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-   Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain (https://www.miataturbo.net/suspension-brakes-drivetrain-49/)
-   -   There's too many coilover options (11 page thread to explain 80 page thread) (https://www.miataturbo.net/suspension-brakes-drivetrain-49/theres-too-many-coilover-options-11-page-thread-explain-80-page-thread-97725/)

ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 01:18 PM

There's too many coilover options (11 page thread to explain 80 page thread)
 
Post 10 page edit: don't waste your time here. Save yourself time and go here: https://www.clubroadster.net/vb_foru...n-ballers.html and here: https://www.miataturbo.net/suspensio...-thread-78451/

I'm stuck. There's too many coilover options for this car. Everything from $500 teins to $2000 ohlins and xidas.
I was going to go with VMaxx Classics, cheapish (on sale they're REALLY cheap), made for the miata, and a general "go-to" for people who want something that isn't stock suspension.
Then I did more research and there's apparently a huge difference once you hit ~$1000. So now I'm thinking VMAXX Classics, BC, Stance XR-1, Meisterr CRD (in no order). But all of them are different spring rates.

BC BR spring rates are: 10k front / 8k rear (560lbs/in front / 448lbs/in rear)
Stance XR-1 are: 10k front / 8k rear (560lbs/in front / 448lbs/in rear)
Meisterr Zeta CRD are: 6k front / 5k rear (336lbs/in front / 280lbs/in rear)
FM Vmaxx Classic are: 391lbs/in front / 258lbs/in rear, all 4 have 112lb/in helper springs

Use:
This car is a toy that I would like to be able to drive to work or school, and not have the gf tell me it feels like shit. So stiff enough to provide good dampening through corners, but soft enough to not bounce my head through the hardtop when I hit a bump. I don't plan on stancing the car. I just bought wheels yesterday so this is a "in a few months" thing but the wheel specs are 15x7 +35 with a 205/50/15 no rolling. I plan on running 949 "dual duty" alignment, maybe take out some camber so it's only a degree and a half or so, but I'm not doing extended ball joints because I just did stock ones. Looking for within the FM ride height (12"-12.5" f and 12.5-13" rear, I'll probably be OCD and go 12.25 and 12.75 lol). I don't plan on adjusting anything once it's all set so the Vmaxx Classics are a bolt in, adjust ride height, get an alignment and go. No need for dampening adjustment cause it's just a fun car.

SuperMiata Dual Duty Alignment (cars that see regular street use and some track/autocross)

In general, the Dual Duty alignment is intended for cars that will occasionally reach the limits of traction and slide the tires but don't want to give up too much tire wear for daily driving. To reach target camber and ride height will usually require adding Extended Lower Ball Joints

4.5 ~ 5.25" front pinch weld height
.06 ~ .18" rake, rear higher

Front camber: -2.5
Caster: +3.5 ~ 4.0
Front total toe: 0

Rear camber : -2.0
Rear total toe: + 1/8", .06"

All help is appreciated!

Full_Tilt_Boogie 08-09-2018 01:26 PM

There is only one option and its none that you listed

HeavyD 08-09-2018 01:27 PM

Why no Billies?

18psi 08-09-2018 01:31 PM

there's like 3 options. and none of them are the trash you listed. time to read/search

concealer404 08-09-2018 01:47 PM

I'm wasting my time telling you to not tell them to post the links to the products because the OP wasted time asking this stupid question instead of spending a whopping 30 minutes helping himself to come up with some correct answers.

cabowabo 08-09-2018 02:24 PM


Originally Posted by ThePanduuh (Post 1495571)
BC BR spring rates are: 10k front / 8k rear (560lbs/in front / 448lbs/in rear)
Stance XR-1 are: 10k front / 8k rear (560lbs/in front / 448lbs/in rear)
Meisterr Zeta CRD are: 6k front / 5k rear (336lbs/in front / 280lbs/in rear)
FM Vmaxx Classic are: 391lbs/in front / 258lbs/in rear, all 4 have 112lb/in helper springs

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...5367ffcfab.gif


ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 03:58 PM

I've done research. I've looked at forums. I've read what I've needed to.
I don't want to spend $2000 on ohlins/xidas for a $2000 car. The car is not a professional level car.
I don't want to spend $1400 on Stance XR-1's because I've seen 0 information on them (hence why I came here).
I don't want to spend $1000 on BC BR's because I don't really like how BC makes coilovers for every single car in existence, I think it's less "fine tuned" for individual cars, go ahead, tell me I'm wrong so I can legitimately look into them. The only good thing I see with BC's is you can get custom spring rates at no extra charge, well waiting longer.
I've opted to stay away from custom sleeved bilstiens because 1) they're out of stock everywhere, 2) they're hard to find used in decent condition near me (rust belt), and 3) i just want something to bolt up and work. Adjust ride height, dampening if it has it, and go get an alignment. Set it once and forget it type of thing.

The thing is, there isn't really a "correct answer" is there? there's coilovers for the miata in various price ranges and everyone has a specific use case. So, judging by mine, VMAXX classics seem appropriate. Simple, budget, designed for a miata, and they'll just bolt up and work (yea you gotta assemble them but that's easier than beating sleeves onto shocks).
In my other car I'm just on progressive rate springs, stock struts, and koni rears.

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:00 PM

Well you're right. If you want to spend $500, there really isn't a right answer.

ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 04:02 PM


Originally Posted by concealer404 (Post 1495629)
Well you're right. If you want to spend $500, there really isn't a right answer.

I've considered BC's and Meisterr's which are around the 1k mark. I suppose you could factor in VMAXX Extreme's because they're also around that price point. My question is more which one is better for a streetcar that doesn't sacrifice ride quality. Spring rates are a whole new thing to me. I am willing to spend more than $500, I don't know why you think I only want to spend $500?

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:09 PM

Because you're talking about Teins and Vmaxx Classics, mainly.

Here's the thing, out of your initial list, the BC/Stants stuff had the least offensive spring rates (but too much rear spring because DORIFTUUUUUUUU), but i'm sure the valving is a nightmare. The other options.... not enough spring. Will be doodoobutts.

The general consensus around here is that if you don't want to spend Xidas (or equivalent/ACTUAL competitor, this doesn't mean Meister no matter how many times Jerrick slobs on E's balls on M.net) money, Budget/Custom Bilstein setup is the way to go.

Yeah they're out of stock, so what? Won't kill you to wait a little bit.

cabowabo 08-09-2018 04:12 PM


Originally Posted by concealer404 (Post 1495631)

Yeah they're out of stock, so what? Won't kill you to wait a little bit.

I guess you're not aware of the great Spec Miata Bilstein famine of 2018.

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:14 PM


Originally Posted by cabowabo (Post 1495632)
I guess you're not aware of the great Spec Miata Bilstein famine of 2018.

I don't follow SM because it gives me IBS.

cabowabo 08-09-2018 04:18 PM


Originally Posted by concealer404 (Post 1495634)
I don't follow SM because it gives me IBS.

Well, the billie supply dried up earlier this year. I saw an email from Mazda Comp a while back that they were getting a whole 150 front units and some other number of rears in stock soon, so those probably got snatched right back up by builders.

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:19 PM


Originally Posted by cabowabo (Post 1495637)
Well, the billie supply dried up earlier this year. I saw an email from Mazda Comp a while back that they were getting a whole 150 front units and some other number of rears in stock soon, so those probably got snatched right back up by builders.

I knew it dried up, but a friend of mine still managed to track down some NB B8s somewhat easily and quickly for a budget bilstein setup i put together for him.

2slow 08-09-2018 04:24 PM

Vmaxx can leak/suck air at the adjuster, so if you get them - get the classic (non-adjustable). Probably the best low cost option you've listed.
MeisterCRD is at least made by company that supports Miata race cars and develops Miata specific products through more effort than making sure some shock just can be bolted on. If you want out of the box bolton setup, they will be fine. For lower cost look at Meister Sportive. Around same price as Vmaxx and is fully ready to go out of the box. Good replacement for stock suspension if nothing special is required.
Either Fox or Xidas are going to be excellent at the top level. My friend has Fox and they are quite good, but not as track oriented as Xida Race.

There are plenty of other options, but they are either more specific, more harsh, will require lots of research and individual parts buying or just not any better than the ones above. I know this is not a popular view here, but that's my view.

ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 04:42 PM

And now we're getting some answers...
I wrote tein and Vmaxx because I see teins for sale every other day on miata parts for sale fb group for $400 and that's really cheap for a full suspension setup. everything from street flex z to mono. I am aware that everything except the mono is junk, and even the mono isn't that great. Vmaxx seems to be the new go to for street guys because they are fairly cheap and just work. Are they xida level? obviously not. but they aren't another whole miata cost wise either.

and yes, bilstiens are MIA literally everywhere. I saw a guy who sells them rebuilt, but he only pops up every so often with a couple sets. So with that in mind, would a koni setup be reasonable? how would valving work considering i'm just throwing springs on a shock? Let us not forget BC will do custom spring rates, so I can tweak their rates it'll just take longer to get them (which is fine).

The other research I've gathered is too closely matched front and rear spring rates (ex 6k f 5k r) is no good. I'm learning, just slowly. Miata.net has been the first search result so that's where i've been getting most of my info. the only thing that gets any traction here is bilstien thread, which obviously doesn't work when bilstiens are out of stock. I want to remove wheel gap, improve ride quality, and just have fun with it without spending a fortune.

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:48 PM

Get yo read on, boi. You're asking Day 1 stuff that can be found within threads on the very first page of the forum area that you're posting in.

ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 04:50 PM


Originally Posted by concealer404 (Post 1495643)
Get yo read on, boi. You're asking Day 1 stuff that can be found within threads on the very first page of the forum area that you're posting in.

except the only thing on the first page of the forum area i'm posting in is bilstein thread. which has 78 pages. I have found nothing about other coilovers that's actually useful.

concealer404 08-09-2018 04:53 PM

Look harder. And/or consider reading the 78 page thread and learn something. I can think of three times in the last two weeks we've talked about Konis.

ThePanduuh 08-09-2018 04:57 PM


Originally Posted by concealer404 (Post 1495650)
Look harder. And/or consider reading the 78 page thread and learn something. I can think of three times in the last two weeks we've talked about Konis.

quote from the first post of that thread:
"Bilstein Coilover builds only! No mucking it up with Koni's, stock shocks, blabla."

Safe to say it looks like I'll only find bilstein information which means waiting for bilsteins to come back in stock and finding the balls to make these bilstein custom coilovers
or taking easy route with Vmaxx classics like I originally intended.


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