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Old 12-27-2015, 10:32 AM   #1
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Default BP4w nonturbo ignition map

hello,
another megasquirt ign question (searching about nonturbo ign maps wasnt successful).
usually the answers are quite helpful at this forum so ill try it here

im drivin a 99 BP4W engine in my 91 mx5 - with stock header, supersprint catback (including a aftermarket "highflow" cat), no MAF/AFM, 91 B6-CAS, aftermarket airfilter.

driving good - but maybe theres some ponys still there which i cant find

maybe my ignition map isnt the best one - so lets compare it to your maps
(im driving only on premium fuel - 95 or 98 ROZ - in US 91 or 93 gasoline).

heres the ign map:



sorry for my bad english :(
greetings from germany

Last edited by spidy; 01-06-2016 at 06:40 AM.
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Old 01-03-2016, 08:09 PM   #2
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I don't know how to take or post a screen shot. But, I am running about 33 degrees (top right side of map)advance at high load and about 40 degrees at low load high rpm(lower right side of map).
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Old 01-03-2016, 10:11 PM   #3
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whats the reasoning behind the bumpy random spark map you currently run?
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Old 01-04-2016, 06:32 PM   #4
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another BP4w driver here in germany send me his sparkmap - runs "ok" but not perfect. especially the low loads.

im modified the DIYPNP 99-00 basemap now - runs better in low RPM.

at WOT how much degrees is save with the OEM engine and premium fuel? (AFRs are around 12,5-12,8 now - yes bit too much fuel)? 33 too advanced? (running ~29 degrees now).

ive no experince with these ign maps - without a knock tool :/
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Old 01-04-2016, 07:36 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spidy View Post
another BP4w driver here in germany send me his sparkmap - runs "ok" but not perfect. especially the low loads.

im modified the DIYPNP 99-00 basemap now - runs better in low RPM.

at WOT how much degrees is save with the OEM engine and premium fuel? (AFRs are around 12,5-12,8 now - yes bit too much fuel)? 33 too advanced? (running ~29 degrees now).

ive no experince with these ign maps - without a knock tool :/
Only a dyno can tell you that
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Old 01-05-2016, 10:07 AM   #6
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nobody with a BP4w engine and a knocktool approved n/a map here?
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Old 01-05-2016, 10:17 AM   #7
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nobody with a BP4w engine and a knocktool approved n/a map here?
Jesus Christ. It's different for every ******* car. You have to...get this...TUNE. Quit being a lazy *** and go read ****. Stop asking stupid ******* questions.
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Old 01-05-2016, 10:59 AM   #8
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Welches Megasquirt hast du? Ich hab eine Zndung-Tabelle, die relative konservativ ist, aber verschidene Motoren funktionieren anders.

Ein freund von mir, Kai, ist Wekrstattleiter bei COR-Tuning und Chef bei TNT-4-Motorsports und hat den Dynojet-Zugriff. Vielleicht schick ihn einem email oder ruf ihn an. Er wre Hinweise haben. Leider ist er etwa 3 Stunden von dir (Winnegsen).

Mit Megasquirt, bin ich oft durcheinander, aber tunen ist schwieriger als das Hochladen des Maps.
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Old 01-05-2016, 11:54 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
Jesus Christ. It's different for every ******* car. You have to...get this...TUNE. Quit being a lazy *** and go read ****. Stop asking stupid ******* questions.
In his defense it's much harder to find a dyno in Germany that will allow you to tune. Then finding somebody who can reliably hear knock with det-cans is probably even harder.
One more reason to move to the States. I am however curious how our German friends got their stuff street-legal!
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Old 01-05-2016, 12:01 PM   #10
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Yea TV is a pain when it comes to anything modified which is why I question if I'll ever be able to bring my car over if I make the jump.
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Old 01-05-2016, 12:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
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Yea TV is a pain when it comes to anything modified which is why I question if I'll ever be able to bring my car over if I make the jump.
Same here
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Old 01-05-2016, 12:27 PM   #12
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A spec miata racer told me that most of them run about 30 degrees at 100kpa for best power but he's running na8. NB8 would possibly be different because of the many differences between the two engines.

