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Old 03-27-2014, 11:29 AM   #601
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Please explain your conclusion with supporting facts, showing sources.
The Blue Cross and Blue Shield Association | Supporting the 37 Independent, Locally Operated Blue Cross and Blue Shield Companies | BCBS.com
https://www.google.com/finance?q=NYSE:WLP

100 million insured, by my math thats about 1 in 3 Americans. Now that they all SHALL (using that gov language) have health insurance, they have forced more customers into their roles. They canceled plans and jacked up prices to cover required services.

to be clear, its not just BCBS, but they are one of, if not, the biggest. Its hard to find accurate data quicky because of the idiotic rule of not buying across state lines, do there are like 100's of sites and stats.
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:33 AM   #602
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The Blue Cross and Blue Shield Association | Supporting the 37 Independent, Locally Operated Blue Cross and Blue Shield Companies | BCBS.com
https://www.google.com/finance?q=NYSE:WLP

100 million insured, by my math thats about 1 in 3 Americans. Now that they all SHALL (using that gov language) have health insurance, they have forced more customers into their roles. They canceled plans and jacked up prices to cover required services.

to be clear, its not just BCBS, but they are one of, if not, the biggest. Its hard to find accurate data quicky because of the idiotic rule of not buying across state lines, do there are like 100's of sites and stats.
They cancelled plans because they were no longer legal due to ACA. If they didn't do this, they were in deep ****.

They jacked up prices to cover required services because they were required to insure all these other previously un-insured and high risk Americans. If they didn't do this, they were in deep ****.


They STILL are mandated to pay out a certain percentage of every dollar directly for health services. That hasn't changed. The actual profit percentage is EXTREMELY low.

What constitutes "robbing the public and their customers blind," in this case, exactly?
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:44 AM   #603
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They cancelled plans because they were no longer legal due to ACA. If they didn't do this, they were in deep ****.

They jacked up prices to cover required services because they were required to insure all these other previously un-insured and high risk Americans. If they didn't do this, they were in deep ****.


They STILL are mandated to pay out a certain percentage of every dollar directly for health services. That hasn't changed. The actual profit percentage is EXTREMELY low.

What constitutes "robbing the public and their customers blind," in this case, exactly?
It is simply how I choose to quantify it.

.01% of a shitlaod is a **** load
17.1% of anaual GDP is HC
1/3 of that is BCBS
.01% of that is 95.843 BILLION dollars. I pulled that .01% # out my arsehole too....i bet its a higher number.

I'm not saying they are not entitles to profit, on the contrary I think profit movite is a good thing. HOWEVER, any increase in revenue=increase in profit for them with a fixed spending ratio on actual services. IE, they have no incentive to try and be more lean as a company.

We are gonna disagree on the ACA issue dude....i've kept up with this thread.

I'm also a global warming denier
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:46 AM   #604
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Ya, maybe some facts would be nice. I am a Canadian and if I want to see a doctor I either make an appointment with my family physician or go to one of the many walk-in clinics. Worst case you select a crappy time of day (4pm+) and wait a bit. The only area I can see some similarity is if you chose to go to a hospital without significant blood loss or broken bones. Then you are at the mercy of your level of priority and may die of exhaustion before you see a doctor.
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:49 AM   #605
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I doubt we're going to disagree on ACA, as i think ACA is a huge steaming pile of ****.

But what we are going to disagree on is how insurance is currently working and how it's regulated.

The percent of a shitload is a shitload thing is a GOOD thing for the insured. Why? More people = more risk. You NEED more profit out there to cover your incidentals. More profit = more surplus = we're perfectly able to pay a ton of $2mil hospital claims.


Fact: The top 5 insurers COMBINED profited $12.74 billion in 2013. That's hardly unreasonable.

