marudy

Hey guys,

this is my being very disappointed and sad right now - while I should be very happy / excited about the work I did on my car.

I had my car on stands for few weeks doing some work and taking my time with it; we are in full lockdown after all so what better than spending my free time creatively in my car? Long story short is that I just took my NB for a ride after finishing up and it sounds pretty bad towards the back of the car and from the area that is responsible moving the rear wheels. Let me explain.

The work I did on my car:
- Raised the height of my car by adjusting all 4 coilovers
- Spread generous generous amounts of cheap silicone oil to all 14 bushes of all the 4 rear wishbones in an effort to stop squeaks. Can't explain why but I'm positive this is the cause of my problems
- Replaced my front disc breaks and pads with new ones after disassembling the mount brackets, take quite some time to clean the bracket, the caliper, the dust shield and more. This was the main task

Finished up a couple of hours ago and took my car to a ride to bed in my new brakes. At some point I realized there is a noise coming from the car - sounds from the rear part in a pattern that makes noise like a failing tyre without much air on a wild road surface. The more I could hear it the more I could tell it potentially sound like my drive axle which passes movement towards the rear differential but that's only a guess. Then I also noticed I could hear more sounds when I was pressing the clutch pedal, especially when doing it fast; and at some point it felt like clutch engagement slipped when I just reversed fast. The clutch kit is a new Exedy and changed by a shop 5 months ago or so along with transmition seals; it was working perfectly until before i start working on the car, so I doubt the problem lies there. I kind of feel the shitty silicone oil has gotten to places it should not when I tried to grease the inner bushes. Does it make sense? Also I'm hoping i didn't damage anything else... Any ideas that explain what i'm feeling? thanks

My plan is to raise the back of the car and clean everything underneath; if that fails I think I'll take it to my local mechanic.

marudy

Also the other thing that comes to mind is that noise started after I started bedding in my breaks, which means i had already decelerated from 30KM to 0 with light to medium pressure on the brakes for 5 times already. Could I have really broken something else besides my brakes like that?

DNMakinson

iTrader: (3)

While it is true that silicone oil migrates like crazy, it is usually problematic when it gets onto arcing contacts: because it takes only a tiny bit to turn to sand (a great insulator). I don't know that I have heard of enough migration to cause friction (lack of) problems, however.

Interested in what you find.

marudy

Thanks for the reply. Yeah will get back to you with the complete story. Will jack it up now and do some cleaning and then take it for another spin. And tomorrow morning will probably have to visit my mechanic. Let's see.

I guess if it is the silicone somehow, the effect might have been amplified by the fact that the car was in stands for about 4 weeks? and this was pretty much one of the first things i did.

marudy

Hey turns out all good.

While I was jacking up the car on the left rear side where I could feel it was sounding like a tire going bad, i realized that 3/4 lug nuts were pretty loose. Looks like tiredness and recklessness took over yesterday and never torqued this wheel.

I'm grateful the situation didn't become worse because of that; it also turns out this was my only problem. Brake hiccups from my front wheels are gone now that I replaced my worked out rotors and previous pads. Also it's the first time the car feels so solid after I purchased it 6 months ago. The new coilovers I added along with the new front brakes make a hell of a difference. Quite happy with the so far result and where this restoration project is taking me.

Cheers for reading my post and for all the advice I get by reading this forum.

MORE POWA BABY (at some point)

DNMakinson

iTrader: (3)

Certainly good you found that.

rwyatt365

Been there, done that. Tiredness makes for stupid mistakes. Glad to hear that was your only problem.

geewiz

Yes! All too easy to do. While I'd like to say it was always my co-drivers (heh) I have had both wheel attachment and brake failures during autocross runs due to working quickly on-site, and had to be towed home once (from an active air force base where the event was held, hoo-boy that was fun getting the tow arranged and cleared with base security) because a screw from the air intake I had installed wasn't tight and was sucked in, breaking a valve.

For work at home, I find the times I get myself in trouble are on longer jobs where I can lose track of things, e.g. the car is up and down multiple times, or I work on multiple jobs at once. Like, I will have dropped the car and torqued all the wheels, then had it up again and adjusted the tie rods, then down again, and I forgot that I also pulled one of the rear wheels to check something so I only retorque the front... or whatever. My suggestions:

1) Always, before you put the wheels back on and drop the car, take a pass through *every* bolt. Make sure they are a) in place (haha) and b) "safe" tight not finger tight. Preferably re-torque but *at least* check for having straight-up forgotten something entirely. Every time. Even if you think you are not going to drive the car, remember that it weighs a ton and a missing or finger-tight bolt can lead to damage just as it settles that weight to the tires.

2) Always, before you hop in the river's seat to test drive (or move) the car, take *another* pass through. I know, you just did it a few minutes ago before putting the wheels on, right? Except... was that the *last* time you dropped it? Or maybe you raised a corner again just to adjust something....? Mentally run through every bolt you may have touched and check (or mentally rehearse if they are now inaccessible with the car on the ground - you did that other check before you dropped it, right?) when they were properly tightened.

3) Always, before pulling out on that test drive (so right after #2 above), always always always put a torque wrench on all the lug nuts.

4) Always, after a bit of driving but before truly driving in anger, recheck suspension points might have been touched or affected (alignment bolts, tie rods, a-arm attachment points, sway bar end links & brackets, etc to see if it anything has moved. Like, after that test drive that felt great, or when you arrive at the track after having made adjustments.

