Pat's Ebay Turbo Compound Boost Build
12-17-2016, 02:51 PM
#1002
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If you can get your hands on a 90-97 automatic bellhousing I think you will have the most simple solution for converting to a c4 transmission. I was planning on doing a c4 conversion as well. I haven't gotten around to really starting the project as I have a long to-do list of other projects ahead of it. I do however have a case fill c4 and a bh off a 96. It appears all you have to do to physically bolt the bh onto the ford pump is weld original bolt holes in bh and drill new holes to match pump. the id of the bh is also slightly larger than the flange on the pump so you will have to make a centering ring to fill the gap. I haven't measured the gap, but it may be as simple as cutting a strip of sheet metal to use as centering ring. It's that close. I haven't checked the depth, but it may be very close as well.
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12-17-2016, 02:58 PM
#1003
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If you can get your hands on a 90-97 automatic bellhousing I think you will have the most simple solution for converting to a c4 transmission. I was planning on doing a c4 conversion as well. I haven't gotten around to really starting the project as I have a long to-do list of other projects ahead of it. I do however have a case fill c4 and a bh off a 96. It appears all you have to do to physically bolt the bh onto the ford pump is weld original bolt holes in bh and drill new holes to match pump. the id of the bh is also slightly larger than the flange on the pump so you will have to make a centering ring to fill the gap. I haven't measured the gap, but it may be as simple as cutting a strip of sheet metal to use as centering ring. It's that close. I haven't checked the depth, but it may be very close as well.
The 99 bell is huge, and you would have to cut a TON off of it, and the bolt spacing is so far out that you can't hit the ford pump with the mazda bellhousing.
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12-17-2016, 03:00 PM
#1004
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For an update, I got access to a TIG and a small lathe finally. I bought some 1030 round bar, they actually gave me 4130. Well, it's a bear to machine. To the point that I'm giving up and I ordered some 6061 T6 aluminum to build my adapter from instead. That should be easy to machine.
I think I'm about to pull the new turbo stuff off the front and replace it with new turbo stuff.
I think I'm about to pull the new turbo stuff off the front and replace it with new turbo stuff.
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12-17-2016, 04:32 PM
#1006
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Could you unbolt that housing and measure the center to center on the bolt holes and ID of the centering ring? Tape measure is fine as long as it's close.
This is actually looking like it might be an option!
This is actually looking like it might be an option!
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12-17-2016, 04:56 PM
#1007
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The bolt center to center is about the same as the c4 pump (roughly 7"). The spacing however is off to keep proper alignment, thats why you would have to drill new holes. In the bottom picture I actually have two bolts holding the bellhousing on to the pump to show you center to center as relates to c4. The id of the back of the bell is about .125" (quessing) larger the the od of the alignment flange of the pump. That's why it should be simple to make a centering ring using nothing more than the proper thickness sheet metal. You would also have to do some minor grinding on a small boss on the back of the bell were it would interfere with the transmission dipstick area if case fill. That's my eventual plan anyways.
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12-17-2016, 05:06 PM
#1008
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Oh, so that's the NA bellhousing on the C4 trans in the pic? I didn't realize that.
Well, I'm going to try to get my hands on that bellhousing and see what it would take.
You want to sell me that bellhousing?
Well, I'm going to try to get my hands on that bellhousing and see what it would take.
You want to sell me that bellhousing?
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12-18-2016, 02:25 PM
#1010
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I just measured the gap between the bh flange i.d. and the pump flange o.d. using feeler gauges and .086" is a very tight fit. It looks like a centering ring can be simply cut from 19 gauge steel or 18 gauge aluminum if factoring for a very thin bonding adhesive to bond the strip to the id of the bh flange. Once installed it could be staked in as well for extra security against the adhesive failing and the metal strip somehow working loose.
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12-20-2016, 02:46 AM
#1011
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I bought a CX Racing turbo manifold, this one: CXRacing T3 Top Mount Turbo Exhaust Manifold For 89-99 Miata MX-5 1.8L NA-T | eBay
This is from another thread describing the problems
I think I could build a better manifold myself. But I dunno if it's worth doing vs just making this one work. Looks like material cost would be around 250 to build my own manifold from sch40 steel. That would be stronger than the thinner 304 stainless, but heavier.
Build a manifold, or just make this one work? If I build one it would be similar design to this one, just a better collector, and hopefully less bends. And fit correctly.
This is from another thread describing the problems
I got it. It looks fairly nice, 8/10 based on initial inspection. Decent finish, fairly good welds, overall not that bad especially for the money. But...
1. Runner one hits the water inlet pipe/lower radiator hose.
2. Runner two hits the block
3. When I bolt an EFR 7670 on it, it pokes out above the hood skin by at least 1/4" (granted a smaller turbo would probably be fine, this thing is big)
I called CXRacing and sent them pics and described the problems. So far waiting to hear back, will call tomorrow. They did somewhat seem interested in fixing this so we'll see what they do.
Kind of thought about it, and I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I think they'll try to fix problems 1 & 2, but I dunno if they will fix 3. If not, lame. Plus who knows how long till I'd have a replacement manifold in my hands.
