Remove every single unsupported aluminum hardline from that system ASAP before one of them cracks and destroys your engine.

Yeap, or worse, causes a fire too. I would remake those out of steel and support them. Or use AN hoses.

The link that Mobius provided with data was a street car. OTOH, the Miata oil pan has some pretty significant baffles cast in -- and the point of the baffles is to stagnate some oil so that the pickup still has something to suck under cornering/braking. So . . . ??? I think the jury's still out.

Speaking of which -- I have jury duty tomorrow.

Perfect example of someone knowing how to make a thing, but not when it is an appropriate application.

Those hard lines are a recipe for disaster.

edit: I'm on the late bus, Andrew and Patrick beat me to it.

To be fair, installing a temp sensor in a sandwich plate is going to be easier for the majority of owners, and I can't imagine (nor have I heard anyone posit) that there are locations in the oil pan wherein the temperature is significantly greater than would be measured at the filter.

So this is, admittedly, somewhat of an academic question. I just can't see how the oil at any point in the pan is going to be significantly cooler than what's being draw into the pickup tube, baffles or no baffles. The whole point of the oil system is for the oil, all of it, to circulate through the engine.

I recently finished installing my oil cooler kit from Trackspeed (19 row) and I thought I would share.

First off, I have an intercooler and A/C already in front of my Koyo 38mm rad. They are fairly well ducted but i was already seeing water temps creeping upward throughout each 20 minute track session without ever leveling off, so i didn't think stacking the oil cooler with the other heat exchangers was a good idea. I decided to put it as high as possible in the front right corner of the car.

Being that the wheel well is a high pressure area with rocks and debris flying around constantly, I decided that ducting the exit air out the front bumper just in front of the wheel would be…better. In other words I stole the idea from Ryan Passey.

I started out by fabricating the mounting brackets and adding rivet nuts to the chassis to bolt it in. Part of the bracketry was for attaching the duct work.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300

First I attempted to fabricate the ducting from aluminum. I had a feeling I was using too thin of a gauge and it would be hard to weld. I was right - I just don't have the chops to weld .035" alum, so I gave up on welding and took a more "fun" approach


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300

Being that I have a home made 3-D printer in my kitchen, it was the natural choice for plan B. I started out by transferring the measurements off the aluminum prototype into a SolidWorks model. I had to print both the inlet side and the outlet side in two halves, since my build platform is only 8x8x11. It took a few iterations and a couple failed prints but I finally got some decent parts! They are printed from ABS so hopefully it will be able to take the temperature. We will see what happens at the next track day.


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300

The inlet starts out as a 3" aluminum tube that I mounted to the frame. I cut a hole in the bumper and poked it out. The printed inlet duct is connected to the aluminum tube via a short piece of brake duct hose, which keeps some flexibility in the system in case the front gets bumped (the printed parts really aren't that strong).


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442296300

Props, that is way cool. I need a 3D printer.

Agreed! :likecat:

I'll trade you 3D print services for parts/tuning...

Dude. Yes. Nice execution, that looks great.

The 3" inlet is a little small for the oil cooler size for ideal flow, but efficiency with the dedicated ducting is so good it'll hardly matter.

Two notes to further improve efficiency:
- Put a small gurney (1/4" height or so) ahead of the outlet.
- Air is already beginning to travel sideways at your inlet location, so the edge of the inlet protruding out of the bumper skin is perfect for the outside half to "catch" the air and direct it into the duct, but it will help to trim the inlet on the inside half to be flush with the bumper so that air can flow inwards easily from its flow direction.

What is the temperature tolerance of the material you printed with? The oil cooler will be over 200* F on the in side.

Excellent execution MX92'S...damn.

I assume you're homemade printer doesn't print support? If I printed something like that on our Dimension, the entire thing would be support.

I have cheapo autometer temp sensors before & after my 16 row cooler and there's not much delta T, in the noise of the gauge. But my oil temps are now right around water temp whereas before the oil cooler they were 60-70 higher while daily driving.

I found a magnehelic gauge at work that I plan to see what the pressure difference is across my cooler, and see if adding a gurney helps the pressure difference.

Wow. Not only the oil cooler, but everything on that car. Just wow. Pro fabricator?

<br />
<br /><br />
<br />That's because dimensions sole goal in life is to fuck you in the ass every way possible.

Those cooler ducts are most righteous. How big is the print envelope on your printer? And are the ducts ABS?

Also, how did you measure everything for your models? The complex contours to match the bumper and the wheel well look excellent.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442334387

That ducting looks amazing.

That's insane, you could sell those. Glorious work man!