5) Always, after the first truly hard driving (track session, autocross) that follows work, recheck the suspension points as in #4 -- there's tight, and then there's "tight enough that it actually held up under maximum stress." I once aligned my Z06, things seemed good in testing and OK at the autocross, then on the way home I noticed the steering wheel wasn't quite straight... uh.... turns out that at 1.4G the tie rod nut had come loose and it was starting to unwind. Could have been a catastrophic total loss of steering while driving home. Yikes.

And have fun! I've been wrenching for 20 years now; have definitely made my share of dumb mistakes; still do. I catch more of them now before they damage the car or me, though .

marudy

Thanks for commenting in guys and sympathizing.

@DNMakinson @rwyatt365 glad it was my only problem as well. Was really sad yesterday but it was obvious something was very off. Super happy with the result now

@geewiz thanks for the tips man. Thanks for taking the time to write down, I appreciate it. I don't mind much making some stupid mistakes along the way while learning; especially on areas of the car I haven't worked before and not super expensive ones. It's part of the process I guess and this why i'm doing these stuff mostly on this car instead on my 5 year old diesel daily. But yeah if a dumb mistake like that leads to a huge fuckup that won't be something I will enjoy for sure. The thing is I had all wheels off before so I needed to torque every single one of them. I decided to torque on cross-wheel pattern and I imagine somewhere there it happened. Maybe I torqued left front twice instead of left rear? Having tied everything finger fat first is what saved me I believe. Potentially that could also explain why the wheel did not make this noise for the first 5 minutes.

Yeah I'm having fun with this car, wrenching and doing the whole restoration/maintenance. I would never believe I would actually enjoy this type of work before; me doing physical work with hardware and tools and covered in grease haha. But over the past couple of years my car interests spiked up and I was able to support this whole project car financially now. And next thing I know i'm buying tools, cleaning products - for everything in and out of the car - and parts quite fast lol.

I can imagine the fun when you had to arrange a tow from the military base :P I'm gonna keep tip #3 pretty high. It's what I did today when I realized the fuckup as well; rechecked every wheel bolt

cheers

technicalninja

Ha, here's someone else who is as anally retentive as me...
All the above should be considered as "gospel" when it comes to suspension/brakes.
The ONLY thing that is really important is the rubber stays on the ground, the rubber is good, and the brakes work properly.
If the vehicle will start and move under its own power it merely means you don't have to push it around in your shop...

I've been wrenching for 40+ years now and Geewiz's statements ring true to me as well.
One single suspension/brake mistake can kill you, your customer, or the others that were involved in the accident.

Decades ago I left some caliper bridge bolts finger tight on a customer's Honda Accord.
Two days later he returned complaining of a loud click when he applied the brakes.
I found it and fixed it, no harm, no foul...
From this point on I put red locktite and use a torque wrench on all brake/suspension bolts.

Occasionally (30 years later now) I still have the nightmare.
Caliper bridge bolts actually come out, locks up the front left wheel at 70 mph, car crosses median and hits a church bus head on filled with children.
14 dead...
I detest brake work for this reason.
It has to be PERFECT...

DNMakinson

iTrader: (3)

At my local bike shop, if they mount cranks, but are not ready to torque them, they mount them at something other than 180 degrees. Not sure how that could be applied to brake work.

Possibly a checklist like before you take off in an airplane would be appropriate.

DNM

rwyatt365

Maybe someone will start a "Dumb mistakes I've done" thread.

A few years ago I finished a full coolant flush then refill with Motorcraft "unicorn tears" fluid. I pulled onto the main road to enjoy the perfection of my new coolant, when I started to smell that semi-sweet, "you're leaking coolant" smell, soon followed by a geyser of hot coolant all over my windshield. When I opened the hood, I saw that the (totally non-standard, impossible to find anywhere for my eBay aluminum radiator) radiator cap was missing. Evidently, I had forgot to tighten it after the refill and it departed the premises when pressure built up.

I had two options; call for a tow truck and admit defeat, or re-trace the path - on foot - that I had driven and hope that I would find that radiator cap. Twenty minutes later, I found that cap on the side of the road - THANK GOD - and I have never repeated that mistake every again.

codrus

If you have accidentally driven the car on loose lugnuts it will have put a lot of stress on those studs. You should consider replacing them now, before they fail.

--Ian

dan91

I have learned never to tighten bolts finger tight. Either it sticks out, threads showing, blatantly not tightened, or its torqued to final spec. I still forget to tighten bolts sometimes though

marudy

@rwyatt365 Ha yeah the "Dumb mistakes I've done" would get traction i guess; everyone posting mistakes here and there. But hey you found your radiator cap! I think if you **** up big time then yeah you don't repeat it. But if you dodge the bullet - like i seem to have done for now - then you might get carried away and repeat it. Or at least that's me; I do Iearn from mistakes but either it's a big time mistake otherwise need to repeat it a few times...

@codrus thanks for the suggestion man, appreciate it. They look pretty good actually by eye but yeah i'm considering to change them for sure. Can I get a suggestion here? can't find it easily over the parts stores i'm usually buying.

@dan91 yeah i might forget either way, so i would better have them finger tight I guess..

codrus

I like the extended, round-nosed ARP wheel studs. They aren't cheap and you need open lug nuts instead of acorn-style, but you get lots of thread engagement and it's much easier to mount/dismount wheels.

--Ian

marudy

Hey thanks for the suggestion!

These extended ARP ones seems to be very popular. I think I'm not a huge fun of the open lug nuts and probably also wouldn't want to go all the way and change all 4 wheel studs. But that thing abiyt easier mounting/dismounting talked into my heart or should i say my back haha. Thanks for your feedback.