Interesting Intake Manifold Design
07-31-2009, 04:19 PM
#61
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Call us anytime as well
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The cnc's get pretty loud sometimes so we might not hear the phones
We are here though typically 6 days a week sometimes 7
-James
281 398 6666 Shop
832 455 9756 James/Louzee Cell
832 266 7525 Sam/Gretechen Cell
The cnc's get pretty loud sometimes so we might not hear the phones
We are here though typically 6 days a week sometimes 7
-James
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08-04-2009, 03:54 PM
#63
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Haven't forgotten this thread we have just been busy.
We will be working on our low budget manifold for the Honda guys next week, we will have enough material left over to get started on some miata stuff as well.
-James
We will be working on our low budget manifold for the Honda guys next week, we will have enough material left over to get started on some miata stuff as well.
-James
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08-04-2009, 04:28 PM
#64
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08-04-2009, 04:39 PM
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08-06-2009, 05:19 PM
#69
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After working with a few more plenum designs for our production Billet B Series Manifold I think I am about to settle on this.
It starts out round in the front but tapers all the way to the back creating an oval. It has a constant volume through the entire manifold, even in the very back with full taper. This will maximize plenum overall volume and flow while keeping velocities high as well.
Here are pictures.
This new plenum design will require a little more work for construction with the need of an added forming process that will involve us having to produce some press dies to form the pipe extrusion and then machine, however I believe the added work will be well worth the increase in performance due to the higher overall volume and greater velocities.
Physical construction should begin next week. So I will keep everyone posted with pictures as they come.
-James
It starts out round in the front but tapers all the way to the back creating an oval. It has a constant volume through the entire manifold, even in the very back with full taper. This will maximize plenum overall volume and flow while keeping velocities high as well.
Here are pictures.
This new plenum design will require a little more work for construction with the need of an added forming process that will involve us having to produce some press dies to form the pipe extrusion and then machine, however I believe the added work will be well worth the increase in performance due to the higher overall volume and greater velocities.
Physical construction should begin next week. So I will keep everyone posted with pictures as they come.
-James
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08-06-2009, 08:43 PM
#70
Can't wait to see one for the Miata.
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08-10-2009, 06:29 PM
#71
Don't know why I didn't see the updates for this thread.....
I understand...I actually work in a fastener shop with about 10 big PUMAs and others, we also have some 3 story forges in the back.
I'm not out in Katy much, but will check ya'll out next time I'm there. Looks like you've already lined out some business, and if the results look good I can bring mine by, or pick up the new design.
If you search here there was a pretty good thread late last year where Braineack did some fluid flow analysis in Solid Works to come up with his BEGi modified manifold.
I understand what they did is different than your modular design, but it may give you an idea how well flow will be distributed through the plenum. We've seen a lot of problems in several iterations getting even flow to each runner, and I honestly would buy anything without seeing some pretty animations.
In all honesty you should use your modular setup to test several plenums and see what works best, and note which design suits different demands.
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08-10-2009, 07:14 PM
#73
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The big fancy design that people posted the pictures of are not going to be an official design at all, I will leave similar things to that as custom one offs only leaving a much simpler log style plenum to be my production model. We are about to begin construction of the forming dies and hope to have a solid plenum formed by the end of the week.
As to my opinion on CFD... I believe CFD tests to only be good if the person also simulates the valves opening and closing and air flowing through the motor because that makes a HUGE difference as to how the air flows through a said intake manifold. Who cares it it flows "equally" through all 4 ports at the same time because all 4 ports are NEVER open at the same time.
Now don't get me wrong CFD has a place out there, but for anyone less than GM who can afford the real deal CFD testing that will simulate the entire workings of a motor just to design a intake manifold, well it is just pretty silly to inaccurately to simulate something that will never be.
As to my opinion on CFD... I believe CFD tests to only be good if the person also simulates the valves opening and closing and air flowing through the motor because that makes a HUGE difference as to how the air flows through a said intake manifold. Who cares it it flows "equally" through all 4 ports at the same time because all 4 ports are NEVER open at the same time.
Now don't get me wrong CFD has a place out there, but for anyone less than GM who can afford the real deal CFD testing that will simulate the entire workings of a motor just to design a intake manifold, well it is just pretty silly to inaccurately to simulate something that will never be.
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08-10-2009, 07:57 PM
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Actually yes a customer of mine whom we build Lotus Elise parts for and sleeve blocks has a flow bench and the final product will receive full flow testing. After that's said the owner of Inline Racing just happens to be our best personal friend much less best business friend and I have 24/7 dyno access to really dial things in 100%.
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08-11-2009, 02:39 PM
#77
Its all very good to say the normal testing is meaningless, but then you should come up with something else to replace it. If you can't come up with ANYTHING better, put a second set of cam gears on a stock motor, and drive the second head with that. :-) I was once on a project where we took a 4 cyl motor, bored a hole in the head, and used one cyl to drive a linear generator we were testing. :-)
Huh, does anyone have a feel for what kind of horsepower it takes to run cams at 7,000 rpm? I've got a couple air compressor motors I'm not using.
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08-11-2009, 02:54 PM
#79
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+1
Its all very good to say the normal testing is meaningless, but then you should come up with something else to replace it. If you can't come up with ANYTHING better, put a second set of cam gears on a stock motor, and drive the second head with that. :-) I was once on a project where we took a 4 cyl motor, bored a hole in the head, and used one cyl to drive a linear generator we were testing. :-)
Huh, does anyone have a feel for what kind of horsepower it takes to run cams at 7,000 rpm? I've got a couple air compressor motors I'm not using.
Its all very good to say the normal testing is meaningless, but then you should come up with something else to replace it. If you can't come up with ANYTHING better, put a second set of cam gears on a stock motor, and drive the second head with that. :-) I was once on a project where we took a 4 cyl motor, bored a hole in the head, and used one cyl to drive a linear generator we were testing. :-)
Huh, does anyone have a feel for what kind of horsepower it takes to run cams at 7,000 rpm? I've got a couple air compressor motors I'm not using.
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08-11-2009, 02:58 PM
#80
There's the issue with backpressure, though I guess pulling a constant vacuum on a chamber with enough volume would "fill" on each cylinder.
Yeah - I was thinking 7,000 rpm equivalent. 10,000 he'd need shim under bucket. :-) I'd love to know when one needs that since... my bottom end can handle it and I'd like to not trash the head.
Yeah - I was thinking 7,000 rpm equivalent. 10,000 he'd need shim under bucket. :-) I'd love to know when one needs that since... my bottom end can handle it and I'd like to not trash the head.
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