I mean... unless you're communist or something.
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:51 AM   #606
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Ya, maybe some facts would be nice. I am a Canadian and if I want to see a doctor I either make an appointment with my family physician or go to one of the many walk-in clinics. Worst case you select a crappy time of day (4pm+) and wait a bit. The only area I can see some similarity is if you chose to go to a hospital without significant blood loss or broken bones. Then you are at the mercy of your level of priority and may die of exhaustion before you see a doctor.
the walk in clinics, as i recall, are technically illegal in canada. they choose to ignore the law (sounds familiar? yes?) rather than close them because the system is on the verge of collapse and sick people need care.
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Old 03-27-2014, 11:57 AM   #607
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I doubt we're going to disagree on ACA, as i think ACA is a huge steaming pile of ****.

But what we are going to disagree on is how insurance is currently working and how it's regulated.

The percent of a shitload is a shitload thing is a GOOD thing for the insured. Why? More people = more risk. You NEED more profit out there to cover your incidentals. More profit = more surplus = we're perfectly able to pay a ton of $2mil hospital claims.


Fact: The top 5 insurers COMBINED profited $12.74 billion in 2013. That's hardly unreasonable.

I mean... unless you're communist or something.
oh...well maybe we do agree.
I'm not suggesting the system was not a steaming pile of broken **** BEFORE the ACA....it was. too much regulation, lobbying, law, medicare regs, insurers doing whatever the hell they want...etc.

the system needs reform for sure...but I think the answer overall is less regulation not more.
Except for pre exisitng conditions. Thats a sticky one...not sure how to handle, however on one hand you cant have the guy that didn't have ins his whole life get cancer and then sign up and have everyone else pay for it....on the other you cant deny perfectly healthy people that, say have a congenital heart defect that is known but doesn't affect them day to day from getting basic *** HC.
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Old 03-27-2014, 12:48 PM   #608
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Fact: The top 5 insurers COMBINED profited $12.74 billion in 2013. That's hardly unreasonable.

I mean... unless you're communist or something.
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:03 PM   #609
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I am a Canadian and if I want to see a doctor I either make an appointment with my family physician or go to one of the many walk-in clinics.
So you pay cash?
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:05 PM   #610
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So you pay cash?

I think up there it's actually Monopoly money. Do we call that "cash?"
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Old 03-31-2014, 10:51 AM   #611
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Local couple upset after receiving pre-marked voter registration card from Covered California - 10News.com KGTV ABC10 San Diego



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A local couple called 10News concerned after they received an envelope from the state's Obamacare website, Covered California. Inside was a letter discussing voter registration and a registration card pre-marked with an "x" in the box next to Democratic Party.

The couple – who did not want their identity revealed – received the letter and voter registration card from their health insurance provider Covered California, the state-run agency that implements President Obama's Affordable Care Act.
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Wow! Thanks, Obamacare!-local_couple_upset_after_receiving_pre_m_1461510000_3879372_ver1.0_640_480.jpg  
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Old 03-31-2014, 10:53 AM   #612
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Healthcare.gov website application and enrollment system down on deadline day

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Hours before the deadline for enrolling, the online page for enrolling in Obamacare went down Monday.

The deadline is midnight Monday to sign up for private health insurance in the new online markets created by President Barack Obama's health-care law. So far, about 4 of every 5 people enrolling have qualified for tax credits to reduce the cost of their premiums.
how can that possibly be "deficit neutral"?

that's what they told us in 2009 at least: CBO: House healthcare bill is deficit neutral | TheHill
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Old 04-01-2014, 10:29 AM   #613
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Three Quarters of Enrollees in Obamacare to See Premiums Rise

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The Affordable Care Act, which the president promised would reduce the typical American family’s health insurance by $2,500 per year, has in fact raised insurance costs for three-quarters of Obamacare policy holders, according to the CEO of the Cleveland Clinic.