Thanks for all of the compliments - I spend way too much time doing this stuff!!

The printer has a heated build chamber and dual extruders, so it can print HIPS support material with ABS, but it takes a lot longer than printing a single material. For the ducts, I used native ABS support and just tweaked the support/part interface gap until the bond was weak enough that I could just break off the support. Even then, it only supports overhangs that are more than 50 degrees off vertical (adjustable via software) so there isn't really that much support material. I also took the overhang angles into consideration when designing it...notice that the holes are not actually holes but conical dimples.

ABS extrudes at 240C and the build platform is at 110C (the chamber is at 45C). So I figure that the oil cooler fins/brackets may reach a little over 200F, which is going to be right around 100C, well below the melting point. They may, however, soften and sag over time, but that remains to be seen.

I am a mechanical engineer specializing in product development.

Here is a picture of the printer and some CAD screenshots


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442339998


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442339998


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442339998


https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1442339998

The list of neat things I don't know how to do keeps growing.

Sigh. Those are beautiful.

I do believe that is the first home 3d printer I have seen which is actually large enough to do useful things with.

As Chris asked, I'm also curious as to the envelope size.

I clicked on this thread for no good reason.

I come in here and see 3D printed awesome!

We just got a Lulzbot Taz 5 at work. I've been going NUTS with it. It can print a 10x10x10 inch cube (roughly). Realistically a home built printer should be able to compete with that as long as you build it big enough. It's amazing what you can do with aluminum extrusions and some NEMA motors.

Kinda wish I had my own machine at home too.

Its roughly 7.75" x 7.75" x 11". The duct print is about the biggest thing I can do, and even then I had to split it in half.

If you start trying to print ABS at these dimensions, you will realize two things:

1. Warping gets more and more troublesome the larger the part gets
2. Things take FOREVER to print. Even at 0.25mm layers, the largest part of the duct took about 18 hours.

We have a UPrint LX at work 8x8x11 and i was talking to the SolidWorks instructor on my last class about 3d printing, he mentioned that some customers are printing wet layup inner molds from the soluable suport structure material then leyup carbon or fiverglass over it and dissolve the mold once cured leaving a very accurate and sometimes intricate ID surface that would be very difficult to produce otherwise,
Have not tried that yet but it sounds interesting for a one of part.

I was able to use 0.33 or even 0.38 mm layers with some success. I built a piece that was less than 1 mm below the maximum height I can make. It did very well. Only took about 5 and a half hours. Of course it's PLA and not ABS, but still not too shabby.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/uY...l=w467-h830-no

^This.
For large parts I use a 0.6mm or 0.7mm nozzle and 0.4mm layer height.

I've made some pretty small parts too. Limit is the 0.5 mm nozzle.. so wall thickness (parallel to bed) is limited to that at a minimum.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/21...=w1050-h591-no

I buy my airgun pellets at the store like a chump, I'm obviously failing at life.

That's actually a test run of a prototype light fixture component for a friend. Just to see if I could.

For those of you that have placed a largish oil cooler behind your radiator....did you see an increase in coolant temps? I finally have my coolant temps nice and low. I'm concerned that partially blocking the flow through the back of the radiator could be an issue. I would plan on making sure I hade an inch or two between them.

<p>Watch out for the sway bar when moving the cooler back.</p>

Is anybody running the full stack at HPDE events?

oil cooler, intercooler, AC condenser, radiator?

Oil cooler tech
 

Yep. In Florida.

That's beautiful! Willing to share the stl file? Might have to use the 3D printer at work :rofl:

I'm preparing to put my motor back in and wanted to sort out my sandwich plate situation first. I finally purchased a mocal tsat plate along with a setrab cooler and all the 10AN fittings/line. I have removed the factory warmer and recalled from a previous thread that in order to make up the space and give myself an extra port for oil feed and oil gauge to get the glowshift or equivalent sandwich adapter as well.

I tried mocking up these parts this evening with little success as the stud from the block is about 3/8" too long for the mocal threaded adapter to tighten the two plates securely.

Can anyone shed some light on the topic? I can likely machine something to make this work, but I feel like I'm not the first to encounter this issue.

Can I have your oil warmer?

The best spacer is the oil warmer.

My decision was based on a post made in the cooling system thread by Emilio in which he states:

"This is a question for an oil cooler thread. that we're drafting.

I think you mean the oil warmer. That giblet does nothing to reduce oil temps. Not a single track car in our shop has one. We typically use a Mocal thermostat sandwich plate and generic Chinese temp sender plate (Glow-shift, Greddy, etc)) stacked. TB coolant lines always capped off."

