CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever. - Page 4 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Build Threads Building a motor? Post the progress here.

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-11-2015, 03:57 PM   #61
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

No and me of course.
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 04:02 PM   #62
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
iTrader: (5)
 
aidandj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Beaverton, USA
Posts: 17,999
Total Cats: 1,466
Default

Stock turbo right? MS and EBC to crank the boost?
aidandj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 04:02 PM   #63
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,926
Total Cats: 526
Default

Oh, I thought he went forged pistons. NVM then. Of course you did the assembly.
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 04:11 PM   #64
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

Nope, no forged. Just forged rods. Ms pro and ebc, yes. Should be laz with leather and ac, really.

Differences are: vtcs vs. Vics, FM DP/exhaust vs. Ebay and stock exhaust with muffler cut off. And skunk2 vs stock.

I don't think the ms2 vs pro will make a big difference.
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 06:09 PM   #65
Newb
 
mikev's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Medford, OR
Posts: 21
Total Cats: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
Geeze guys its only a miata. Just push it up the hill.
Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Nope, no forged. Just forged rods. Ms pro and ebc, yes. Should be laz with leather and ac, really.

Differences are: vtcs vs. Vics, FM DP/exhaust vs. Ebay and stock exhaust with muffler cut off. And skunk2 vs stock.

I don't think the ms2 vs pro will make a big difference.
It's hard not to be too excited about this. I was playing the first fire it up video over and over in my head last night instead of sleeping. I'm like a kid who knows what's getting under the tree at Christmas, but it's only Thanksgiving.

I was Project Lazarus that really got me fired up and thinking about what to do with my MSM motor. Laz with leather and A/C sounds like a pretty awesome combo to me. I've seen the videos of Laz running at various tracks and am looking forward to joining you guys in the big fun.
mikev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 07:06 PM   #66
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
iTrader: (5)
 
aidandj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Beaverton, USA
Posts: 17,999
Total Cats: 1,466
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Nope, no forged. Just forged rods. Ms pro and ebc, yes. Should be laz with leather and ac, really.

Differences are: vtcs vs. Vics, FM DP/exhaust vs. Ebay and stock exhaust with muffler cut off. And skunk2 vs stock.

I don't think the ms2 vs pro will make a big difference.
MS2 vs Pro shouldn't really make a difference from a power standpoint. Fun features and whatnot are the big difference.

Are there any bigger turbos that match the stock IHI flange?
aidandj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 07:14 PM   #67
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

If you bore out the compressor housing, apparently a evo....something chra fits for more power. Well, same power but at less boost. And the capability of more power.
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 07:18 PM   #68
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
iTrader: (5)
 
aidandj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Beaverton, USA
Posts: 17,999
Total Cats: 1,466
Default

There is a guy somewhere near corvallis who is making really reasonably priced CNC machined turbo wheels. He bored out an Evo turbo for someone in the local car club and it looks pretty badass:



aidandj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 09:01 PM   #69
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,196
Total Cats: 2,584
Default

most popular (that I know) of upgrade for the msm turbo is from BNR supercars. they machine the hotside and stuff a evo 16g chra and cold side on there. only part retained from stocker is the hotside.
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 09:02 PM   #70
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
iTrader: (5)
 
aidandj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Beaverton, USA
Posts: 17,999
Total Cats: 1,466
Default

And this guy is then machining out the Evo 16g housing and stuffing an even bigger compressor wheel in there lol. He also does ball bearing conversions.
aidandj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2015, 09:09 PM   #71
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,196
Total Cats: 2,584
Default

IMO it's pretty pointless on the MSM setup. I've yet to see results that impressed me. You've got a really restrictive mani, pretty small hotside, poor wastegate design, pretty restrictive downpipe bellmouth, really restrictive intake piping, and really restrictive fmic piping. So really, you're just fighting an uphill battle the whole time. I can see a small 16g in there working decently cause you'd just be aiming for mid/upper 200's, and the stocker is pretty much done past 12psi, but beyond that........it's time for a proper setup

The MSM setup only makes sense for people that have emissions/visual inspection/etc.

I cannot understand the point of running it otherwise with all these really nice systems available for pretty good prices.

