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Old 08-31-2011, 12:43 PM   #61
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Did some more research on my particular car. I've got an Escort GT engine with 2 water exits on the back of the head.

Miata:


Escort GT:


So it appears that that fitting flows pre-tstat, so I found a hose at Autozone that had a 180 degree bend near the end of it and ran it back towards the driver's side and just put a barbed fitting (male on both sides) in between the stock heater hose and it. Just another reference for guys with EGT swaps in their cars.
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Old 08-31-2011, 12:51 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FRT_Fun View Post
Joe, is this what you are talking about?
Yes. That config would work properly for a heaterless car, and would eliminate the need for a spacer and thermostat at the back of the head.
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Old 08-31-2011, 02:47 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by FRT_Fun View Post
Joe, is this what you are talking about?

Blue line to W/P only is active when >180 degrees.

After tstat "opens" the line to w/p is not used and only the one to the radiator is used.


Im using a Perma-Cool Oil thermostat in my heater core line.

http://www.alamomotorsports.com/pmc/Cat_page14.html

You plug two of the ports and use the other two and you can configure it so it shuts off flow once up to temperature. Testing it I found the Wax plug in it was too high temp and didn’t fully shut off flow until about 200F if I remember right. I took it apart and found a Motostat radiator thermostat at Oreilles that was listed as a 170F. It had the exact same shape wax plug in it like in the oil thermostat that came with one rated for 190F. Put it in and I had a thermostat that was fully closed and shut down flow at roughly 180F.

I still have my heater core but with the thermostat post core. It dosn’t let much of any flow bypass the radiator unless the heater core heat exchanger gets it to below 180F. Thus maximizing the flow to the biggest most efficient heat exchanger when needed. The main radiator thermostat is also 180F.

Im using a 1070 that has 1/2" pipe ports and using -10 AN lines. but I see that part number 1071 comes with -10 AN ports and might be more compact with fittings.

Turn the blower motor heat on in the cabin and it will heat the car turn it off and the heater circuit won’t be bypassing the cooling system if more heat transfer is needed.

Eliminate the heater core and I think it would still work good as well. Though I have seen it work with just capping off the heater circuit. The water pump is not positive displacement I think it will just churn the water in the block until it warms up and the thermostat opens and things begin to circulate.

Bob

Last edited by bbundy; 08-31-2011 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 08-31-2011, 03:09 PM   #64
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So your suggestion is to drill holes into the head, machine flat surfaces, create a custom coolant manifold with an integrated thermostat housing and heater core feed, support the weight of that manifold to ensure it doesn't crack, shield it from the heat of the turbo manifold (or the more laughable option of trying to weave it into place around the fuel injectors/fuel rail/intake manifold), and then still perform the rest of the cooling reroute modifications (running a hose from the back to the front with no rub points)?

What the **** requires more modification than that? I like to think that I get to play with some of the hottest Miatas on the planet and I've never seen anything that is more complex than what you described.
I must admit I have toyed with the Idea of alternate coolant ports in the head. Attached image of a friends Alfa. 2.0l NA cerebrated and it made over 200hp. He reverse flowed the coolant system putting the cool water into the head directly on top of each combustion chamber. If you pull the valve cover off a Miata head there are two big pipe plugs staring right at you in the valley already going to the water jacket between 1 and 2 and 3 and 4. The only problem is getting through the valve cover with it.

But I still donít think it is necessary with a miata as I think we have found other setups that work good enough even into the 350+ hp range on track cars.

Bob
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Old 08-31-2011, 03:31 PM   #65
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. Should also mention I run a PWR radiator
I also must admit I am skeptical of the PWR 37mm radiator in its ability to be much more effective than the stock radiator at transferring heat. I’d like to see some independent scientific testing. I think FM did some testing that showed this as well. The stock one seems to be light and small but it must be really efficient for its capacity. I noticed a huge change going from a PWR 37mm after it split to a cheap Ebay 52mm thick Mishimoto copy and almost no change at all in performance when I went from stock to the PWR. The only problem with most of the really thick ones is filled they weigh roughly 3X the stock weight and add like 15 lbs to the nose of your car.

It seems the cross flow multi pass types offer even better performance I’m guessing.

Bob
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Old 09-02-2011, 01:14 PM   #66
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can we get one of these coolant re-route threads in the FAQ to save ourselves from more threads like this? If asked, ill even be more than happy to draw out other coolant layouts using the diagram lol.
This guy is a ******* genius
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Old 09-05-2011, 01:38 AM   #67
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So, just found out my heater core is fux0red.

I never use the bastard anyways, move thermostat+housing to rear, drill pee-hole out to be larger, route rear thermo housing to radiator, profit?
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Old 11-21-2011, 10:03 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larimer View Post
Did some more research on my particular car. I've got an Escort GT engine with 2 water exits on the back of the head.

Miata:


Escort GT:


So it appears that that fitting flows pre-tstat, so I found a hose at Autozone that had a 180 degree bend near the end of it and ran it back towards the driver's side and just put a barbed fitting (male on both sides) in between the stock heater hose and it. Just another reference for guys with EGT swaps in their cars.
A bit of thread necrophilia but I'm researching this for my project. The image above from the escort GT shows pre-stat water that could feed the heater core with the 'U' turn hose but even on the miata head, the water to the oil cooler looks like it is moving pre-stat. Does this alleviate some of the worries about water not flowing in heater core bypass designs? Would that double dong outlet on the escort head thread on or press on? I wonder if there's a part # for it to put one on the Miata head...

