/brakes + auto-x/track time. With that said, would you change the setup I'm about to purchase?
However, since the Bilsteins have terrible rebound, I have no doubt that Xidas at this stiffness would be no problem. Even with 400/300, I feel like I'm going down on a rollercoaster far too often. If I could do it again, I'd man up and get the Xidas and not have spent the whatever $700 or so I spent on this setup.
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12-30-2016, 01:58 AM
#1054
Newb
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 8
Total Cats: 0
Thanks for the feedback on the spring rates Pizzle! I'm in Santa Clara but rarely ever use 880 and luckily have a daily driver. So the only time the NA will spend on the streets is driving to and from events. I'll definitely keep in mind the 400/300 combo if the ride is too stiff.
I bought the NA with the intention of keeping it a budget autox/track car, so purchasing Xidas just didn't seem like the right move. Hopefully, that doesn't bite me in the ***...
I bought the NA with the intention of keeping it a budget autox/track car, so purchasing Xidas just didn't seem like the right move. Hopefully, that doesn't bite me in the ***...
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12-30-2016, 08:07 AM
#1055
However, since the Bilsteins have terrible rebound, I have no doubt that Xidas at this stiffness would be no problem. Even with 400/300, I feel like I'm going down on a rollercoaster far too often. If I could do it again, I'd man up and get the Xidas and not have spent the whatever $700 or so I spent on this setup.
What makes the xidas magic is the much stiffer spring rates ( way more than you're running) that are matched to the shock curves and more importantly matched to the bump stops.
If I had to guess your bad ride was because you were bouncing off the bump stops not the shock valving.
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12-30-2016, 02:21 PM
#1057
Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 48
Total Cats: 2
I've got Hard-S. I guess I'll try the zip-tie test to be sure. So then the dumb question: I should trim down my bumpstops?
It really only looks like it's in range of the Xidas on the softest two settings (roughly)....
It really only looks like it's in range of the Xidas on the softest two settings (roughly)....
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12-30-2016, 02:38 PM
#1058
That's only a dumb question because you didn't read the multi page discussion in this very thread about not only how trimming your bump stop is very critical but how to actually do it correctly.
Hint: doing it by the zip tie test won't work because no matter what spring you run you'll touch the bump stop from time to time, and at your spring rate you'll touch them before you get out of the driveway.
Hint: doing it by the zip tie test won't work because no matter what spring you run you'll touch the bump stop from time to time, and at your spring rate you'll touch them before you get out of the driveway.
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12-30-2016, 03:05 PM
#1060
Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 48
Total Cats: 2
Okay, well I'll make the question slightly less dumb. At ~36mm bumpstop length, and pretty much the same as everyone else is running, but I'm hitting the stops, and others aren't? So I gotta do the measurements, fine, but does this also mean that my dampers are more worn out than the rest of you guys'? The reality is that I can't imagine this part is so sensitive to a few millimeters when the overall travel is well over a magnitude more.
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