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Old 10-06-2010, 09:58 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by weezerfan5487 View Post
This car doesn't get as good mpg because it produces zero emmisions.
It has an internal combustion engine. The only time it makes zero emissions is when it's parked.

And, as redfred18t pointed out, just manufacturing one of those damn things requires strip-mining an area the size of Manitoba to produce enough nickel / lithium / whatever to make the battery, releases a bajillion tons of toxic waste into the ocean, kills 50 baby seals, and consumes enough energy to power the city of Córdoba, Spain for a thousand years.





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Originally Posted by kotomile View Post
feature/safety bloat has had an impact.
(...)
coddle its operator in airbags if there's a crash,
Have you weighed an airbag? Maybe 5 lbs including the housing and cover. I don't know how many the CR-z has- maybe 6. That's 30 lbs, plus maybe another 15 lbs of wiring and sensors.


Quote:
it needs a "bitchin'" stereo, etc. etc.
Another 25 lbs over the stereo system in the CRX maybe?

Energy-absorbing bumpers and their plastic covers are light as hell. They probably weigh less than the old ones. We'll call it a draw.

So that's 70 lbs accounted for. Still 780 lbs unexplained.



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Originally Posted by 18psi View Post
Is it slow? omfg hell yes. thats one of the things I hate about it. a prius is 100 times faster.
I rented a Nissan Altima hybrid a few weeks ago. I was really quite surprised at hos fast it was off the line. If you've got a full battery charge, the combined power of the gas engine and the electric motor really puts you back in your seat.

Of course, it handled like it had a dead zebra strapped to the roof. And that car doesn't even have the ultra-hard runflat tires inflated to eleventy-hundred PSI that the Prius comes with.




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Originally Posted by mgeoffriau View Post
I owned a 1991 CRX HF. Make no mistake, it was an absolute dog...no torque, no revs, and geared pretty long. BUT --

I averaged 49 mpg driving 80-82 mph on an 800ish mile roadtrip with me, a passenger, and the back full of our stuff
I know how to fix this. Add a tiny little turbo, electronically wastegated to achieve bypass any time TPS is less than a certain threshold.

Seriously. Build a decent directed-flow manifold, use a two-stage injector system (100cc primaries for idle and cruise, with larger secondaries for acceleration) and I'll bet you could achieve the same mileage as the N/A version when not in boost, and yet not have to deal with being passed by motorhomes and school busses on freeway on-ramps. This ain't rocket science.
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:02 AM   #42
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Still 780 lbs unexplained.
That is accounted for in extra legroom for my *****.
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:16 AM   #43
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Still 780 lbs unexplained.
battery weighs at least a couple hundo
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:40 AM   #44
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All I can say is... Big Oil. That's the reason for everything.Alo, I'd LOVE to tell half the CEOs of these auto companies to get cancer and die because all they do is twiddle about and feed the generic, ignorant consumer a line of bullshit....all while the hands of oil companies are in their pockets.

"Hi! We have developed this new "Hybrid" SUV. We have used all of our advancements in technology to develop the best systems. This great new SUV now gets 18mpg on the highway!"

Yeah...**** you...I've been able to get mid-30's on mpg in my Miata. **** your "hybrid" SUV. Even with my trailer hooked up, instantly giving me much more cargo capacity than ANY suv, I get better mpg.

Couple that with the typical greedy fatass American who must have the biggest pile of **** they can get. Auto makers respond by making a larger and larger car, but making tiny improvements in economy. Because of these over-sized shitbuckets, crash safety has to be improved for everyone else...leading to heavier and bigger "small" cars. This is really an America-specific problem. How many small, diesel cars are available in Europe that get 60-70mpg? Many. It can be done here, but a combination of greedy fatass lemmings and greedy cancer-deserving oil executives will keep it from happening. "Efficent" vehicles here are a joke.
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:51 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
I know how to fix this. Add a tiny little turbo, electronically wastegated to achieve bypass any time TPS is less than a certain threshold.

Seriously. Build a decent directed-flow manifold, use a two-stage injector system (100cc primaries for idle and cruise, with larger secondaries for acceleration) and I'll bet you could achieve the same mileage as the N/A version when not in boost, and yet not have to deal with being passed by motorhomes and school busses on freeway on-ramps. This ain't rocket science.
your absolutely right. they don't try very hard actually. i was in the market for a japanese diesel earlier this year. after all, subaru and honda both said they would have 50+ mpg diesels for sale in the '10 model year. apparently they all canceled the program because they didn't have an automatic tranny which could handle the torque output of the motor. and apparently if you don't have an automatic for us market its not worth bothering with. sigh.

we really do need some new blood in the industry. makes me want to build a 75mpg miata just to show them how effing pathetic they really are.
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:57 AM   #46
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everything leads to fat people.
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Old 10-07-2010, 03:38 AM   #47
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18 mpg vs 14 mpg saves 16 gallons per thousand miles.

34 mpg vs 30 mpg saves only 4 gallons.

So don't assume a 4 mpg improvement on a bigass SUV isn't much.
A 30 mpg car would have to go to 58 mpg to save the same gas as an SUV going from 14 to 18.
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Old 10-07-2010, 07:14 AM   #48
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I do not remember which hybrid SUV I was reading about when it came out (who really cares - it saved ONE mpg over the normal one in CTY) but they needed to remove some weight when they put the battery pack in so they pulled 500 pounds of interior out. Why they hell didn't they do that in the first place?

All green car **** is a joke. I do not believe you should be allowed to talk about MPG if your car costs more than $30,000. I drive a $1500 Geo Metro and put my money where my mouth is. I wanted to save gas so I drive a **** car with **** interior and **** performance. Don't pull along side of me in your Lexus hybrid SUV and talk about saving the environment.

/rant
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:13 PM   #49
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The Japs already have a godzillion little cars with tiny engines that sip fuel at cruise and idle and have excellent on-demand power from turbos, clutched centrifugal superchargers, or both. They aren't sold here because Big Labor owns the politicians and have protectionist trade and "safety" legislation prohibiting our ability to exercise free choice. Fun.

Oil companies have a mere fraction of the influence that Big Labor does. Hell, even General Electric has more influence than any oil company. GE owns the bulk of the green technology that is being funded (including some of the hybrid bullshit) and owns the bully pulpit of multiple television networks.
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:17 PM   #50
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Wut.

big labor big business
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Old 10-07-2010, 12:18 PM   #51
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Why are hybrids so ugly?
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Old 10-07-2010, 01:19 PM   #52
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I was watching past episodes of Top Gear. In one (season 5?), they had nose to nose the original Golf (Rabbit) GTI, and the lastest model at that time. Talking about how much HP it had; they were impressed, saying it was fantastic. The problem was, that the new model, although having nearly double the HP, was no quicker than the original one, nearly 10 years old. The reason? The newer one weighed in at double what the original was. So, it was newer, but not as quick, not as fun to drive, and got no better mileage.

Screw all the safety crap. That's where the weight is, in all the crumble zones, air bags, safety rated seats, padded dashes, etc.
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Old 10-07-2010, 02:54 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by jtothawhat View Post
Why are hybrids so ugly?
Because if you are a tree hugger it is a sin to enjoy your automobile.
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Old 10-07-2010, 03:07 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by chicksdigmiatas View Post
Because if you are a tree hugger it is a sin to enjoy your automobile.
not true! I'm a tree hugger and can't stand the prius from a driver's perspective.
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