Here's my tentative plan if I can find the escort outlet: Use the Kia neck and the GM hose like many do and use the U turn hose from the escort outlet to plumb the heater core. The factory temp sender looks like it will thread into the bung that is plugged on the miata head and with a reroute, this is the best place to get the water temp because it's the hottest point in the system. Besides that, all I need is to plug the front and route the oil cooler return to the mixing manifold. Did I miss anything?

On a side note, there hasn't been much discussion in this thread about the head gasket issue in the later 1.8 motors. Mazda changed the head gasket in the VVT motors to bandaid the coolant path. If you do a reroute on an '01 and newer 1.8, the #1 piston will be even worse than #4 is stock. Use the '94 to '00 head gasket in that application (BP26-10-271).
-h
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Old 11-27-2011, 01:33 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_hyde View Post
A bit of thread necrophilia but I'm researching this for my project. The image above from the escort GT shows pre-stat water that could feed the heater core with the 'U' turn hose but even on the miata head, the water to the oil cooler looks like it is moving pre-stat. Does this alleviate some of the worries about water not flowing in heater core bypass designs? Would that double dong outlet on the escort head thread on or press on? I wonder if there's a part # for it to put one on the Miata head...

Here's my tentative plan if I can find the escort outlet: Use the Kia neck and the GM hose like many do and use the U turn hose from the escort outlet to plumb the heater core. The factory temp sender looks like it will thread into the bung that is plugged on the miata head and with a reroute, this is the best place to get the water temp because it's the hottest point in the system. Besides that, all I need is to plug the front and route the oil cooler return to the mixing manifold. Did I miss anything?

On a side note, there hasn't been much discussion in this thread about the head gasket issue in the later 1.8 motors. Mazda changed the head gasket in the VVT motors to bandaid the coolant path. If you do a reroute on an '01 and newer 1.8, the #1 piston will be even worse than #4 is stock. Use the '94 to '00 head gasket in that application (BP26-10-271).
-h
I have a couple escort GT heads in my shop. Yes the Biger outlet on the double dong is used for the Heater core on a transverse engine installation.

I suspect it would be hard to get out of the head without mangling it however. I might consider just taking it out and tapping it to screw in an AN-fitting. I am currently using a spacer on mine but have converted all the Heater core lines to AN fittings and hoses. Actually welded on AN-bosses onto an NB heater core.

Bob
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Old 11-27-2011, 01:44 AM   #70
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I think a similar fitting is in most/all of the BP heads used across the different marquees so hopefully I can find a parts counter that will sell me one. Are the AN fittings at the heater core because of any unusually high coolant pressures in your monster block or just to make the engine bay look even meaner than it already is?
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Old 11-28-2011, 05:01 AM   #71
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I test fit the Kia neck tonight. This isn't a news flash for anyone who has used the BEGI kit but it runs right into the double dong nipple without the BEGI spacer. I still like the concept so I'm going to see if there is a BP water neck that clocks another 30* counter clockwise to an exit around 1:30 instead of directly to the right. That should still be a gentle enough bend to allow the use of the GM hose.
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Old 11-28-2011, 12:29 PM   #72
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Here is what I did.



Last edited by bbundy; 11-28-2011 at 12:44 PM.
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Old 11-28-2011, 12:49 PM   #73
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Here is what I did.


well aparently cardomain wont let you link photos anymore and new security at work wont let me upload. here is the link to the page.

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/737924...e-9#7379240132
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Old 11-28-2011, 02:29 PM   #74
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I believe this is the image he wants:
http://memimage.cardomain.com/ride_i...arge.jpg?modal

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Old 12-08-2011, 01:30 AM   #75
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This is the image of the day:
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Old 12-08-2011, 02:03 AM   #76
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I got the BEGI spacer in a box of other stuff for a good price so the next wheel I need to **** up reinvent is the water return. I want to run the heater return into the upper radiator hose (post t stat) and cap the extra pipe in the mixing manifold. Has anyone seen an OTS Y pipe that will allow this or do I need to beg someone with more skills than me to braze one? I've pieced out the assembly of one with brass plumbing fittings (barbs, NPT, etc.) but it would be $100 and weigh 10 pounds.
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Old 12-08-2011, 08:58 AM   #77
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You can weld the "mixing manifold".
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Old 12-13-2011, 03:48 PM   #78
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I just ordered a $.29 ~22.17mm freeze plug to plug up the unused hole in the mixing manifold...if it works out, I'll post part numbers...and more details. I'll probably throw a little epoxy around it as well just for safe measure.
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Old 12-14-2011, 01:38 AM   #79
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Front and back of my mixing manifold, which has been turned around from the factory position, hopefully you can figure out what's going on. Big hole has been welded, drilled, and tapped for 1/2NPT. You can yank the hose barb out then drill and tap for 1/8NPT, which is currently plugged in my thanks to the waterless turbo.



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Old 12-14-2011, 02:30 AM   #80
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If I did that, I couldn't have AC and power steering in my track car... I didn't think about flipping it around. Is there an OTS lower hose that works in that configuration?

Does anyone have the heater return going into the upper radiator hose? Pics?
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