Seen as the last post on page one here: https://www.miataturbo.net/race-prep...-thread-79930/

In the event I put the warmer back on, I suppose the convention is I need to add a tapped hole to the mocal plate in order to feed the turbo. I was hoping to get around having to modify another piece, but if that's what it takes I suppose I can make that happen.

Most don't feed oil from a sandwich plate (other than to a cooler that is) as the oil you can access is unfiltered.

I'm admittedly new to sourcing the turbo oil feed on the '96+ blocks. I've lived most of my life with a '95 block that handily came with the water and oil ports on the exhaust side, but I feel like I've seen some that have chosen this route. I suppose I could attempt to tee into the VVT oil supply, but I recall some shying away in hesitation that this might not provide enough flow for both the VVT and Turbo.

I'm not opposed to putting the warmer back on, but it seemed there was a preferred path already chosen (in Emilio's post above). Maybe there is more than one school of thought on this.

I use an older NA8 block and source from the exhaust side as it's post filter.

If using a later block just tap off the VVT line (as it's post filter). If you're worried about the flow, remember the EFR is already internally restricted and VVT shouldn't be ~that~ starved for oil. If you have an aftermarket oil pump, worry even less. All excuses aside, what are your other options?

You can repurpose a sandwich plate on the filter to hold the pressure sender and just draw straight from the 1/8bspt sensor port on the VVT hardline direct to turbo.

I have the oil warmer installed, but I don't run any coolant lines to it. It's acting as a slightly-heaver-than-actually-required-but-free-and-easy spacer.

--Ian

Anyone who has deleted their oil warmer. I will buy it from you. My oil needs warming.

We have done several that way years ago. Now we use the B6 oil filter stud which is short enough to not require a spacer.

I prefer to leave it in for any car driven on the street - it does a good job of bringing the oil up to temp more quickly, and with the cooler in place, the oil rarely runs more than 20*F higher than the coolant temp, so it's not putting much heat back into the cooling system at operating temp.

For track cars, you can delete with the B6 filter stud.

I used a glowshift sandwich plate + setrab plate on my car. I removed the stud and simply cut it at the right lenght. Simple!

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1450897100



Just with the sandwich plate.

This needs to happen

Wait wasnt there an issue with the fittings on the mocal plate clearing the block if you used the 1.6 nipple?

IIRC there's one orientation it fits in, but it was pretty inconvenient for the way I wanted to route my cooler lines.

--Ian

No shit. I've been sitting here waiting for someone to tell me where to send a check.

I'll just leave this right here:

Oil cooler duct kit with mounting brackets

1. EO2k
2. Psyber_0ptix
3.

In the event you are looking for the shorter B6 oil filter stud, Mazda's PN is B630-10-319. They call it a "Joint".

I'd like to put out a call for data. Ideally, someone will be able to measure oil temps pre and post cooler. But, this requires two gauges. Failing that, any data on post-cooler oil temps (before re-entering the engine) would be good. The goal here is to get a feel for exactly what kind of delta-t we are seeing through an oil cooler in our cars.

Please include
a) usage conditions (track, autocross, texas mile, etc)
b) ambient temps
c) oil temp(s). If only post-cooler oil is being measured, please include an estimate of oil temps pre-cooler for that car under similar conditions, if known.
d) oil cooler in question, and how it is ducted (or plumbed, if oil<->water)

When I get all my datalogging setup I'll do it. Wanna buy me an extra sensor and adapter :)

No bitch I gave you springs!

Very true, I'll try and figure out how to get a post cooler temp. I bet if I teed off the pressure sensor I could do it.

Would this work:

Pre cooler temp in sandwich plate underneath mocal plate.
Post cooler temp in pressure sender port?

By pressure sender port you are referring to the stock one? I don't have the miata oil flow path memorized, let me look around.

Edit:

Hmm, I don't know. According to this diagram, it looks to me like by the time the oil gets from the filter to the oil pressure port, it may have equalized to whatever the block temperature is at that point. Iron transfers heat good.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1455831007

Yes stock one. I believe that is filtered oil, and my cheapo sandwich plate is pre filter.

(Sandwich Plate Temp - Oil Pressure Port Temp) is the delta T we're after.

You could also do (Oil Pan Temp - Oil Pressure Port Temp), but I would expect that to be a lower number.

Yeah, I can do that one. Don't have a pan temp sensor. Need to get the right T adapter. I think andrew just released one.

Do you need to borrow a Sharpie?

I will do something like this on the oil system on a track day this summer and post it
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1455844843

Just realized that my temp sensor won't fit in an adapter because of how long the tip is. Need to figure out another way to do it.