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Old 01-11-2013, 03:18 PM   #21
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Does it come with tophats and mounting hardware/bushings? You could add those if you wanted, or reuse the NA style if not.

A bigger swaybar from Racing Beat or Flyin' Miata might be good too, if you are looking for something else to spend money on. But do the MSM parts first and see what that does for you before changing anything else.
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:22 PM   #22
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The post says nothing about tophats or mounting hardware/bushings. He messaged me back and said they are still available.

So, if I get the shocks/springs/and bumpstops it all should just swap over?
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:25 PM   #23
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yes
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:42 PM   #24
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Perfect. Thanks for all the help.

Now, you guys mentioned even getting some eBay springs to lower the car a little. Any suggestions?

And some guys have different suggestions for spring rate for dual duty cars. Something like 7kg/6kg?
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:05 PM   #25
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Just cut the springs on the MSM to get the ride height you want. I swapped MSM suspension to my NA and even with the NB tophats it still was about 1" - 2" taller than stock so I cut a coil or two.
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Old 01-12-2013, 11:50 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
YES!!! It is always the shock.

NOOOO!!! The Konis are not a good shock. Too much rebound dampening which will keep the springs from pushing the shock back out (meaning you will stay on the rubber bumpstops too much) and too much high-speed dampening (which will give you a tooth chattering, annoying ride). MSM Bilsteins or "Hard S" valved Bilsteins will be wonderful, even if you can only afford to keep your stock springs for now. Much more control, much more contact with the ground, and much less floatiness on the roadway. You can get the Hard S '99-00 shocks new for around $125 each. Springs can be purchased from Summit Racing in any stiffness you desire for $35 apiece. Coilover adjusters can be bought on Ebay for $60 for all four (with useable springs in most cases). My "Hard S" shocks were used and purchased for ~$250 and made the single greatest difference of any modification to my car in terms of enjoyment, even when I had stock springs.

Understandable skepticism. Fear not.
Consider also buying a sway bar with the money you save. They do some nice things for the handling stability at speed.
Are these the coilover adjusters you speak of? How do I know what the spring rate is? 1990 1997 Mazda Miata MX 5 MX5 Scale coilover Springs lowering Silver 91 92 93 | eBay

I have a guy that's going to sell me his MSM shocks/springs/bumpstops but everywhere I read it says it will raise my car. So, if I can get these coilover adjusters I can lower the car to desired height....

**Update-- and just found NB tophats here to go with the installation http://treasurecoastmiata.com/i-1169...p-stops.html**

Last edited by Dustin; 01-12-2013 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 01-13-2013, 12:19 PM   #27
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Yes, those ebay coilover adjusters are fine. And they come with some springs. You will be able to do some measurements and determine the actual spring rates when they arrive. You might end up keeping all four springs that come with the kit, or end up replacing one or the other pair with other rates. Or just keep the MSM springs on it.

The MSM hardware will not raise your car if you use the MSM (or any NB) tophats. That is why I asked if you were getting that hardware. It would only make about 1/2 to 3/4 inch difference if you had to reuse the NA ones though. You could take a 1/4 length of spring coil off to make that up if necessary. There is more than one way to get you where you are trying to go.

The ebay springs are likely to be a little higher spring rates than the MSM ones, but if you end up with both sets you can try them all and determine what you like.
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Old 01-15-2013, 05:33 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustin View Post

**Update-- and just found NB tophats here to go with the installation '99-'05 Top Hats (4) with Bushings/Bump Stops
I know it says 99-05 but hat's an NA top from the pic, so OP you might wanna confirm with TCM.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:36 PM   #29
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@qax

Thanks for noticing that!! I would have never known. I haven't ordered yet b/c they want $16 to ship which seems little extreme. Trying to buy a set off a member now...
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:00 PM   #30
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Sooo, picked up the MSM suspension last week. Met up with a member of miata.net. Super friendly guy.

But, I got my eBay springs in that I was going to use to have adjustable ride height, and they dont fit. These are the ones I ordered, and posted this earlier asking if they would work Mazda Miata 90 97 coilover Adjustabl lowering Spring Kit Red with Scale | eBay.

I guess I should have ordered springs for NB since that's the suspension im using? Like these Fit 99 05 Mazda Miata MX5 Red Coil Overs Coilovers Springs | eBay

So, should I return the NA springs, and buy the NB ones?

