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Old 07-09-2014, 02:34 PM   #1
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Default My NA 1.8 NA made 110/102. Input?

Logs and tune will come later, I'm at work and mulling over my dyno visit yesterday...

First off, here's my current mod list:

SM 1.8 block (presumed balanced)
99 head
99 intake manifold
Ex-Intake mod
Shaving Seconds custom-built header with matched primaries
Shaving Seconds custom-built 2.5" exhaust to twinloop eBay muffler
AriBuilt intake and cold air box (filter behind driver's headlight)
Toyota COP conversion

the car IS tuned. I started off on 99mx5's old NA (he's EFR'd now) fuel and ignition maps that he'd already spent some time tweaking, as his old NA setup is similar to mine. We probably have an additional (combined) 3 hours or so fine-tuning my VE table, both cruising around town and making adjustments while at the track. The plot you see below is of my CURRENT tune, which isn't "finalized" but up until yesterday we both thought was pretty solid. I know my VE could use some small tweaks and I'm pretty sure he flashed it before we loaded the car back on the trailer after seeing the plot freak out from 6k on. I'd venture to guess (read:hope) that the secret to my low hp is in the spark tables but we won't know until they get posted later tonight.



I made 110/102, which isn't really not really what I was expecting based off of the "Super Miata 140whp mod path"...

99-05 cylinder head or complete engine. 100% stock (Mine has a "better" intake cam)
Generic exhaust header. Racing Beat is recommended (check)
Generic high flow exhaust and cat delete. Racing Beat, Borla XR-1 and Flowmaster are good options (check)
DIY or aftermarket intake pipe and cone filter (check)
Programmable engine management computer (ECU) and a good tune (check)
91 octane pump gas (check)


Here's the Super Miata Dynojet sheet you've all seen:



Obviously there's a lot of variables in dyinoing vehicles and I get that... It's probably worth mentioning that It was 95-100* ambient, they only had 1 fan airflow and we left the lid on the air box for both pulls but even still, I don't think I'm crazy when I say that I should be putting down just as much as your basic Super Miata though...

9mx5 logged both pulls, my AFRs were on point but I do think there's more exploring to me done with my current setup but ****, could there be ~20whp hidden in there?



-Concerned member
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My NA 1.8 NA made 110/102. Input?-ccde83c7-1274-4ff0-805c-0f76ea50ba9f_zpstbts9eq2.jpg   My NA 1.8 NA made 110/102. Input?-supermiata_sample_dyno_2014.jpg  

Last edited by Stock; 07-09-2014 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:37 PM   #2
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Your cr is 9.1, isn't emilio's car higher than that?

Otherwise lets see that tune. Its not bad but I agree that you should be making a bit more.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:39 PM   #3
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Afr's looked good, although I think there's a bit more power with mid to low 12s. Looks like you're at a solid 13?

What kind of timing table did you end up with? How much did you adjust timing by, and what was the before/after result?
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
Your cr is 9.1, isn't emilio's car higher than that?

Otherwise lets see that tune. Its not bad but I agree that you should be making a bit more.
I thought I was 9.5:1? Should be an NA 1.8 block with the block and head being within factory specs - not milled all crazy or anything.

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Afr's looked good, although I think there's a bit more power with mid to low 12s. Looks like you're at a solid 13?

What kind of timing table did you end up with? How much did you adjust timing by, and what was the before/after result?
You aren't seeing my AFRs, they don't show on my chart?

I'll see if Ari can upload my logs and my tune after lunch.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:44 PM   #5
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:53 PM   #6
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9.1 is na 1.8
9.5 is 99-00
10 is 01+
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:55 PM   #7
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I do see your AFRs, and the dotted line appears to be a straight shot at 13.0:1 AFRs. Your run stays easily above that until 6750rpm, when you're finally right at 13.0:1.

If it were me, and I were someone that's dyno'd a 125hp stock 1.6 with MS, I'd keep your sub 4-4500rpm fuel map, but richen 4-4500 to 6000rpm to around 12.5, and 6000-red line to around 12.

I'll ask again, what'd you change with your timing, and what were the before/after results? A log won't tell me this, unless it includes both runs.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:55 PM   #8
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Quote:
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9.1 is na 1.8
9.5 is 99-00
10 is 01+
Frick.

For sure shaving this head as close to 12:1 as I can when it comes off next.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:58 PM   #9
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What?

Are you saying shaving a head will change your afrs? It won't.

Are you saying shaving a head will get you close to 12:1 CR? It won't.
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:02 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
What?

Are you saying shaving a head will change your afrs? It won't.

Are you saying shaving a head will get you close to 12:1 CR? It won't.
What?

No, I'm not saying shaving my head will change AFRs, where the **** did you get that from??

Yes, I'm saying I'll shave the head to get AS CLOSE TO 12:1 as possible, meaning shave as much as is safe off of the head (.080" I believe)
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curly View Post
I do see your AFRs, and the dotted line appears to be a straight shot at 13.0:1 AFRs. Your run stays easily above that until 6750rpm, when you're finally right at 13.0:1.

If it were me, and I were someone that's dyno'd a 125hp stock 1.6 with MS, I'd keep your sub 4-4500rpm fuel map, but richen 4-4500 to 6000rpm to around 12.5, and 6000-red line to around 12.

I'll ask again, what'd you change with your timing, and what were the before/after results? A log won't tell me this, unless it includes both runs.
I did no get tuned on the dyno, never stated nor implied that. I simply strapped down and did two pulls yesterday for classing purposes.

And I'm sorry, where on my dyno image are you seeing my AFRs?
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:05 PM   #12
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sounds like you need 10.5+ in your life
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:06 PM   #13
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I feel like Curly might be under the impression that the Super Miata dyno is my second pull?
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:07 PM   #14
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Quote:
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sounds like you need 10.5+ in your life
In a very real, very bad way. I'm realistically planning an 01 block, shaved 99 head, AE101 ITBs and E85 next year but that doesn't mean that my current results don't irk me a bit.
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:21 PM   #15
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Compression/leakdown test? Start with the basics.
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:23 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stock View Post
I feel like Curly might be under the impression that the Super Miata dyno is my second pull?
yeah, seems like he doesn't get it.

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Old 07-09-2014, 03:33 PM   #17
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I think its worthwhile to bold this part as another really big reason you're low on power
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I did no get tuned on the dyno, never stated nor implied that. I simply strapped down and did two pulls yesterday for classing purposes.
If you're untuned, you can't even compare plots with the supermiata plot until you are
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:55 PM   #18
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Well if you didn't do any tuning, it mean you're on the super conservative base spark map, and that's where you'll make power. If your timing was set right, I'd expect 10-15hp from proper spark timing and a little extra fuel.

And no, I realize Emilio is the one with 137hp, not you.
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Old 07-09-2014, 04:14 PM   #19
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Holy ****, I honestly didn't think I needed to be so specific and I do apologize. I'll edit the first post, my bad guys.

I know y'all are just trying to help.
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Old 07-09-2014, 04:41 PM   #20
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Edited first post to hopefully be more helpful.

Sorry again.
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