best bang for $$$?
09-09-2011, 06:54 PM
#67
240 is useless garbage unless you are drifting, I know there is an aftermarket for them but your comparing a niche drifting community to a miata? Miatas are the most raced car in America most spec but that doesn't mean stock, I'd be willing to bet for every 240 part sold there are 4 miata parts sold, unless we count the broken drifting into walls stuff.
Just to keep this thread going, I am going to have to disagree with this. The 240 is good track platform as well. Just because there aren't any wheel to wheel race series and plenty of shitty drift cars doesnt mean it is a bad platform. The recent world time attack race in australia had 2-3 S15s in the top 10 in the unlimited division. There is a conspicuous lack of miatas. Nothing wrong with the platform. Not as cheap as miatas(which really accounts for the miatas popularity in racing).
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09-11-2011, 03:23 AM
#72
It is simpler and so has lower unsprung weight typically. Probably the only one that matters from a handling perspective.
It is cheaper and offers some packaging advantages.
Do double wishbone setups have advantages? yes. However, you'd be a fool to believe that a properly designed strut setup can't be better than a less well designed double wishbone setup. Do you really think that the miata is automatically a better handling car just because it has a double wishbone front setup? I suppose any RWD car automatically handles better than all FWD cars too?
It is cheaper and offers some packaging advantages.
Do double wishbone setups have advantages? yes. However, you'd be a fool to believe that a properly designed strut setup can't be better than a less well designed double wishbone setup. Do you really think that the miata is automatically a better handling car just because it has a double wishbone front setup? I suppose any RWD car automatically handles better than all FWD cars too?
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09-11-2011, 12:32 PM
#73
this is SUPER easy to resolve. All else being EQUAL, a double wishbone suspension will always be better than a mcpherson strut. If someone was to build a race car from scratch, do you honestly believe they would use mcpherson struts? If you do, then have i got one hell of a deal for you in real estate! Can you imagine an ALMS daytona protoype with struts? lol
Why isn't it done? because from day one, struts were used as an economical alternative 1st, and as a packaging alternative 2nd. especially when fWD cars became popular for ECONOMY cars.
Note that i did not say an economy car with struts could not be made fast. because it can. yes it can be made faster than a double wishbone car. but if i had to choose, it would be a rwd car with double wishbone suspension for a track/race car. I actually have an awd beast, a super fast swapped turbo fwd, and a pretty quick turbo miata, the rwd is by far the funnest if not the fastest i've driven on track.
some people are stupid about 240's though. yes there are 240's that road race and can be great with modifications just like any car. the people that hate on them and drifting are just like rednecks hating black people, or germans killing jews. ignorance spewing false information.
Why isn't it done? because from day one, struts were used as an economical alternative 1st, and as a packaging alternative 2nd. especially when fWD cars became popular for ECONOMY cars.
Note that i did not say an economy car with struts could not be made fast. because it can. yes it can be made faster than a double wishbone car. but if i had to choose, it would be a rwd car with double wishbone suspension for a track/race car. I actually have an awd beast, a super fast swapped turbo fwd, and a pretty quick turbo miata, the rwd is by far the funnest if not the fastest i've driven on track.
some people are stupid about 240's though. yes there are 240's that road race and can be great with modifications just like any car. the people that hate on them and drifting are just like rednecks hating black people, or germans killing jews. ignorance spewing false information.
Last edited by spoolin2bars; 09-11-2011 at 12:49 PM.
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09-11-2011, 08:15 PM
#74
this is SUPER easy to resolve. All else being EQUAL, a double wishbone suspension will always be better than a mcpherson strut. If someone was to build a race car from scratch, do you honestly believe they would use mcpherson struts? If you do, then have i got one hell of a deal for you in real estate! Can you imagine an ALMS daytona protoype with struts? lol
Why isn't it done? because from day one, struts were used as an economical alternative 1st, and as a packaging alternative 2nd. especially when fWD cars became popular for ECONOMY cars.
Note that i did not say an economy car with struts could not be made fast. because it can. yes it can be made faster than a double wishbone car. but if i had to choose, it would be a rwd car with double wishbone suspension for a track/race car. I actually have an awd beast, a super fast swapped turbo fwd, and a pretty quick turbo miata, the rwd is by far the funnest if not the fastest i've driven on track.
some people are stupid about 240's though. yes there are 240's that road race and can be great with modifications just like any car. the people that hate on them and drifting are just like rednecks hating black people, or germans killing jews. ignorance spewing false information.
Why isn't it done? because from day one, struts were used as an economical alternative 1st, and as a packaging alternative 2nd. especially when fWD cars became popular for ECONOMY cars.
Note that i did not say an economy car with struts could not be made fast. because it can. yes it can be made faster than a double wishbone car. but if i had to choose, it would be a rwd car with double wishbone suspension for a track/race car. I actually have an awd beast, a super fast swapped turbo fwd, and a pretty quick turbo miata, the rwd is by far the funnest if not the fastest i've driven on track.
some people are stupid about 240's though. yes there are 240's that road race and can be great with modifications just like any car. the people that hate on them and drifting are just like rednecks hating black people, or germans killing jews. ignorance spewing false information.
Pretty close to what i was saying. All of our cars are road cars. Road cars are inherently a series of compromises and use of different suspension types is one of them. I don't see too many Lemans, daytona prototype, Indy, F1, or other open wheeled race car drivers around here, but yeah I would choose double A arms for a dedicated ground up build. This has no relevance for cars based on road cars.
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09-11-2011, 09:25 PM
#75
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I was just stating the fact that one design was functionally superior to the other in handling, not that cars with struts can't go around corners. You seemed like you were looking for differences/similarities to contrast and compare and I threw you a bone, that's all.
The lower polar moment of inertia in a Miata is better for cornering than a 240 as well, if you are keeping score.
The lower polar moment of inertia in a Miata is better for cornering than a 240 as well, if you are keeping score.
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09-11-2011, 09:34 PM
#76
For the past 3 pages all i've read is
"Double wish bones are better than Mc-Struts"
"Mc-Struts can be made better than double wish bones if u throw enough money at it"
"Yeah but throw the same money at double wish bone and it will be better."
"Well throw more and the struts can be better"
"Oh it doesn't matter so much for street cars"
"Still struts are better because I want to throw more money at it though."
"Well throw more money at the double wish bones and they will be better."
I think that about sums it up.
"Double wish bones are better than Mc-Struts"
"Mc-Struts can be made better than double wish bones if u throw enough money at it"
"Yeah but throw the same money at double wish bone and it will be better."
"Well throw more and the struts can be better"
"Oh it doesn't matter so much for street cars"
"Still struts are better because I want to throw more money at it though."
"Well throw more money at the double wish bones and they will be better."
I think that about sums it up.
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