Turbo setup for rally cross/autocross - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


DIY Turbo Discussion greddy on a 1.8? homebrew kit?

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-13-2013, 04:59 PM   #21
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Mobius's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 3,178
Total Cats: 262
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EO2K View Post
I can't think of anyone who is actually running a C30-74 flat out in a 1.8 Miata and has a dyno plot to go with it.
Bellwilliam hasn't posted the dyno plot, but he said that without the moderate restrictor they were running, his car went to 280 at the wheels.

OP: screw budgets. Pull your 401k and your IRAs (which you, as a smart young man, have been contributing to right?) and go LS swap. All the torquez!
Mobius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 06:59 PM   #22
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheV's View Post
Wow, thanks everybody for your thoughts, Frank and Beans, yes, it's Mark V ! - I still have front fenders for you if you want them ??

So it looks like either a M62 SC or some small turbo would be a good way to go. Jon, I can't tell if 180-200 is a good recommended goal or if you just don't want me to beat you ?? ..... But you are right, I'm not too hung up on peak HP anyways, lots of instant usable torque with fast throttle response is what I need.

So if I look at the Turbo recommendations for a minute it looks like they are all small ball bearing turbos - since I don't have an endless budget which one gives me the best smiles/dollar factor ?
- and is there a theory on what of the components to spend your money on - for instance is it better to spend it on engine management v turbo v manifolds v BOV's etc etc ?

Thanks again for the many responses, this is a great forum !
Mark,

Welcome to the forum. You've definitely come to the right place to find the information you're looking for.

Perhaps you can give us some more specifics. You've mentioned low-budget, but not HOW low. You also haven't elaborated on your fab skills or shop abilities.

Have you ridden in a boosted Miata? If you want to know what 250whp in a Miata feels like, come out to Saline on a nice day (if we get one soon...) and come for a ride in my car. If you want to know what 200whp feels like, contact Erat and he may take you for a ride (he's on the outskirts of Detroit and has a very, very well done FM2 car, but he's put it up for the winter).

You're gonna need engine management, and I think MS offers the best blend of affordability and tunability with great support. figure $500 or so for this. You'll need this whichever way you go.

From here, top tier would be an MP62 for your needs. Instant power, and you'll be able to make your power goals. It ain't gonna be cheap though, 2-3k minimum I would think.

Second choice would be a small ball-bearing turbo. You could find a good used one probably in the $4-500 range, then buy a manifold for another $250-400 and fab a downpipe or so. Either way, for the turbo hardwares plus intercooler and stuff you could squeak under $1500 I would think.

Third choice would be a used small journal bearing turbo. This will spool very very quickly, but not quite as quickly as the small ball-bearing turbo. There's a great turbo setup for a 1.6 for sale in the classifieds right now: ARTech manifold, greddy turbo, etc and it's really really affordable. If your budget is low low, I would go this route because you're getting some quality parts for crazy prices, and that's a great manifold.

This is my take on it. Good luck!
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 08:33 PM   #23
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
Erat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 4,196
Total Cats: 260
Default

I'll give you a ride come spring if you can wait.

I'd have to agree with the MP62, if it's in your budget. It's going to be a bit more expensive than a DIY turbo setup.

Now as far as turbo's go, i'd have to suggest a cast manifold with locking hardware. Just completely eliminating as many welds as possible is probably your best bet for reliability. Cast manifold, cast turndown on a gt2554 will net you quick spool. It's not a V8, and you're not drag racing you don't need to make boost at 2000rpm.

Run Megasquirt.
Erat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 09:02 PM   #24
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,847
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

are you guys really suggesting a rotrex?
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 09:11 PM   #25
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
are you guys really suggesting a rotrex?
No. Somebody did and they have been dealt with accordingly.
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 09:56 PM   #26
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,175
Total Cats: 2,575
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
are you guys really suggesting a rotrex?
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbofan View Post
No. Somebody did and they have been dealt with accordingly.
OP comes in here and says he has VERY modest power goals, wants maximum control, and rock solid reliability when abusing the car on gravel roads and what-not.

Please tell me what about the rotrex doesn't fit those goals.

School me.
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:08 PM   #27
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

He also mentioned cost. Rotrex pretty spendy, no?
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:15 PM   #28
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,175
Total Cats: 2,575
Default

Yeah, and then also mentioned he wants lowend torque (which makes no sense to me since the car is just going to spin/slide like he 1st said).