PS : I love my daily driver bolt on msm
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2015, 11:43 AM   #72
SADFab Destructive Testing Engineer
iTrader: (5)
 
aidandj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Beaverton, USA
Posts: 17,999
Total Cats: 1,466
Default

Is the chump car Mitch's car? Or is it a different chump Miata.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
IMO it's pretty pointless on the MSM setup. I've yet to see results that impressed me. You've got a really restrictive mani, pretty small hotside, poor wastegate design, pretty restrictive downpipe bellmouth, really restrictive intake piping, and really restrictive fmic piping. So really, you're just fighting an uphill battle the whole time. I can see a small 16g in there working decently cause you'd just be aiming for mid/upper 200's, and the stocker is pretty much done past 12psi, but beyond that........it's time for a proper setup

The MSM setup only makes sense for people that have emissions/visual inspection/etc.

I cannot understand the point of running it otherwise with all these really nice systems available for pretty good prices.

PS : I love my daily driver bolt on msm
Idk a stock looking turbo setup running 20+ psi would be pretty crazy. Never said anything about practical, but would be cool.

Last edited by curly; 04-12-2015 at 12:04 PM.
aidandj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2015, 12:40 PM   #73
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
Is the chump car Mitch's car? Or is it a different chump Miata.
Yes, Mitch's. He's already talking about using Martin's VICS manifold when Martin installs the Honda intake on Laz. With the VVT tuning I did, Mitch's car actually made 5 more ft/lbs than Ryan's, I hope to do the same tuning to Ryan's car soon. Overlying Ryan's graph on to Mitch's, the VICS should be able to keep Mitch's car at his peak of 135hp from 6,000rpm to 7000, instead of tapering down to 128 like it currently does.

Torque should also stay above 100, maybe even 105ish, from 6500 to 7000, instead of dipping down to 96 like it does now. We also had some really impressive gains with VICS tuning on the dyno, we found it best to be open (closed?) above 3300, and closed (open?) above 5500.

Differences between Ryan's and Mitch's NA VVT cars are:

Mitch: junk yard '03 auto VVT motor with stock head and header, gutted VTCS intake manifold, tiny ~8" intake pipe, exhaust shop test pipe and 2.5" exhaust through Borla muffler.

Ryan: CSTG built '01 VVT motor with shaved head and OBX header, VICS intake manifold, K&N intake (the one from 949), 2.5" test pipe, and RB midpipe with RB muffler.

Back to the MSM, I'm out to the garage now to disassemble the engine lift, install the shifter, install the FM exhaust, and maybe even drive it!
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2015, 02:27 PM   #74
Newb
 
mikev's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Medford, OR
Posts: 21
Total Cats: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
Back to the MSM, I'm out to the garage now to disassemble the engine lift, install the shifter, install the FM exhaust, and maybe even drive it!
Once you drive it you'll see why I ordered the BBK. Well, and because I wanted to have as much stop as I should have go.

Absolutely the most totally trashed brake system I've ever had the displeasure of trying to drive.
mikev is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2015, 10:14 PM   #75
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Angry

More sound **** for mike:



It's going super lean with aggressive throttle movement, gotta figure that out. AIT was reading fine, but ever since I wrote Mazda calibrations to the controller, its been stuck on -21*. That and final ebc wiring is for tomorrow, today the exhaust was installed, and wideband and boost gauge were wired and installed. And the drive shaft was installed. And tranny filled. And shifter rebuilt with new bushings and boots. Lazy day I know.
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2015, 04:22 AM   #76
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,926
Total Cats: 526
Default

Amazing.

My car really needs to go to CSTG in early June for final reassembly. Give the man some money and let him do his work. Wow.

Can't wait for a ride in this thing
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2015, 10:42 PM   #77
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

Well, after turning up the req_fuel, and dumping some more fuel in, it's finally running reasonably well. FIC apparently required this, according to this thread:

https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...e-83467/page4/

Although I claim the first "drive" credit, by pulling it further into the garage, and later the 2nd "drive" involved backing it out, GreddyGalant drove it the first 13 miles around the back country roads of Oregon City, helping me break it in as I tuned the fuel map. Car has about 30 miles on it now, 30 miles that would make a car sick prone person incredibly nauseous as we break in the engine.

I also managed to get the carpets cleaned at CSTG. Chairs were originally in the garage, but I had **** to do, so once the cleaners were gone, CSTG became the main entrance to Castle Curly, as the entry way was taken up by #allthechairs.

