Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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-   -   Trackspeed Stage 2 VVT shortblock, EFR6758, E85, 452whp/427wtq@26psi. I'm scared. (https://www.miataturbo.net/dynos-timesheets-21/trackspeed-stage-2-vvt-shortblock-efr6758-e85-452whp-427wtq%4026psi-im-scared-95108/)

TurboTim 11-14-2017 02:22 PM

mapping boost target to TPS is the first step.

nitrodann 11-14-2017 04:23 PM

110%, against RPM so you can tailor the torque curve at each throttle position.

Savington 11-14-2017 05:46 PM

This much power would be unusable without TPS-mapped boost targets.

DeerHunter 11-14-2017 06:11 PM

I've always preferred non-TPS-mapped boost targets (my old '93 Audi S4 annoyed me with a poorly-implemented OEM version of the concept). I know I'm slumming it with a GT3071R but, with the stroker, it's not exactly torque-deprived. So far, knock on wood, I've been able to keep it shiny side up - a benefit, I guess, of having decent gearing for the application. I'd imagine coupling my '93 powertrain and MSM 6-speed would result in an, uh, energetic combination.

codrus 11-14-2017 06:22 PM

I really like TPS-based boost targets, but it does require a wastegate that's capable of accurate control across a broad range of boost levels and rock solid EBC tuning.

--Ian

sonofthehill 11-14-2017 06:46 PM

Luckily my right foot is finely calibrated, it has 2 maps, psycho and grandparent.

Leafy 11-15-2017 08:47 PM

Wait theres people that dont use TPS based boost targets? Its like essential to making a turbo car not drive like its from the 80s at anything other than full throttle.

ms traction control really needs to allow fuel cut without having to mod the firmware. It also needs to understand 4 wheel speed inputs so that it can act like the racelogic and be magical when in corners.

DeerHunter 11-15-2017 10:19 PM


Originally Posted by Leafy (Post 1451949)
Wait theres people that dont use TPS based boost targets? Its like essential to making a turbo car not drive like its from the 80s at anything other than full throttle.

I dunno - I like the elastic throttle response that gives me thiiiiiiiis much surge by flexing my toes just a tad.


Originally Posted by Leafy (Post 1451949)
ms traction control really needs to allow fuel cut without having to mod the firmware. It also needs to understand 4 wheel speed inputs so that it can act like the racelogic and be magical when in corners.

This thread tangent caused me to research replicating Racelogic-like traction control with a Hydra. I found this:


The Hydra cannot read four wheel speed sensors directly as these inputs require special filtering and an edge sensing processor input such as those used by the trigger and sync inputs. The edge sensing processor inputs are all assigned and allocated on the current Hydra boards. The firmware could be easily changed, but the required hardware is simply not there.
I wonder if MS has similar hardware limitations.

Arca_ex 11-16-2017 12:17 AM

Time to get a Motec and use g-force and four wheel speed indexed traction control strategies.

codrus 11-16-2017 01:12 AM


Originally Posted by DeerHunter (Post 1451966)
I wonder if MS has similar hardware limitations.

Possibly, but a $75 TinyIox would solve that.

--Ian

TheBandit 11-16-2017 03:15 PM

Excellent results! I hope that the 6258 will be able to provide a 75% solution what you have been able to achieve with the 6758. :bigtu:

oreo 11-26-2017 08:58 AM

Wow, very impressive results! Congrats.
This definitely confirms that the trackspeed parts can yield top numbers over a wide rpm range.
That 3-4Krpm torque ramp looks both scary and LOL inducing. It must be a blast.

Question -what duty cycle are you running on the wastegate up near redline? Is the 6758 nearly maxed out or is there more?

Savington 11-26-2017 08:22 PM


Originally Posted by oreo (Post 1453502)
Wow, very impressive results! Congrats.
This definitely confirms that the trackspeed parts can yield top numbers over a wide rpm range.
That 3-4Krpm torque ramp looks both scary and LOL inducing. It must be a blast.

Thanks :) The confirmation that the parts can make big power was one of the goals of the build. All the theory said they would do it, and prior similar builds (specifically Soviet, whose car this build plan was roughly based on) have been here, but it's nice to know for sure.


Question -what duty cycle are you running on the wastegate up near redline? Is the 6758 nearly maxed out or is there more?
My 260kpa targets are ~60%DC, 280kpa was ~70%DC. This is with a Turbosmart actuator, 14psi base springs, running in single-port config with the standard 3-port valve. I do have a 4-port setup that I will play with at some point. The turbo showed no indication of being out of breath at 450whp, but to get more than 26psi with a smooth curve would require more base WG spring or a 4-port setup.

The more I think about what's next for this project, the more I think that it's probably worthwhile to pick up a set of ID1300s, add the 4-port setup and the new clutch, and try to crack the 500whp mark with the existing hardware.

ridethecliche 11-26-2017 08:52 PM


Originally Posted by Savington (Post 1453581)
The more I think about what's next for this project, the more I think that it's probably worthwhile to pick up a set of ID1300s, add the 4-port setup and the new clutch, and try to crack the 500whp mark with the existing hardware.

And then go race SOTH, right?

sonofthehill 11-27-2017 09:31 PM

We got 'til March

codrus 11-27-2017 10:42 PM


Originally Posted by sonofthehill (Post 1453836)
We got 'til March

Any guesses how many 500hp drag strip passes it would take to lunch Savington's transmission? :)

--Ian

ridethecliche 11-27-2017 11:58 PM


Originally Posted by codrus (Post 1453854)
Any guesses how many 500hp drag strip passes it would take to lunch Savington's transmission? :)

--Ian

That depends.

Will he be on all seasons too?

sonofthehill 11-28-2017 12:19 AM

I already agreed to help with launching, and it is a street car. I bet we don't get enough passes to break it.

Savington 12-05-2017 11:22 PM

I will definitely take it to the strip with Carlos sometime in the spring. Will grab a set of slicks, either 23x8.5s or 24.5x8.5s, to get the car off the line and keep the driveline alive. It's a lofty goal, but if I can get the car to leave in the 1.7 60ft neighborhood on the slicks, it should dip into the 10s at 130-135mph. Sounds ridiculous but everything I've read says it's an obtainable goal. I do want to tweak a few things first, though. Planning to add a Radium fuel rail and ID1300s, swap up to 450/300# springs, and get the 4-port EBC set up. With the 4-port valve and 1300s I should be able to safely run in the 280-290kpa range.

matrussell122 12-05-2017 11:26 PM


Originally Posted by Savington (Post 1455370)
I will definitely take it to the strip with Carlos sometime in the spring. Will grab a set of slicks, either 23x8.5s or 24.5x8.5s, to get the car off the line and keep the driveline alive. It's a lofty goal, but if I can get the car to leave in the 1.7 60ft neighborhood on the slicks, it should dip into the 10s at 130-135mph. Sounds ridiculous but everything I've read says it's an obtainable goal. I do want to tweak a few things first, though. Planning to add a Radium fuel rail and ID1300s, swap up to 450/300# springs, and get the 4-port EBC set up. With the 4-port valve and 1300s I should be able to safely run in the 280-290kpa range.


Ill buy the ID1000s off you if you want to sell them


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