Its whatever. Just trying to give honest input. A heaton will be just as spendy. The FFS crap is like 4 grand lol
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:24 PM   #29
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

Yeah... I think most important question is what his budget really is. If he can't afford even a used SC kit then there's not much point in figuring out which is best.
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:40 PM   #30
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Michigan
Posts: 195
Total Cats: 5
Default

I'm budgeting around 3k, but that has to include an engine rebuild, clutch, possible lightened flywheel. I'm thinking something around 1500-2k would be a good assumption.
TheV's is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:41 PM   #31
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,175
Total Cats: 2,575
Default

lol

good luck with that
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:44 PM   #32
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheV's View Post
I'm budgeting around 3k, but that has to include an engine rebuild, clutch, possible lightened flywheel. I'm thinking something around 1500-2k would be a good assumption.
I think it might be doable. You'll need to go turbo though, and used parts. Look at the artech Greddy kit in the classifieds. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but that seems like a super solid, affordable option.
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 10:51 PM   #33
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Michigan
Posts: 195
Total Cats: 5
Default

Thanks, and to answer you're other question, I can wrench, mild fab skills but have friends who can do it nicer...
TheV's is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 11:38 PM   #34
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 111
Total Cats: 8
Default

Turbo+injector in exhaust manifold. Done.
Vilko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 12:04 AM   #35
Junior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On, Canada
Posts: 81
Total Cats: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vitamin j View Post
Can't Megasquirt run anti-lag? That'd be sick.
yes it can and will do it very well. and if its a rally cross car it needs!! anti lag!!
uavjeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 09:41 AM   #36
Boost Czar
iTrader: (61)
 
Braineack's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Chantilly, VA
Posts: 72,847
Total Cats: 1,788
Default

I'd run a FFS kit over a rotrex.
Braineack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 11:06 AM   #37
Moderator
iTrader: (11)
 
sixshooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 15,662
Total Cats: 1,560
Default

If your budget is that modest I would suggest a used manifold, inconel hardware, and an ebay journal bearing turbo of the equivalent size to the 2554. You could pick up the ebay turbo brand new for $200-250. Or you could take your chances with a used gt25 (same size, different name for it) from a Nissan SR20($50-125 depending on quality) and/or rebuild one. Rebuild kits are $40-50 on ebay.

Rebuilding the engine will cost you a minimum of $1800 with forged rods, pistons, Boundary Engineering oil pump, gaskets and machining. A MegaSquirt will set you back $400-800 depending on what and where you get it once you add an IAT and such. Wideband O2 will be $150ish. You will need injectors and they aren't free, either. It adds up quick.
sixshooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 01:07 PM   #38
Junior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Michigan
Posts: 195
Total Cats: 5
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
If your budget is that modest I would suggest a used manifold, inconel hardware, and an ebay journal bearing turbo of the equivalent size to the 2554. You could pick up the ebay turbo brand new for $200-250. Or you could take your chances with a used gt25 (same size, different name for it) from a Nissan SR20($50-125 depending on quality) and/or rebuild one. Rebuild kits are $40-50 on ebay.

Rebuilding the engine will cost you a minimum of $1800 with forged rods, pistons, Boundary Engineering oil pump, gaskets and machining. A MegaSquirt will set you back $400-800 depending on what and where you get it once you add an IAT and such. Wideband O2 will be $150ish. You will need injectors and they aren't free, either. It adds up quick.
Sounds good - but at what HP do I need forged Rods - I thought I would be OK with stock internals if I stayed under 200 - 250 hp ??
TheV's is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 01:11 PM   #39
I take big bites
iTrader: (1)
 
turbofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hurricane, UT
Posts: 6,924
Total Cats: 526
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheV's View Post
Sounds good - but at what HP do I need forged Rods - I thought I would be OK with stock internals if I stayed under 200 - 250 hp ??
If you're running the car hard/racing, you'll want forged rods. Why rebuild the engine and NOT put in good stuff? You can get good forged rods for $300...
turbofan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 03:43 PM   #40
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Mobius's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 3,178
Total Cats: 262
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbofan View Post
If you're running the car hard/racing, you'll want forged rods. Why rebuild the engine and NOT put in good stuff? You can get good forged rods for $300...
+1. Why take it apart and not put good rods in it. Stock rods seem to be safe to 200wtq, probably ok to 225ish, in mortal danger above that, for street cars. For your intended usage, go ahead and do the rods.
Mobius is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Project Gemini - Turbo Civic on the Cheap Full_Tilt_Boogie Build Threads 57 07-19-2017 05:11 PM
WTB MP62 (Hotside) (NB2) Rick02R WTB 3 01-03-2016 08:18 PM
ISO 1.6 turbo cast iron manifold cale saurage DIY Turbo Discussion 16 10-01-2015 12:25 PM
Leaky Wilwoods mx592 Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 1 10-01-2015 01:45 AM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:14 AM.