The "dietary fat/cholesterol causes heart disease" myth - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Insert BS here A place to discuss anything you want

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-17-2013, 10:42 PM   #1
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,454
Total Cats: 80
Default The "dietary fat/cholesterol causes heart disease" myth

The theory that dietary fat and/or cholesterol causes heart disease was based on completely fudged data and then the data fudger got on the board of the American Heart Association. After that, armies of researchers kept on looking for supporting data and throwing away contradictory data. This went on for >40 years. Incredible.

What is so shocking about all this isn't that one guy falsified data; it's that for decades the mainstream research establishment never corrected the mistake. Armies of researchers kept looking for supporting evidence and dismissed evidence that falsified the initial hypothesis. And then the gov't put its weight behind the theory. The rest is history... of the bad "eat low fat" advice, and the resulting increasing rates of obesity, diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, and possibly cancer.

The fudger was Ancel Keys, the study was the "7 countries study", which showed a direct correlation between % of fat calories, and heart disease rates. The fudge? He hid the data from 15 other countries which didn't show the correlation.

Some of the details of the sham are discussed here:
314: Chris Masterjohn On The Health Benefits Of Cholesterol | The Livin La Vida Low-Carb Show

A shorter article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/09/sc...pagewanted=all

Last edited by JasonC SBB; 09-18-2013 at 12:04 PM.
JasonC SBB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2013, 11:18 PM   #2
NB/VVT Connoisseur
iTrader: (23)
 
viperormiata's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Key West
Posts: 6,071
Total Cats: 253
Default

My coworkers tell me I'm killing myself with a high fat diet.

Down 130lbs and still making huge gains in the gym while running 6 minute miles at over 200lbs, lol.

The "lipid hypothesis" is the biggest load of horseshit and it sucks to see so many people struggling with weight when they are being told that low calorie, low fat is the way to do it. Getting sucked into these "diet" plans of awful, pre-made food that's all filler, super low calorie, but jacked in sodium and horrible carbs. They eventually starve themselves from a huge calorie restriction/deficit and proceed to burn muscle at an alarming rate and either put it all back on or end up looking like pudding.
viperormiata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 01:38 AM   #3
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,454
Total Cats: 80
Default

There are 2 distinct but related, old hypotheses:

- The "blood lipid" hypothesis: blood lipid causes atherosclerosis and heart disease

- The "dietary fat" hypothesis: dietary fat and/or cholesterol causes heart disease

Both are false.
JasonC SBB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 01:48 AM   #4
Junior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 381
Total Cats: -13
Default

Love fat.
Dot3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 09:40 AM   #5
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Enjoyed reading this thread while eating my breakfast of eggs, bacon, and coffee with coconut oil.
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 12:03 PM   #6
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,454
Total Cats: 80
Default

LOLz. When I get up in the morning, I look forward to having a nice cup of said bulletproof coffee.
JasonC SBB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 12:13 PM   #7
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
miata2fast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Dover, FL
Posts: 2,895
Total Cats: 109
Default

Steak and eggs this morning. Yum.
miata2fast is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 01:00 PM   #8
y8s
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
 
y8s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,038
Total Cats: 407
Default

have been ignoring fat content for years and have the great cholesterol numbers to prove it. I never eat low fat anything unless forced.

ok not ignoring trans fats, just avoiding those.

As far as cholesterol causing X Y Z, can't an autopsy show if there's crap in your arteries and determine what it is?
y8s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 01:47 PM   #9
Elite Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,284
Total Cats: 178
Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonC SBB View Post
The theory that dietary fat and/or cholesterol causes heart disease was based on completely fudged data and then the data fudger got on the board of the American Heart Association. After that, armies of researchers kept on looking for supporting data and throwing away contradictory data. This went on for >40 years. Incredible.
This is why you can't leave science to private enterprise.
Scrappy Jack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 01:55 PM   #10
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Attached Thumbnails
The "dietary fat/cholesterol causes heart disease" myth-seriously-bro-troll-harder.jpg  
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 02:47 PM   #11
Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shelton, CT
Posts: 672
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonC SBB View Post
LOLz. When I get up in the morning, I look forward to having a nice cup of said bulletproof coffee.
The bulletproof coffee thing sounds like complete nonsense. The key nonsense being avoiding "toxins" or "detoxing" which has no basis in science at all.