At this point debating on either modding this manifold myself to make it work, or just buy parts and build my own. Wouldn't mind making my own a I could do a better collector I think, and surely make it fit better. But that would take a week for materials to arrive easy, plus all the fab time. Or I could just cut/weld and fix this one in a day probably. Leaning on fixing this one just to get it done so I can move on.
1. Runner one hits the water inlet pipe/lower radiator hose.
2. Runner two hits the block
3. When I bolt an EFR 7670 on it, it pokes out above the hood skin by at least 1/4" (granted a smaller turbo would probably be fine, this thing is big)
I called CXRacing and sent them pics and described the problems. So far waiting to hear back, will call tomorrow. They did somewhat seem interested in fixing this so we'll see what they do.
Kind of thought about it, and I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I think they'll try to fix problems 1 & 2, but I dunno if they will fix 3. If not, lame. Plus who knows how long till I'd have a replacement manifold in my hands.
At this point debating on either modding this manifold myself to make it work, or just buy parts and build my own. Wouldn't mind making my own a I could do a better collector I think, and surely make it fit better. But that would take a week for materials to arrive easy, plus all the fab time. Or I could just cut/weld and fix this one in a day probably. Leaning on fixing this one just to get it done so I can move on.
Build a manifold, or just make this one work? If I build one it would be similar design to this one, just a better collector, and hopefully less bends. And fit correctly.
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12-20-2016, 04:47 AM
#1013
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#1 I have to cut/shorten/weld the water inlet to fix. There is more than .004, but less than .020" of clearance between the runner and water neck without the hose installed. (checked with feeler gauge paper I calipered)
#2 is barely touching, doubling the exhaust manifold gaskets was enough to stock the contact there. Not sure that's a fix though.
#3 is the worst one to fix.
#2 is barely touching, doubling the exhaust manifold gaskets was enough to stock the contact there. Not sure that's a fix though.
#3 is the worst one to fix.
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12-20-2016, 05:47 AM
#1014
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FWIW, even the glorious Artech top mount long runner mani #2 interferes with the water inlet by half an inch. It was built for the MSM inlet. /rant
Last edited by sixshooter; 12-22-2016 at 09:08 AM.
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01-04-2017, 02:45 AM
#1015
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I decided to check, and the ebay GT30 bolts up to this turbo manifold and clears the hood easily. I might just run it instead to make it easier, though I'll have to put an external gate on this manifold to make that work. But there's a ton of room to do that. Could sell the EFR, or buy another and put a pair of them on my other car. (when it's out of warranty, but I fully plan to turbo it as soon as it's out of warranty)
Been bouncing between building my own manifold vs just modding this one and running the EFR, or just add a wastegate to this manifold and run an ebay GT30. If I run the EFR I need a dual port wastegate can for it, and apparently it's really expensive for the EFR. Like, I could buy a new ebay turbo for less...
Also working on trans bellhousing, it's being a pain. I finished it, it doesn't' fit now cause it warped after welding... So going to reweld and remachine everything after the welding to get it fixed and working.
Been bouncing between building my own manifold vs just modding this one and running the EFR, or just add a wastegate to this manifold and run an ebay GT30. If I run the EFR I need a dual port wastegate can for it, and apparently it's really expensive for the EFR. Like, I could buy a new ebay turbo for less...
Also working on trans bellhousing, it's being a pain. I finished it, it doesn't' fit now cause it warped after welding... So going to reweld and remachine everything after the welding to get it fixed and working.
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01-04-2017, 08:57 PM
#1017
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Decided to run the CX Racing manifold with another ebay turbo. Same turbo as before, GT3076 ebay special, but with a .82 AR instead of the 0.63 AR. I'm betting with the new manifold, it will spool about the same as the log manifold did with a .63 AR, but both changes should be good for more top end power.
Ordered the turbo and another 38mm gate, still need to order a few other fittings and whatnot.
Question. The manifold is 304 Stainless, and I'm going to be building a mild steel 3" exhaust and gotta add a wastegate port to the manifold.
What is the best way to add a pipe for the wastegate? Can I weld mild steel to a stainless manifold, or is that a no-no? I have a stainless V-band for the gate so if needed, I can order some stainless tubing for the gate and make it all out of stainless to the gate, and then mild steel after. That way I'm clamping stainless to steel, not welding it. Or does it matter?
Ordered the turbo and another 38mm gate, still need to order a few other fittings and whatnot.
Question. The manifold is 304 Stainless, and I'm going to be building a mild steel 3" exhaust and gotta add a wastegate port to the manifold.
What is the best way to add a pipe for the wastegate? Can I weld mild steel to a stainless manifold, or is that a no-no? I have a stainless V-band for the gate so if needed, I can order some stainless tubing for the gate and make it all out of stainless to the gate, and then mild steel after. That way I'm clamping stainless to steel, not welding it. Or does it matter?
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01-04-2017, 09:02 PM
#1018
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The manifold is "304ss". If you want to add a mild steel wastegate pipe you need 309 filler rod.
Or stainless the whole way with stainless filler.
i would cut and fit everything then find a Tig welder who can stick it together for you.
Or stainless the whole way with stainless filler.
i would cut and fit everything then find a Tig welder who can stick it together for you.
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