If I build around GT2560 will log mani be a hindrance comp. to a SSM -also DP design? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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Old 12-08-2009, 06:30 PM   #1
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Default If I build around GT2560 will log mani be a hindrance comp. to a SSM -also DP design?

I've done some searching to see how much better the SSM style manifold over a log design is. Perhaps I didnt search enough but it looks to be better but the tests were on bigger turbo's and higher psi levels than I am going to start and maybe live (stay) with


Want to stay with stock motor '02 and less than 12psi so I dont know if it will be noticable having either one.

I would like good streetability with power starting early thats I why I think I may need the tubular design but I dont know enough right now.


Should I spend the extra money going to a SSM from a cast manifold?

Will the FM manifold and cast DP hinder the spool ? Should I at least go with the BEGI SGDP if I do go with any of the cast log mani's ?


Thanks
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Old 12-08-2009, 07:34 PM   #2
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Spool: Absurdflow
Looks: Absurdflow/ARtech/DIY

18 psi & i think wanecurr both made there own manifolds, both very good looking and work fine im sure.

If you even plan to track the car, begi/fm mani's seem to have a pretty big issue with loosing/stretching studs.
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Old 12-08-2009, 07:41 PM   #3
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Tubular kicks ***
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Old 12-08-2009, 08:28 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Landrew View Post
I've done some searching to see how much better the SSM style manifold over a log design is. Perhaps I didnt search enough but it looks to be better but the tests were on bigger turbo's and higher psi levels than I am going to start and maybe live (stay) with


Want to stay with stock motor '02 and less than 12psi so I dont know if it will be noticable having either one.

I would like good streetability with power starting early thats I why I think I may need the tubular design but I dont know enough right now.


Should I spend the extra money going to a SSM from a cast manifold?

Will the FM manifold and cast DP hinder the spool ? Should I at least go with the BEGI SGDP if I do go with any of the cast log mani's ?


Thanks
What does SSM stand for?

By "cast log mani", I assume you mean either the FM or BEGI cast mani? I wouldn't consider them "log" manifolds.

I have no experience with the FM options (mani or downpipe) so between them or BEGI I don't know which I would go with.

My biased opinion is to run Absurdflow stuff as it's relatively cheap for me to do so. If you don't feel like waiting, paying, and/or dealing with that absurdflow jackass, go with ARTech.

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Old 12-08-2009, 08:41 PM   #5
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^ lol, Tim you must be have an assload of work driving customers away like that

flowspool
smallest/shortest runners = faster spool
bigger downpipe = faster spool

Long runner manifolds spool slower than a log manifold, all else being equal, but make more power once spooled.
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Old 12-08-2009, 08:49 PM   #6
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^ lol, Tim you must be have an assload of work driving customers away like that
Actually I haven't done anything since thesnowboarder's stuff. I have one guy w/deposit wanting the same thing but I won't make it until there's many more hours on the 3 that are out there. Other than that (one), my plate is empty. I may build another BEGI/FM replacement tubular mani shortly as I already purchased the raw material a month ago (for a build that fell through).

I like pushing work your way because you do a great job, are inexpensive, and I like you. no homo. And you do 1.6 stuff.

End hijack.
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Old 12-08-2009, 10:00 PM   #7
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OP, what do you want to do with the car? For street and/or track, the spool you get with the FM cast with a 2560, esp with a good dp & exhaust will probably be sufficient. The caveat for track duty with this setup is that 1. you may have stud problems on track with this combo and 2. there is no vband housing avail for this turbo (someone correct me if I'm wrong, I only found a vband to flange adapter on atp).

I am sticking with my 2560R, since I have it, and am having a tubular mani built for it, hoping for awesome spool for autocross. Plus, tubular is just cooler.
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Old 12-08-2009, 10:08 PM   #8
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The smallest housing that Tial makes thats v-band tastic is the 2860
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:59 PM   #9
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I don't see the point of getting an expensive tubular manifold if you're targeting 250whp. As you boost more, those percentage points of improved efficiency make much more of a difference than at 15psi.

I do agree with the vband comment EXCEPT note that after I resbonded my 10mm studs, they stopped backing out. I'm not an ultra track commando but I have some faith in the resbond for street use and probably light track. There's track data in the epic thread.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:24 AM   #10
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It will just be a street car, so looking for torque to start building down low.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:26 AM   #11
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I think low end torque comes form unequal length runners but you will suffer your top end.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:48 AM   #12
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SSM is BEGI talk for Stainless Steel "Header Style" Exhaust Manifold
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Old 12-09-2009, 08:53 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Landrew View Post
SSM is BEGI talk for Stainless Steel "Header Style" Exhaust Manifold
Ahh ok thanks.

If torque is your primary concern, why not go with the 2554?
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Old 12-09-2009, 09:27 AM   #14
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Ahh ok thanks.

If torque is your primary concern, why not go with the 2554?
or a stupidcharger!
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Old 12-09-2009, 09:29 AM   #15
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Quote:
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or a stupidcharger!

um...he said torque.
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Old 12-09-2009, 09:31 AM   #16
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um...he said torque.
im just thrownin it out there! instant power in low rpm range, wasnt really ment to be serious!
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Old 12-09-2009, 11:32 AM   #17
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My math:

GT2560R
BEGI log
IWG
MBC
94 low comp block, stock head
3" Enthuza
________ +

Spools 14psi before 3500rpm.

Very streetable, but for pure street/city driving I'd probably get a 2554. For track I might be tempted to get slightly larger, or get a 99+ head.
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spookyfish View Post
My math:

GT2560R
BEGI log
IWG
MBC
94 low comp block, stock head
3" Enthuza
________ +

Spools 14psi before 3500rpm.
Dyno plot of the above w/BEGI SGDP vs absurdflow versions of same parts on same year block/head, same dyno. 14psi for BEGI vs 12 & 13psi for absurdflow. Worth the extra cost?


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Old 12-09-2009, 12:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboTim View Post
Actually I haven't done anything since thesnowboarder's stuff. I have one guy w/deposit wanting the same thing but I won't make it until there's many more hours on the 3 that are out there.
MINIME WANT CHOCOLATE!
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:24 PM   #20
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I read all the 2554 v '60 threads and since I'm only going to 12 psi max I might just have to do the 54. If I build the motor later I can upgrade to a bigger turbo.

Sounds like the Absurdflow + 3" all the way back can turn the 54 into a 60 for spool.

The issue with the Absurdflow is that its hard to find used ones - ok there is no used ones for sale. Whereas a used cast manifold is dirt cheap. I'm trying to keep costs down as I will be getting a Adaptronic in the mix and that also isnt a very discounted item.
I sure like the performance and looks of them though - very nice - love those welds.

You could send me an Absurdflow quote anyways by PM. I would need it to work with my PS and AC and throw in a good working used GT2554 to the quote if you have one. Make it a package deal. I suppose it would not be worth it without 3" piping all the way back as well. I wasnt sure if you did that too.
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