The guy seems to be trading off the same rap of another nonsense guru, that being Timothy Ferriss.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 02:57 PM   #12
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
The bulletproof coffee thing sounds like complete nonsense. The key nonsense being avoiding "toxins" or "detoxing" which has no basis in science at all.
LULWUT?

You think toxins are imaginary?
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:03 PM   #13
Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shelton, CT
Posts: 672
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgeoffriau View Post
LULWUT?

You think toxins are imaginary?
Not sure if serious. The whole detoxing thing is complete nonsense. Detox diets, colon cleansing all of a piece.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:09 PM   #14
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
Not sure if serious. The whole detoxing thing is complete nonsense. Detox diets, colon cleansing all of a piece.
That's not what I asked.

You said avoiding toxins has no basis in science. I'm asking if you believe toxins exist or not. Are there things that, if ingested or absorbed by the body, are detrimental to one's health?
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:13 PM   #15
Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shelton, CT
Posts: 672
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgeoffriau View Post
That's not what I asked.

You said avoiding toxins has no basis in science. I'm asking if you believe toxins exist or not. Are there things that, if ingested or absorbed by the body, are detrimental to one's health?
No, that's not what I said, I said avoiding "toxins" as in the things that these guys label as such that aren't really anything like real toxins. It's a scare tactic that has no basis in science.

Is it just a coincidence that this guy has labeled normal coffee as having "toxins" and sells a line of coffee that does not have these "toxins?"
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:15 PM   #16
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
No, that's not what I said, I said avoiding "toxins" as in the things that these guys label as such that aren't really anything like real toxins. It's a scare tactic that has no basis in science.
Are mycotoxins real or imaginary?
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:22 PM   #17
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

Attached Thumbnails
The "dietary fat/cholesterol causes heart disease" myth-orbea_orca_gold_dura_ace_5.jpg  
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:23 PM   #18
Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shelton, CT
Posts: 672
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgeoffriau View Post
Are mycotoxins real or imaginary?
All of these pseudoscience gurus attach some factual element to their nonsense, because it sounds better when they peddle their wares.

The first answer here sums up my thoughts about this guy and what he is peddling.

food safety - Are fungal toxins a significant problem in coffee, and if so, can they be avoided? - Seasoned Advice

I'm sure this will not convince you at all as you obviously have a significant defense mechanism built up around the mycotoxin topic.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:33 PM   #19
Crumple Zone Tester
iTrader: (7)
 
mgeoffriau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 7,656
Total Cats: 447
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harv View Post
I'm sure this will not convince you at all as you obviously have a significant defense mechanism built up around the mycotoxin topic.
Not really; for what it's worth, I don't buy his coffee (though I do buy very freshly roasted beans from a source I trust).

Mostly I just find the overly-reductionistic approach common to those stuck in a 1950's health and nutrition mindset to be generally irritating.

But it's funny that you essentially missed the reason Jason linked to that post -- it has nothing to do with toxicity or detoxing.
mgeoffriau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2013, 03:40 PM   #20
Senior Member
iTrader: (4)
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Shelton, CT
Posts: 672
Total Cats: 2
Default

The fact that he adds oil and butter to the coffee? I got that, but the site is still nonsense.
Harv is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Noob from Fort Worth, Texas checking in. Miatabro Meet and Greet 7 09-11-2015 01:13 PM
New here, saying hi, here's what I'm workin with. SuperSneakySecretSquirrel Meet and Greet 5 09-06-2015 09:30 PM
The Benefits of Datalogging (or, How I Spent My Summer Vacation) SJPatMarcy90RMcCartin Race Prep 52 01-27-2011 04:31 PM
agree or disagree? delcbr DIY Turbo Discussion 3 01-22-2011 09:42 PM
Detroit 2008: The Heart of the King, the LS9 is born! levnubhin Insert BS here 23 02-21-2009 03:44 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:21 PM.