Viel gluck.
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Old 01-05-2016, 04:40 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aidandj View Post
Jesus Christ. It's different for every ******* car. You have to...get this...TUNE. Quit being a lazy *** and go read ****. Stop asking stupid ******* questions.
maybe you shouldnt read my questions - and do your own ****

other guys can read/talk normally thx for normal answers guys.

shure not every engine is the same - but theres sometimes good advices where it should go ive got no intense to buy some knock tools or few hundret euros for some dyno tuning (for this n/a engine)

@psyber_0ptix: its a DIYPNP (MS2extra). and yes its no fun with the TV sometimes but they wont notice the engineswap ^^

@sixshooter: thats what i heard too - around 30 - maybe a bit more/less.

@stefanst: for you US-guys its no problem with the TV. bring your tuned cars over here. import-cars got full TV paper and the rules for imports are not as strict as for a german car later.
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Old 01-05-2016, 04:50 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spidy View Post
shure not every engine is the same - but theres sometimes good advices where it should go ive got no intense to buy some knock tools or few hundret euros for some dyno tuning (for this n/a engine)
Tough love.

You want good advice? Here's some good advice: Stop asking us to tune your car over the internet for you. You're already close to the detonation limit and now you're asking people to send you a ragged-edge N/A ignition map that you can just slap into your ECU without doing any form of tuning whatsoever. That's how people blow up engines, so have fun with that.

If you don't want to tune your car, use a basemap and don't mess with it. Doing what you are trying to do here (get someone else's ragged-edge-tuned map and use it with zero thought) is a great way to learn what the inside of your crankcase looks like. Stop being stupid before you cost yourself a bunch of money.
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Old 01-05-2016, 04:58 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefanst View Post
In his defense it's much harder to find a dyno in Germany that will allow you to tune. Then finding somebody who can reliably hear knock with det-cans is probably even harder.
One more reason to move to the States. I am however curious how our German friends got their stuff street-legal!
He's within 2 hours of both IL Motorsport and SPS Motorsport. Both able to tune on a dyno. There's no excuse here.
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Old 01-06-2016, 06:47 AM   #16
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Somebody to tune my car here wasnt in my mind.

its just for fun - but youre right - i wont killing my engine. im not shure how "good" the basemap from DIY is (the 99-00 one)

theres a lot of "stupid questions" at this forum - a lot of beginners with megasquirts.
answers like " timing too retarded at low loads and too advanced at full load" are helpful

btw. ILs good tuning guy doesnt work anymore there. SPS are very busy (i know jan since about 10 years).
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Old 01-06-2016, 08:15 AM   #17
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I didn't know you could run a B6 CAS in a BP4W engine. I learned something today.

The DIY Autotune basemap for your engine will be conservative and safe. For maximum power for racing you will need a dyno tune, but for just street driving it is fine. You can easily add a couple of degrees in some places but without a detonation listening device, you will be only guessing where the danger is at wide open throttle. And you will be guessing what timing value generates the most power.

There is a program that uses a smart phone and GPS combined with your data log from the Megasquirt to estimate power. It may be a little bit useful for tuning the wide open throttle sections of your spark map. I can't recall what it is called and I haven't used it. Maybe someone else here can help with that.

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Old 01-06-2016, 02:56 PM   #18
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If you can find a place where you can make a bunch of highly repeatable 3rd or 4th gear runs on a flat piece of road (preferably both directions to eliminate slight changes in elevation and wind) , you may be able to tune spark with just det-cans on your ears and using Virtual Dyno. That's in theory. I was never able to get any decent result from VD (Virtual Dyno- not the other VD!) when changing spark just a few degrees. The data recorded on an MS log is just too noisy for me.
Sure you can see the difference between 20deg and 10deg, but not between 38 and 34.

OTOH we already know that a boosted stock Miata engine running on any normal fuel is det limited at full boost. So in order to get max power, all you need is det-cans. Listen to the onset of knock and dial it back a few degrees by your personal safety margin.
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Old 01-06-2016, 03:05 PM   #19
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i love potentially ruining my motor to squeeze another half horsepower out my crank too.
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