Name:  C0DC9B9B-9377-4610-B602-EEC5C6FC921D_zpsbf1rlsrt.jpg
Views: 12
Size:  1.48 MB

Laz also stopped by to lean out his 12.5afr idle, and try swapping idle valves to solve his 75% idle DC issue. It didn't work, but it does seem to be idling better after some tuning. With the rain, I shoved the black MSM to the front of the garage, and worked on Laz under the small over hang of my roof, barely staying dry.
Name:  288A73D2-0AC5-4F91-B1D1-FC2796BB9CA1_zpsfl3wh60m.jpg
Views: 13
Size:  1.16 MB

I also realized I never posted a final engine bay shot. It's not very pretty, since black bays are impossible to photograph, and it still looks like a plumbing nightmare. But trust me, it's cleaner than it was.

Name:  5DB23CAC-0EC9-4CC7-A3C9-99E568066258_zpsuswmc6vc.jpg
Views: 12
Size:  1.44 MB

I also finished up the gauge install. Still needs a screw to keep it angled down a bit to help with the boost gauge visibility. If anyone needs something water jetted, I highly suggest contacting Humming Aero (humming), great price for a nice little piece. I'll be contacting him again once I figure out how I want to get rid of my a-pillar gauge pod on Smurf.

Attached Thumbnails
CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever.-385f4b0b-397b-4dab-8f10-ae21ef525b8c_zpserglgzjc.jpg  
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2015, 09:37 AM   #78
Junior Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: PHX, Arizona
Posts: 227
Total Cats: 13
Default

Thanks for the shout out curly. If the smurf doesn't have a head unit and that space is available I have a neat little piece I designed that clips in and has connectors that you can solder in line for your gauges to make installation and removal simple. Designed it for my car but still haven't gone head unitless.
humming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2015, 11:14 AM   #79
Cpt. Slow
Thread Starter
iTrader: (25)
 
curly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon City, OR
Posts: 12,107
Total Cats: 518
Default

Smurf only has half a dash. I kinda copied Keith's Targa's switch panel too:



Although without the rally computer. I currently have my water temp gauge below the switch panel, but I don't want to have 3 gauges across the bottom, cause at that point I might as well have kept the damn tombstone. I'd love to do something like Revlimiter's dash:



But those angled cups are apparently impossible to find.

Googling "angled gauge pods" gives me tons of DIY ideas though:



A pack of three of these costs $16:



We'll see. For now I have a fully functional turbo'd MSM to play with. There's a small leak from where I joined the throttle body lines that the S2 doesn't have. Go figure, the one place I reused the stock spring clamps. I might be convince to grab a brand new, single piece of rubber heater hose of the correct size and run it directly from the water/oil heater/cooler to the mixing manifold, but I'm fairly certain getting at the water/oil heater/cooler side will take me as long as it did to build the entire engine.
Attached Thumbnails
CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever.-img_8536.jpg   CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever.-dash03.jpg   CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever.-angled%2520gauge%2520pods_zps9cdxpfld.jpg  
curly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2015, 12:45 PM   #80
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Portland (left coast)
Posts: 214
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
To update you on the shifter, there was zero signs of a lower bushing, and of course both upper and lower boots were toast.

And along with not tightening the crank bolt, the idler and tensioner pulleys were certainly not changed.
This is what mine looked like when I rebuilt the shifter.

Those bearings are nuts. I wonder if that is what my STi will look like when it's engine gets cracked?

Attached Thumbnails
CSTG's winter/spring build #....7? The Worst MSM Ever.-20140824_090941_zpsb8165090.jpg  
tazswing is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Garrett Turbo, 1.8 Oil Pan, & Misc. Stuff nbdooey Miata parts for sale/trade 9 08-30-2017 10:50 PM
WTB MP62 (Hotside) (NB2) Rick02R WTB 3 01-03-2016 08:18 PM
Expected intake temps on the track? tazswing Race Prep 20 10-03-2015 12:04 PM
Are my coils failing? viriiguy General Miata Chat 5 09-28-2015 08:39 PM
WTB HPDE miata - Texas Voltwings Cars for sale/trade 0 09-27-2015 07:40 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:23 AM.