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Old 10-06-2011, 06:14 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blindboxx2334 View Post

example:
1.8 na chassis with nb1 motor: why would you buy a 94-97 ms, when it seems as if it would be much less of a headache to buy the computer that's specifically made for that motor (esp. since its a completely diff motor, and 1.6 ms with a rotary??? now im really lost ) plus then wouldnt you run into tuning nightmares? (trying to get a 1.6 computer to tell a 1.8 how to run). and to my understanding, it will pretty much be plug and play (MS to engine harness) if you match the correct computer to the engine, i also dont see why youd create that other headache for yourself...

(im not trying to stir some shitz up. im just trying to learn)

The typical 1.8 swap into a 1.6 has been done many times. You just use the computer and sensors from the 1.6. The 1.6 ECU can control the 1.8 just fine. The difference with my swap is that I am also adding boost, so just like I would use MS if I boosted the 1.6, I am using it to control the 1.8 without switching over the whole harness for the MSM.

The difference in opinion on which ECU comes from the fact that I already have the wiring and sensors to run the better MSM setup but I am using the outdated parts anyway.

Hopefully that makes it more clear.
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:17 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
the CAS is run off the timing belt, so there is timing error due to jitter.
do you mean crank angle sensor or cam angle sensor? and wat car? na or nb?

i googled "miata CAS" and i got results that both said "crank" and "cam"
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:19 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdmae92 View Post
The typical 1.8 swap into a 1.6 has been done many times. You just use the computer and sensors from the 1.6. The 1.6 ECU can control the 1.8 just fine. The difference with my swap is that I am also adding boost, so just like I would use MS if I boosted the 1.6, I am using it to control the 1.8 without switching over the whole harness for the MSM.
if you swap over the 1.6 ms on your MSM motor, wouldnt you have to use the 1.6 engine wiring harness? that just seems like too much of a pain, for no gain.
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:25 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blindboxx2334 View Post
do you mean crank angle sensor or cam angle sensor? and wat car? na or nb?

i googled "miata CAS" and i got results that both said "crank" and "cam"
nb uses both, crank and cam
na uses just cam

I mean can it be done the way OP is trying to do it? YES.
Its just not the best way of going about it, and since he has the harness and sensors already might as well do it right.
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:32 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blindboxx2334 View Post
do you mean crank angle sensor or cam angle sensor? and wat car? na or nb?

i googled "miata CAS" and i got results that both said "crank" and "cam"

cool story bro. ignore my wisdom, it's okay.
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:34 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
nb uses both, crank and cam
na uses just cam

I mean can it be done the way OP is trying to do it? YES.
Its just not the best way of going about it, and since he has the harness and sensors already might as well do it right.
this makes more sence now..

brain-wut did i do? i read everything you said and was still confused, we were talking about two things that have the same abbreviation, CAS, so i was trying to get some clarification..
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:43 PM   #27
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rawr
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:45 PM   #28
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ill stop with the questions...






for today.
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Old 10-06-2011, 06:46 PM   #29
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CAS =/= CAS?

Mind blown
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Old 10-06-2011, 07:18 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blindboxx2334 View Post
if you swap over the 1.6 ms on your MSM motor, wouldnt you have to use the 1.6 engine wiring harness? that just seems like too much of a pain, for no gain.
Yes, I am using the 1.6 engine wiring harness. Less pain than swapping the MSM harness into my chassis (as far as I understand at least). As for gain, the engine will make roughly twice the power that I have now.
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Old 10-06-2011, 07:24 PM   #31
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Nice find on the MSM motor. I can't blame you for not wanting to swap the harness over, I'm sure there are some benefits to be had but seems like it would be a nightmare. In fact, I'm having flashbacks to...

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MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-100_0952.jpg  
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Old 10-06-2011, 07:27 PM   #32
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sounds good, i didnt know miata engine harness were linked to the chassis harness, i thought they were two separate things... ive yet to actually look at an engine harness thats off a miata. but atleast you'll only have to modify the ends of the harness for the sensors, versus the whole thing itself.
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Old 10-07-2011, 06:40 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
nb uses both, crank and cam
na uses just cam
Wut?

The NA CAS sends both cam and crank signals too, they're driven off the cam which is why the NB sensors are more accurate, the crank sensor is actually on the crank so isn't effected by timing belt slop.

Whilst it's technically possible to run an engine from a cam signal only, you need slightly more teeth than the NA CAS provides .

Cliffs:

NA = CAS which sends both crank and cam signals
NB = Separate crank and cam sensors, crank on the.... crank and cam on the cam.
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:32 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
(Posting from my phone.)

But the mspnp cannot read the NB sensor until it's upgrade to msII

Sure it can. Grind the two TDC teeth off the crank wheel and you're gtg.
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Old 12-19-2011, 11:52 PM   #35
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Well it's been awhile since I posted before I actually made any progress. I have some free time over the holiday break so I pulled the car into the garage to pull the 1.6 and mount the MSM engine up.

The wonderful garage...better than working in the driveway I guess.



Squirrels love my engine bay:



Progress after a few hours:



Attached Thumbnails
MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1071.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1068.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1074.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1075.jpg  
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Old 12-20-2011, 12:34 AM   #36
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I'm toying with the idea of selling my old MSpnp9093 if you're interested. I'm selling it so I can switch over to a crank sensor on my 99-swap in the 1.6 car.
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Old 12-20-2011, 02:29 AM   #37
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I already have a MSPNP to hook up.
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Old 01-07-2012, 11:21 PM   #38
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Not many updates for awhile, I have been working on it slowly. I have the MSM engine mounted now, just need some more parts to get it together.





Right now I have the intake off to remove the VTCS butterflies. I also need to get a 99-00 fuel rail and intercooler setup.
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MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1084.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1083.jpg  
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Old 08-28-2012, 11:04 PM   #39
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Looks like I forgot to update this thread. The Miata has been running in rallycross for the whole season so far and doing quite well. As long as I am driving well it is very fast.

Some pictures and video.











Attached Thumbnails
MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1231.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1307.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_1310.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-img_20120826_130917.jpg   MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-1mr17mr-08-m.jpg  

MSM engine swap in 90 Miata-1mr17mr-65-m.jpg  
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Old 08-28-2012, 11:05 PM   #40
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