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Old 04-23-2008, 11:13 AM   #1
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Default Where do you guys mount the CLT?

Waiting on my MS and want to order anything else I need today. Contemplating Knocksense, definitely buying the GM AIT for MAF removal and WANT to install the GM CLT as well but can't seem to find a good place / adapter to install. I really like Joe Perez' adapter but I can't exactly run out and buy one of those! Seems like most folks are using EasyTerm, I'd just prefer not to. Any good solutions?

My car is a 95, 1.8 w/ M45 S/C (hotside) - turbo to come next summer ....once I figure out all this MS stuff!

What do you guys think about tapping the dummy TB to mount the AIT until I go turbo?
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Old 04-23-2008, 11:26 AM   #2
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99% of the users here retain the stock CLT sensor.
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Old 04-23-2008, 11:39 AM   #3
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The posts I've read on EasyTherm seem to indicate it's imprecise and a PITA. Are my impressions wrong?
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Old 04-23-2008, 11:43 AM   #4
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yes
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Old 04-23-2008, 11:49 AM   #5
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OK then! I'll go the tried and true route unless I discover a reason not to. Thanks!
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Old 04-23-2008, 12:05 PM   #6
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the resistance value is know.

the only issue is when piggybacked, because you add bias resistors to the circuit. You can remove these, however, the stock bias is somewhat unknown. For a 90-93 I have them spot on. Since I don't have a 94-97 I cant tell you values that work the best. Seems like paul and others don't have issues.
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Old 04-23-2008, 12:34 PM   #7
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I have mine cut into one of the heater core lines....i would have used the stock one but i already ran this one for when i was using an emanage.
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Old 04-23-2008, 01:17 PM   #8
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That's just it, I AM going piggyback to keep A/C. Anybody have the values spot on for 94-95? How does one go about calibrating / figuring resistor values?

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Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
the resistance value is know.

the only issue is when piggybacked, because you add bias resistors to the circuit. You can remove these, however, the stock bias is somewhat unknown. For a 90-93 I have them spot on. Since I don't have a 94-97 I cant tell you values that work the best. Seems like paul and others don't have issues.
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Old 04-23-2008, 01:19 PM   #9
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Paul has them spot on. Do a search for his name and it will come up with a thread that has his values posted.
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Old 04-23-2008, 02:12 PM   #10
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Even Joe Perez isn't using Joe Perez's adapter anymore. I built that thing for a dash gauge that turned out to be a POS, so I just linearized my stock gauge instead. It's still sitting there in the heater line, but it's not connected to anything.

I'm using the DIYAutotune PNP values for my standalone MS on the stock sensor. They seem to be accurate to within no more than +/- 10F across the board (or at least down to 50F anyway) and I'm quite happy with that. For the standalone 1.6 using the standard bias values, the numbers are:
; F , Resistance
; -4, 16150
; 104, 1150
; 176, 330

For the 94-95, they show the following, which I'd guess is also damn near spot-on:
; F, Resistance
; -4, 16150
; 104, 1150
; 176, 320
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Old 04-23-2008, 03:09 PM   #11
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I'm been ******* with the piggy backed stock CLT for nearly a year and the bastard has never really worked right with the MS. It's spot one from 14*-55* then it get's stupid. I've tried all sorts of values and nothing seems to work. I ordered a CLT from trail tech and one of my vendors is making the M12 to M6 adapter so I can screw it into the water port next to my turbo oil feed line. Once I have it tested out I may offer these adapters to those interested in simplifying their parallel install.
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Old 04-23-2008, 03:34 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkmage View Post
I'm been ******* with the piggy backed stock CLT for nearly a year and the bastard has never really worked right with the MS.
Parallel Install Easier than Standalone.
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Old 04-23-2008, 03:43 PM   #13
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my values are spot on....CLT and MAT read within 5F of each other in the mornings.

Keep the resistance scale as a constant, and change the bias. you dont need to reflash, just overwrite teh .inc files. open MT and see what the temps display. you shoudl be able to dial them in and have a value that others would surely appreciate. do this while the ait is hanging out in the open and have a thermometer near it to verify the temps...then adjust the CLT bias to get close to the AIT reading.
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Old 04-23-2008, 04:19 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braineack View Post
my values are spot on....CLT and MAT read within 5F of each other in the mornings.
Yup, that's my gold standard. I assume that since the IAT sensor is a standard GM part whose characteristics are well known that it must be accurate. (I verified this with my lab-grade Fluke, and it is indeed spot-on.) Thus, if IAT and CLT match when the engine is at ambient temp, I assume CLT to be accurate, at least at that temperature.

Obviously it's possible for it to be accurate at on temperature and screwed up at another, but the fact that it typically reads in the range of 190-200F when fully warmed up jives with what I know the actual "normal" operating temperature of my engine to be, so I assume it to be accurate at that range as well.
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Old 04-23-2008, 05:54 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Parallel Install Easier than Standalone.
Nope. If I had a semi-simple way to keep my A/C I'd PREFER standalone....
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Old 04-23-2008, 06:36 PM   #16
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It wouldn't be too hard to work around the A/C problem. The issue for me is the OBD2 emissions testing.
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Old 04-23-2008, 06:50 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soloracer View Post
Nope. If I had a semi-simple way to keep my A/C I'd PREFER standalone....
I've already covered A/C.
Here it is for the 1.6: https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/sho...7&postcount=13

And here it is for the NB: https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/sho...0&postcount=21

The 1.8 NA is about the same as the NB. Different pins, same concept.
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Old 04-24-2008, 09:42 AM   #18
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Thanks Joe-
I don't think it'd be any harder than the NA A/C. If you've got a '99-'00 diagram in front of you, take the LG/B wire coming from the pressure switch after the "A/C Amplifier" that goes to 1P, gate it with an output that goes true when TPS = WOT, and use it to control either a DPST relay or a pair of open-collector NPNs that ground the "A/C Relay" (L/B wire at 1S) and the "Condenser Fan Relay" (L/W wire at 1I). I freely release that concept to the public domain for all uses commercial or non-commercial.
Can you help me out a little though? I'm not a complete electronics idiot. I've built circuits in the past and took electronic applications and theory courses in high school and early in college....but that's been a while!

I'm not sure of a couple things though...

what's the A/C Amplifier? What is meant by 'gate it'? How / why would you use transistors instead of relays?

This may be a little beyond me technically and a LOT beyond my motivation to build/sort!
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Old 04-24-2008, 12:27 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soloracer View Post
Can you help me out a little though?
What year is your car? (And why isn't it in your sig?)
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Old 04-24-2008, 01:32 PM   #20
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My car is a 95.

I never bothered with a sig when I created my account b/c I never planned to get sucked in! Didn't figure I'd spend much time here....boy was I wrong...
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