Thanks for all the help guys. This should be all cleared up soon and Ill post pics of the build and before and after.
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:08 PM   #31
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what doesnt fit specifically?
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:18 PM   #32
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Quote:
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what doesnt fit specifically?
Well, I mainly picked up the eBay springs for the adjustable sleeves to use with the MSM springs, but they're too small for the shocks. Shocks just swallow the sleeves and dont rest on them.

I guess what other members are saying is I can use the eBay springs with the eBay sleeves, but if I want to use MSM springs, I would have to cut 1/4 coil off and not use the sleeves....
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:25 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustin View Post
Well, I mainly picked up the eBay springs for the adjustable sleeves to use with the MSM springs, but they're too small for the shocks. Shocks just swallow the sleeves and dont rest on them.

I guess what other members are saying is I can use the eBay springs with the eBay sleeves, but if I want to use MSM springs, I would have to cut 1/4 coil off and not use the sleeves....
you dont use stock MSM springs with the sleeves lol
of course it wont work
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Old 01-18-2013, 10:50 PM   #34
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Quote:
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you dont use stock MSM springs with the sleeves lol
of course it wont work
Doh!


Yea, I finally figured that out after I sent the reply.
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Old 01-18-2013, 11:19 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
Yes, those ebay coilover adjusters are fine. And they come with some springs. You will be able to do some measurements and determine the actual spring rates when they arrive.
Can you elaborate on how to find actual spring rates?

I contacted seller on eBay and he has no idea what the spring rates are. I was able to google what the MSM rates are, so I would like to know what these eBay ones are to make my decision a little easier.
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Old 01-19-2013, 03:43 AM   #36
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weigh bricks (or other stuff) and stack em on the springs and see how much it takes to compress em
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Old 01-20-2013, 01:22 AM   #37
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ok, so, got on the rear suspension from the MSM suspension I picked up from another user. I just used those shocks and springs (didn't use eBay springs b/c they sent without wrench adjusters and was missing 2 of the 4 plastic perches) and my ride height in rear increased to 15 3/4"!!!

I measured 14" stock for the rear. This is not what I wanted and now I have no idea how to lower the vehicle. I know the springs should "settle" but I know they're not going to settle as low as I want.

Since the rear ride height grew so much we didn't even put on the front shocks/springs.

We're now trying to figure out what to do. I would like to get some higher spring rate springs that have adjustable ride height, or that will lower my car to a decent ride height. Someone mentioned ordering from Summit Racing?

What do you guys think my next step should be?

It is very possible we put the wrong shocks/springs in the rear. We had no instructions, and had to build the coilovers ourselves as they came as individual parts from a private seller from another forum. And, yes, we used NB top hats I purchased from another user on this forum.

Anyone have any real experience with swapping MSM suspension to an NA? Maybe the springs haven't settled enough since they haven't been on a car in over 3 years...

Before ride height



Installing MSM shocks/springs



After: Monster truck status



We used the smaller shocks for rear, with the smaller diameter, and smaller gauge springs thinking those would be the lower spring rate intended for rear. Two of the shocks have a orange paint blob on a coil of the springs we assumed meant for the higher spring rate front springs.
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Old 01-20-2013, 11:53 AM   #38
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So you can understand the progression of my understanding the coilover conversion, read these. Your questions are not new ones. I had them too.

Read this from a couple of years ago:
https://www.miataturbo.net/suspensio...-hijinx-44740/

And this:
https://www.miataturbo.net/race-prep...s-no56k-61052/

Then this:
soon-to-be Suspension, suggestions? - Miata Forumz - Mazda Miata Chat Forums

And then this:
Sixshooter's Slow Torture™ Build, A Study in Automotive Masochism - Page 2 - Miata Forumz - Mazda Miata Chat Forums
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Old 01-20-2013, 09:58 PM   #39
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Thanks Sixshooter! All of the links were a tremendous help.

**Edit - Ok, got the perches off. There was a slim epoxy coating on top of the perch. Lubed it up with some WD-40 and began hammering. Viola.

Now, I need to grind of the piece on the shock that prevented the perch from moving sideways.

Any suggestions on springs? From what I've learned I need 7" length, and 2.5" ID. Im thinking 400/300 (or 450/300). Want firm, but not jarring since the wife and I will be taking trips in it.

What do you guys suggest? DD that will see some autocross/track time.

Last edited by Dustin; 01-21-2013 at 07:56 PM.
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Old 01-22-2013, 01:56 PM   #40
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Lol told you bro. You gotta cut the springs.
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