NB1 with vvt ms3 basic, no start no run (Need Help Plz) - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 08-21-2014, 01:33 AM   #1
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Default NB1 with vvt ms3 basic, no start no run (Need Help Plz)

My car has been running great. Recently I took a friend for a drive and stopped to put gas in the car. When I stopped the car wouldn't fire back up.

I assumed this was a fuel issue as it cranks but no fire. So I replaced the following:

-fuel pump relay
-fuel pump
-main relay

I then wised up and was checked to see if I could fire the car on the stock ecu... it runs, all be it rough. As it turns out... the MS3 seemed to have scrambled it's firmware and I could not connect it using tuner studio.

At the direction of Ben from DIYautotune, I re-flashed the firmware using the boot jumper. This worked and I now have connectivity to the ECU. At this point I noticed that I had one coil near plug that was melted. So now I replaced both coil near plugs... still no start.

However, I still can't start the car. I am able to get the spark plugs to fire via test mode, I can hear the fuel pump priming when i turn the ignition on and via test mode. When I test the injectors via test mode the indicator dial in test mode shows pulse width activity.

The car will still not start. I'm looking for some direction on what to start next. I can't figure out where to go. I have not verified that fuel is actually coming out of the injectors. When i did the test mode firing on them I can smell fuel faintly, I assume this means they are working. Color me confused.

Please give any guidance you may have... need to get this car running before the MRLS event.

Tune and cranking logs attached. Thanks for looking and TIA for the help.
Attached Files
File Type: msq CAT tune final.msq (177.4 KB, 49 views)
File Type: csv 2014-08-20_19.56.48.csv (20.1 KB, 38 views)
File Type: msl 2014-08-18_19.48.14.msl (77.5 KB, 51 views)
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Old 08-21-2014, 04:22 AM   #2
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Which firmware version did you reflash it with?
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Old 08-21-2014, 10:11 AM   #3
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I flashed the firmware twice. The first time I flashed, I flashed it with the most current MS3 release. 1.3.2 When I tried to load my tune onto the 1.3.2 release it spit out some errors and I didn't feel like dealing with it.

I then flashed it back to 1.2.3 which was on it when I received it from you.

I was thinking last night... the one thing I haven't done is to make a new project. When I reflashed back to 1.2.3 I just opened my original project. Not sure if this makes any difference.

Another thing that's odd is that when I compare the base tune that I got from you to the tuned one that Church did for me, other than AFR Target, Spark, VE and VVT tables there are barely any differences.

That makes me worry that there is something deeper going on. Does the composite log show anything that I'm too noob to see?

Also... cam input on my car is set to JS10 on both my base tune and updated tune. per this thread is that an issue? https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...pm-sync-80243/

I don't think I'm having any sync issues by the looks of my composite... but I barely know enough to know the difference.
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Old 08-21-2014, 12:17 PM   #4
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When cranking at first, you get something like 22000rpm, which is bogus and worries me.

Then you get maybe 120-130rpm, which seems kind of low for cranking.

You need to check whether your injectors are actually firing. To do that, you need noid lights.
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Old 08-21-2014, 12:30 PM   #5
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Looking at your log, your battery voltage seems to be going below 9VDC during cranking. That may be too low to keep some relays pulled in. Try it with a fresh battery?

Also, your dwell angle gets really high, like 10 degrees. That might be a function of the low battery voltage, not sure. But if it's that high when running, it will fry coils.

Sub'd. Hope you get it going.
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Old 08-21-2014, 03:44 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverant View Post
When cranking at first, you get something like 22000rpm, which is bogus and worries me.

Then you get maybe 120-130rpm, which seems kind of low for cranking.

You need to check whether your injectors are actually firing. To do that, you need noid lights.
Noted. The Tune has cranking RPM's at 300. Possibly this is just a battery issue like hornetball is suggesting.

on your recommendation I ordered a set of noid lights.
Robot Check Robot Check

Bought them same day delivery (<3 amazon) so I will have them tonight. I will report back what I find.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hornetball View Post
Looking at your log, your battery voltage seems to be going below 9VDC during cranking. That may be too low to keep some relays pulled in. Try it with a fresh battery?

Also, your dwell angle gets really high, like 10 degrees. That might be a function of the low battery voltage, not sure. But if it's that high when running, it will fry coils.

Sub'd. Hope you get it going.
I've got a new battery for one of my other cars I just bought and haven't installed. I'll throw it in the miata and see what happens. Do you happen to know what the proper dwell settings are for the 01+ coil near plugs?
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Old 08-21-2014, 03:48 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EErockMiata View Post
Do you happen to know what the proper dwell settings are for the 01+ coil near plugs?
Seems like i answered my own question. https://www.miataturbo.net/engine-pe...ll-01-a-55579/

5ms
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Old 08-21-2014, 04:46 PM   #8
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BTW, the 300RPM "cranking RPM" is just the value your MS uses to decide to switch from "Cranking" mode to "After Start Enrichment" mode. It doesn't mean you'll actually crank that fast. In fact, you want it set to an RPM comfortably above your normal cranking RPM so ASE doesn't get triggered until the engine fires.

That said, 120RPM and <9VDC is low.
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Old 08-21-2014, 11:21 PM   #9
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got the noid test lights. MS is not sending a voltage signal to the injectors. I've verified spark in test mode but injector in test mode does nothing with the noid light.

Including another cranking composite that I did with the fresh battery hooked up. The one i had from last night was from 2-3 hours of messing with it and it's capacity must have been getting low.

Soo..... what now?

P.S. I also tried making a new project and going back to the basemap i got from rev... still no dice.
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File Type: msl 2014-08-21_17.52.37.msl (100.5 KB, 45 views)
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Old 08-22-2014, 03:10 PM   #10
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Well... I've come to the conclusion that this MS3 basic has to go back to Rev to be re-worked. I am absolutely crushed to be left 2 weeks before the MRLS event with no ecu. I ordered a VVTuner unit from DIYautotune so that I can at least have some horsepower for the event.

This... fricken...sucks...
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Old 08-22-2014, 03:46 PM   #11
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Sorry man. I'd let you borrow a Miata if I was closer.
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