In June of 2008, Barack Obama promised, “It's time to bring down the typical family's premium by about $2,500. And it's time to bring down the costs for the entire country.” Moreover, four months later in October he said, “The only thing we're gonna try to do is lower costs so that those cost savings are passed on to you. And we estimate we can cut the average family's premium by about $2,500 a year.”
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:02 AM   #614
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“If it turns out that the overwhelming majority of the so-called 7.1 were people who had health insurance, liked their health insurance, were renewing their health insurance, and got kicked off their health insurance, whose lives are disrupted, premiums are raised, deductibles are raised, and lost their doctors are now among the 7.1 . . . it’s a net negative,” Krauthammer said.
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Old 04-02-2014, 11:03 AM   #615
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White House says 7 MILLION Obamacare enrollments, but study shows 858,000 | Mail Online

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The unpublished RAND study only the Los Angeles Times has seen it found that just 23 per cent of new enrollees had no insurance before signing up.

And of those newly insured Americans, just 53 per cent have paid their first month's premiums.

If those numbers hold, the actual net gain of paid policies among Americans who lacked medical insurance in the pre-Obamacare days would be just 858,298.
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Old 04-07-2014, 11:01 AM   #616
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Obamacare eclipses low-cost NJ health plan for middle-class kids | NJ.com

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While the federal government was trumpeting the benefits of Obamacare to boost enrollment earlier this year, about 1,800 families in New Jersey were receiving letters telling them their children would be losing their health coverage last week.

The Affordable Care Act — the federal law that mandates everyone have insurance — effectively killed FamilyCare Advantage, a low-cost option for kids in New Jersey created six years ago for parents who earned too much to qualify for Medicaid and other subsidized programs but too little to buy on a policy on their own. The state program was the first of its kind in the nation.

Horizon Blue Cross Blue Shield of New Jersey was the only insurance carrier that agreed to offer the FamilyCare Advantage plan, which covered most medical, dental and vision needs for the relative bargain of $144 a month per child.

But it didn’t offer mental health treatment and several other services Obamacare requires, and that was the fatal flaw, said Sen. Joseph Vitale (D-Middlesex), who sponsored the law creating the program.

Vitale said he tried for several months to broker a deal between Horizon and the U.S. Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, but neither side could agree on how to make it affordable and legal. The program ended last week.
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Old 04-24-2014, 04:00 PM   #617
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Brain Surgery Patient's Obamacare Plan Denies Meds, Drops Doctors

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Margaret Figueroa signed up for Obamacare when the plan she liked was canceled. Despite being told that her plan would cover her longstanding doctors and medicines, Figueroa's Obamacare plan denied her medications and dropped all her doctors. In three months, Figueroa said she dropped 22 pounds and endured excruciating pain.

On Wednesday, Staten Island Advance reporter Tracey Porpora, who originally broke the story, said Figueroa's doctor of several years, Dr. Germaine Rowe, intervened and offered free services. Dr. Rowe says she will continue to offer the pro-bono help until the provider of the Obamacare plan Figueroa purchased sorts out the confusion surrounding why EmblemHealth has yet to accept her application.
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Old 04-29-2014, 02:05 PM   #618
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Old 04-29-2014, 02:08 PM   #619
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“This only works, for example, if young people show up… We’ve got to have them in the pools, because otherwise all these projected low costs cannot be held if older people with preexisting conditions are disproportionately represented in any given state.” - President Bill Clinton
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Old 07-22-2014, 11:51 AM   #620
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whoops.

Appeals court strikes down key part of Obamacare - CNN.com

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Washington (CNN) -- In a dramatic blow to a key Obamacare program, a federal appeals court ruled Tuesday that individuals cannot use tax credits or subsidies to buy health insurance on federally run exchanges.

The divided three-judge panel said those cost-sharing subsidies can be used only through state-run health exchanges, not the federal exchanges.

The court's decision could make it harder to ensure affordable coverage for millions in the 34 states that have chosen not to set up their own regulated health insurance marketplaces.

The administration is expected to appeal the ruling.
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